Persecuation

[_truth dancer]

One other little thought to add to the mix...

One thing I find interesting is that pretty much always, those who are doing the "persecuting" do not think they are persecuting.

There seems to always be a justification/rationalization for it... (God said, They are the bad guys, etc. etc. etc.).

~dancer~

[_Selah]

I am so sorry guys that I haven't replied to your comments. I got incrediably busy yesterday, then had Bible study group, and finally of course LOST was on last night (woot woot - any LOST fans out there? ;) )

Anyways, I'll try to be more clear on what I'm stating. I'm stating as Christians we should turn to God and rejoice when we are persecuted, so that we may grow, learn, be humbled, experience joy when we are lifted up -- things like this. I still feel a righteous anger of how wrong it is when people are oppresed and treated badly - I still know it's wrong and want it to stop - but I hope that if they are Christians (not saying anything bad if they are not) they will turn to God and grow from the experience. If they are not Christians, I hope that they will turn to whatever they do rely upon for faith (themselves, a higher power, etc) and grow from the experience as well.

I'll give a personal example (because I'm not good a Google and finding these amazing stories to post sorry). Don't want to bore anyone so you can always scroll past this paragraph. But when I was 14 I became pregnant in this backwater Bible Belt town. I was treated pretty horribly by both my fellow Latter Day Saints and Mainstream christians alike. Indeed, they went to the principal and wanted me to leave the school because of my "sin". The kids bullied and persecuted me because I was a whore and everything of the like. Teachers would leave the ROOM so the kids could have their fun. It was horrible. My parents (devout LDS) thought I was deserving of this treatment and I was simply suffering the temporal consequences for my sins and let me suffer through it - I cried almost every day. I didn't turn to God. But I refused to become a victim either. By my Jr. year in highschool (I moved to Las Vegas shortly after delivering the baby) I became a spokesperson in my school for teen parents and tried to educate teens about the reality of being a teen parent. I became a guest speaker in health classes to tell kids about my experiences, became involved in the Campagien to Prevent Teen Pregnancy, became involved on my college campus and sorority when I went onto college - I was written about in the local newspaper. I was very outspoken and wanted to make a difference - I never wanted anyone to suffer the way I did, I wanted them to know - life is tough, don't be a victim. I rose from what I could have become (only 35% of teen parents graduate from highschool) and went onto college and tried to help my community. Today, I still have a huge heart and work with teen parents whenever possible (from clinics, to highschools, to online, to the campagien - whatever God leads me to). This is an example of GROWING and rejoicing in persecution. I didn't rejoice at the time - but looking back, I am so grateful for that persecution. I am so grateful that those people treated me that way. They toughened me up, made me into the person I am today. Gave me a heart for something I might not have had a heart for. I am grateful for them. I thank and forgive them.

This is what I mean. I hope that's more clear.

[_Selah]

Oh and yes I believe that REAL persecution is going on in foriegn countries (like China and Africa where people actually are killed for their beliefs) not here in America were *gasp* naughty and hurtful news articles are written :rollseyes:

[_truth dancer]

Hi Selah...

Thank you for sharing your personal story... you are a fabulous example of overcoming challenges!

I think there is a difference between appreciating the challenges in your life, noticing how you got through them, learing from the sorrows of life, etc. etc., and "rejoincing" that you are persecuted.

There is something about the idea of enjoying or celebrating persecution that doesn't set will with me. It, to my way of thinking, creates a very unhealthy idea that there is something good about being harmed, that being a victim is a great thing. And, similarly that there is value in persecuting others.

Holding onto the idea that there is goodness in victimizing others or being the victim just doesn't seem the best way to approach life.

At least from my perspective,

:-)

~dancer~

[_Who Knows]

(woot woot - any LOST fans out there? ;) )

Yes - bigtime. Although this season hasn't been as good as the previous 2. (although last night it started picking up pace finally).

So, is Juliet still working with the others? Is charlie going to die? Who is Jacob? Is Locke dead? So many questions, so few answers...

[_wenglund]

I am so sorry guys that I haven't replied to your comments. I got incrediably busy yesterday, then had Bible study group, and finally of course LOST was on last night (woot woot - any LOST fans out there? ;) )

Anyways, I'll try to be more clear on what I'm stating. I'm stating as Christians we should turn to God and rejoice when we are persecuted, so that we may grow, learn, be humbled, experience joy when we are lifted up -- things like this. I still feel a righteous anger of how wrong it is when people are oppresed and treated badly - I still know it's wrong and want it to stop - but I hope that if they are Christians (not saying anything bad if they are not) they will turn to God and grow from the experience. If they are not Christians, I hope that they will turn to whatever they do rely upon for faith (themselves, a higher power, etc) and grow from the experience as well.

I'll give a personal example (because I'm not good a Google and finding these amazing stories to post sorry). Don't want to bore anyone so you can always scroll past this paragraph. But when I was 14 I became pregnant in this backwater Bible Belt town. I was treated pretty horribly by both my fellow Latter Day Saints and Mainstream christians alike. Indeed, they went to the principal and wanted me to leave the school because of my "sin". The kids bullied and persecuted me because I was a whore and everything of the like. Teachers would leave the ROOM so the kids could have their fun. It was horrible. My parents (devout LDS) thought I was deserving of this treatment and I was simply suffering the temporal consequences for my sins and let me suffer through it - I cried almost every day. I didn't turn to God. But I refused to become a victim either. By my Jr. year in highschool (I moved to Las Vegas shortly after delivering the baby) I became a spokesperson in my school for teen parents and tried to educate teens about the reality of being a teen parent. I became a guest speaker in health classes to tell kids about my experiences, became involved in the Campagien to Prevent Teen Pregnancy, became involved on my college campus and sorority when I went onto college - I was written about in the local newspaper. I was very outspoken and wanted to make a difference - I never wanted anyone to suffer the way I did, I wanted them to know - life is tough, don't be a victim. I rose from what I could have become (only 35% of teen parents graduate from highschool) and went onto college and tried to help my community. Today, I still have a huge heart and work with teen parents whenever possible (from clinics, to highschools, to online, to the campagien - whatever God leads me to). This is an example of GROWING and rejoicing in persecution. I didn't rejoice at the time - but looking back, I am so grateful for that persecution. I am so grateful that those people treated me that way. They toughened me up, made me into the person I am today. Gave me a heart for something I might not have had a heart for. I am grateful for them. I thank and forgive them.

This is what I mean. I hope that's more clear.

I appreciate you sharing this personal story with us (I appreciate it far more than were you to have used a googled example). It is quite inspiring on a number of levels.

To me, it is good to have gratitude for life challenges as well as life blessing. After all, strength can come through resistance.

And, I love how you, instead of constantly looking backwards or wallowing in self-pity and resentment or faulting others for your difficulties, you took back control of your life and have continued to look forward using history merely as a means of better charting your future and assisting other in not making the same mistake you did in your youth. That is wonderful, and I honor your courage and healthy perspective.

Thanks, -Wade Englund-

[_Selah]

I appreciate you sharing this personal story with us (I appreciate it far more than were you to have used a googled example). It is quite inspiring on a number of levels.

To me, it is good to have gratitude for life challenges as well as life blessing. After all, strength can come through resistance.

And, I love how you, instead of constantly looking backwards or wallowing in self-pity and resentment or faulting others for your difficulties, you took back control of your life and have continued to look forward using history merely as a means of better charting your future and assisting other in not making the same mistake you did in your youth. That is wonderful, and I honor your courage and healthy perspective.

Thanks, -Wade Englund-

Thanks Wade :)

I only share my story to try to clarify what I meant by rejoicing in persecution. I don't mean to be like, "Yeah yeah persecute me!! Do it do it!" But when it happens to us, we can be wallow in it or we can find joy in it and think to ourselves, "I will not be a victim. I will learn and grow from this. I will draw closer to God from this <-- (If that person is a Christian). I will become stronger from this. I will appreciate the joy of good times that follow this more."

That's all. :)

[_wenglund]

I appreciate you sharing this personal story with us (I appreciate it far more than were you to have used a googled example). It is quite inspiring on a number of levels.

To me, it is good to have gratitude for life challenges as well as life blessing. After all, strength can come through resistance.

And, I love how you, instead of constantly looking backwards or wallowing in self-pity and resentment or faulting others for your difficulties, you took back control of your life and have continued to look forward using history merely as a means of better charting your future and assisting other in not making the same mistake you did in your youth. That is wonderful, and I honor your courage and healthy perspective.

Thanks, -Wade Englund-

Thanks Wade :)

I only share my story to try to clarify what I meant by rejoicing in persecution. I don't mean to be like, "Yeah yeah persecute me!! Do it do it!" But when it happens to us, we can be wallow in it or we can find joy in it and think to ourselves, "I will not be a victim. I will learn and grow from this. I will draw closer to God from this <-- (If that person is a Christian). I will become stronger from this. I will appreciate the joy of good times that follow this more."

That's all. :)

That's how I interpreted what you had said--which again speaks well of you.

Thanks, -Wade Englund-

[_dartagnan]

Christ said his followers would be hated and persecuted for his sake.

Thus, Christians of all stripes tend to view their "persecution" as evidence of their discipleship towards Christ. If they aren't really being persecuted, they will try to blow up criticism to make themselves appear the victim. LDS are no exception, as is evidenced on the MAD board. Virtually anyone who offers a criticism is immediately called an "attacker." There are attackers to be sure, but in most cases it seems it is the LDS side that insists on painting this bleak picture of humble theist verses "vapid, venomous" anti-Mormon. Every critic of the Church has been called an anti-Mormon or worse, at some point. This is because LDS need to feel persecuted because they think it says somet6hing about the truthfulness of the Church. This isn't new. I've heard this for 20 years now.

[_Lucretia MacEvil]

Selah, thanks for the story, it's all good. I'm all in favor of making the best of a bad situation, learning from experience, etc., but still don't like the idea of "glorifying persecution." Maybe it's just semantical, and if so it's not worth pursuing. Maybe I'll have a cogent thought on it later.