What is the Curse of Cain?

[_The Nehor]

The Curse of Caine is to become Kindred, Vampires and feed on the blood of the Children of Seth for all time as wolves among the sheep hiding until the Day of Gehenna when Caine and the antedileuvian vampire elders arise to consume all their progeny and reign over an Empire of Blood for a full Millenium before Caine ascends to his dark throne and judges all his childer.

I played that game way too much as a kid :)

[_Mercury]

THe curse of cain is a racist invention made to deride a whole race under the auspices of religion.

[_Mercury]

The Curse of Caine is to become Kindred, Vampires and feed on the blood of the Children of Seth for all time as wolves among the sheep hiding until the Day of Gehenna when Caine and the antedileuvian vampire elders arise to consume all their progeny and reign over an Empire of Blood for a full Millenium before Caine ascends to his dark throne and judges all his childer.

I played that game way too much as a kid :)

Haha!

Someone plays White Wolf games

[_Sethbag]

Gazelam, you talk as if you believe that Noah's children are in fact the ancestors of every single human being alive today. You talk as if you believe that the Flood happened as depicted in Genesis, as a global, worldwide catastrophic flood that wiped out everyone but those on the Ark.

The Flood didn't happen that way, whether or not the story in Genesis is based on an actual, local flood or not. The human race today is not all descended from a guy named Noah and his family from a few thousand years ago. Look at the evidence, man! It's there, it's real, and it utterly contradicts these beliefs of yours. Why do you kick against the pricks of actual, physical evidence to hold onto what is no more than mythology?

[_huckelberry]

loquatious lurker, " nonsense of the Old Testament"

What is a bit ironic is that in that Old Testament all sorts of people are linked to Ham and that if one actually looks at the list one finds it linkable to European people. I am clueless as to how it would be linked to the west Aftrican people upon it was applied.

Well we all know exactly how it was linked. Justification for slavery in first half of 19th century America.

I doubt the story has much literal foundation but it even so is not the narrow racist matter that 19th century Americans made of it.

[_moksha]

Kimberly, here is a much better understanding of the Curse of Caine: The Shaolin monk, Kwai Chang Caine, in a fit of anger, killed the Chinese Emperor's nephew in revenge for the murder of his beloved master. Caine was forced to flee to America to escape execution. As part of his curse, he had to forever elude detection and capture, while at the same time searching the old west for his elusive half-brother.

Both versions of this curse are highly fictionalized, but the one I presented has (I believe) a more compelling human interest.

Another variation of this is Truth Dancer's view that Cain and Abel represented the Agrarian and Hunter Gatherer parts of our past.

[_Coggins7]

Actually the curse of Cain was that the descendents of Cain would be denied free, universal health care, free, federally funded access to family planning services, free or reduced school lunch, A guaranteed annual income, racial preference in government hiring and college admission, low interest loans at below market rates, a chicken in every pot, a condom in every pocket, RU-486 in every purse, Nacho cheese for all, and all of their children would be left behind.

[_Coggins7]

This bit of genocidal racism is not unique to Mormons. It was a common belief in the 19th century that lighter = more civilized; both Indian ways and skintones would fade before the superior values of Anglo-American culture. Indeed, this change could be visibly effected by introducing them to christianity via "indian schools."

Oh, this bit of PC fairy telling is just to rich to pass by. "Genocidal racism"? This use of violently colorful terms normally used to describe physical elimination of a people by force to describe a kind of forced cultural assimilation over long periods of time is one of the Left's standard mutations of language from descriptions of actually things to a tool of Kulturkampf.

Not that the treatment of Amerindians by whites wasn't' bad. Its just that the racism of whites toward Indians was not in any way unique, either in the world generally or to the Indians themselves, many of whom thought in much the same way about Indians outside their own tribe or nation and who was no stranger to actual, physical genocide among his own, and had a multi-thousand year history of ceaseless warfare and conquest to prove it.

When will we grow up as a people and get over this.

And when will we start taking the study of serious history to heart such that our assessment of such things can be contextualized against a larger background of human history. The politically correct statutory rape of history and serious historical thought such as this can be avoided if we can find the will.

(It should be noted in any event that if Indians were to really begin intermarrying with whites and other groups (such as Japenese), skin tones would change. This has to be the case. But, one should ask, what is wrong with this? This kind of thing has been going on since the dawn of human history. Show me any "pure blooded" anything at this jucture in human history?)

[_Mercury]

Gazelam, you talk as if you believe that Noah's children are in fact the ancestors of every single human being alive today. You talk as if you believe that the Flood happened as depicted in Genesis, as a global, worldwide catastrophic flood that wiped out everyone but those on the Ark.

The Flood didn't happen that way, whether or not the story in Genesis is based on an actual, local flood or not. The human race today is not all descended from a guy named Noah and his family from a few thousand years ago. Look at the evidence, man! It's there, it's real, and it utterly contradicts these beliefs of yours. Why do you kick against the pricks of actual, physical evidence to hold onto what is no more than mythology?

Gaz and others don't let a big thing like evidence stand in the way of their life justifications...err, faith.

[_Loquacious Lurker]

This bit of genocidal racism is not unique to Mormons. It was a common belief in the 19th century that lighter = more civilized;

And this prejudice was quickly and probably unconsciously incorporated into Joseph's text of the Book of Mormon.

Oh, this bit of PC fairy telling is just to rich to pass by. "Genocidal racism"?

Not sure whose comments you are addressing here, but as I did a cursory glance of the topic and noticed I was the only one to invoke the term "genocide", perhaps you are vaguely addressing mine. Then again, maybe not. Maybe you are having a conversation with yourself, in which case, I should leave the two of you alone.

This use of violently colorful terms normally used to describe physical elimination of a people by force to describe a kind of forced cultural assimilation over long periods of time is one of the Left's standard mutations of language from descriptions of actually things to a tool of Kulturkampf.

Not sure who has committed the transgression you've just described, on this thread. When I used the term "genocide", I meant the actual, wanton, deliberate annihilation of another race. Sadly, time and again, condoned by God, as even a brief glance through the Old Testament will prove, and still more often, justified by followers of a God, using scriptural references.

Now, I speak German, and yet I am not quite sure to what you are referring when you invoke the term "Kulturkampf". Perhaps you could clarify. I do not need a definition, I need a context for its usage. I am a little mystified as to what you are referring to in your statement.

Not that the treatment of Amerindians by whites wasn't' bad. Its just that the racism of whites toward Indians was not in any way unique, either in the world generally or to the Indians themselves, many of whom thought in much the same way about Indians outside their own tribe or nation and who was no stranger to actual, physical genocide among his own, and had a multi-thousand year history of ceaseless warfare and conquest to prove it.

Point being...? The wars that Indians waged among themselves in no way mirrored the savage and brutish acts that they later learned from European settlers. Typically, they raided other tribes for the purpose of capturing slaves for their tribe. They did not murder and destroy in their "wars". The journals of both John Winthrop and William Bradford are most enlightening in this regard. The natives of this continent were quite taken aback by the White method warfare.

When will we grow up as a people and get over this.

Get over this? My, it is so tiresome that nearly ninety percent of Natives along the Eastern seaboard were wiped out as a result of Pilgrim settlers, with their smallpox, and their syphilis, and their their pitting tribe against tribe. (Reference, Pequot wars). That, of course, in no way takes into account the horrific annihilation of the Indian tribes in the south or west of this continent, although sadly, the stories are much the same. Frankly, I don't want to get over it, because I fear that it will turn me into something inhuman. I would actually rather mourn for what has been lost, and the human cost that was so high.

And when will we start taking the study of serious history to heart such that our assessment of such things can be contextualized against a larger background of human history.

"The Israelites killed millions too! So did the Romans! And what about Ghengis Khan? So it's okay!"

The politically correct statutory rape of history and serious historical thought such as this can be avoided if we can find the will.

Thanks, I think I'll just plug along reading primary sources where possible and forming my own conclusions, if the alternative is to "just get over" something.

(It should be noted in any event that if Indians were to really begin intermarrying with whites and other groups (such as Japenese), skin tones would change.

Yes, but they would not become white and delightsome, contrary to Mormon thought. Instead, we humans will all look like Halle Berry one day. Not a bad prospect for our species.

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