Palin's Speech: What do you think?

[_EAllusion]

And I can't think of a single country singer who is a former or even a current street gangster. Most of them do the cowboy/cowgirl thing. Love their family, God, country, hunting, living for themselves, etc.

Heh. And alcoholism, xenophobia, misogyny, breaking the law, etc. And trucks. Don't forget trucks.

By the way, I noticed that your example of Jay-Z's illteracy was him saying "Just be thyselfs." It occurs to me that Sarah Palin, of all people, has an entire schtick built on using colloquialisms and regional vernacular to seem everymanish. She isn't speaking grammer-school standard english with her "you betchas" and so forth. She's speaking something close to an exagerrated form of U-per, like you see in the movie Fargo. Yet, you're not here complaining about what a tremendous illterate she is or how she is encouraging lack of education in others. Yet when it comes to african american colloquialisms and vernacular, that most certainly is your reaction. Why is that?

[_EAllusion]

So I thought I about my point and decided to see if anyone else had made it. Did they? You betcha.

Meanwhile, it is the right who has been identified with a rear-guard action to defend an America where people speak and reason properly, where language doesn't devolve into the lowest common denominator, where phrases born in rap culture, like "shout out" don't find their way into a vice-presidential debate.

So let's play a thought game. Imagine if a folksy, inexperienced black woman was nominated to be vice president on the Democratic ticket. And imagine that instead of coming from Alaska she came from Alabama, and instead of dropping white aw-shucksisms like "Doggone" and "You betcha" into her conversation, she used the equivalent black vernacular.

Imagine, as well, if her sentences didn't come close to parsing, if they were wickedly ungrammatical -- no, anti-grammatical -- clouds of disconnected thoughts and sound bites. The right would rise up in indignation and disgust, and the most vitriolic, the Rush Limbaughs, the Michael Savages, would decry the presence of Ebonics on the national stage.

Were she black, Sarah Palin's performance would have been skewered by the right as undignified and demeaning to the office she seeks. But because she is a culture warrior in heels, she is hailed by the right as a breath of populist fresh air, and her use of what conservatives once sniffed at as "substandard English" is celebrated as a signifier of her glorious everydayness.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/adam-hanft/sarah-palin-and-the-new-w_b_132199.html

He kinda has a point when it comes to the Kevins of the world.

[_Tarski]

And I can't think of a single country singer who is a former or even a current street gangster. Most of them do the cowboy/cowgirl thing. Love their family, God, country, hunting, living for themselves, etc.

Heh. And alcoholism, xenophobia, misogyny, breaking the law, etc. And trucks. Don't forget trucks.

By the way, I noticed that your example of Jay-Z's illteracy was him saying "Just be thyselfs." It occurs to me that Sarah Palin, of all people, has an entire schtick built on using colloquialisms and regional vernacular to seem everymanish. She isn't speaking grammer-school standard english with her "you betchas" and so forth. She's speaking something close to an exagerrated form of U-per, like you see in the movie Fargo. Yet, you're not here complaining about what a tremendous illterate she is or how she is encouraging lack of education in others. Yet when it comes to african american colloquialisms and vernacular, that most certainly is your reaction. Why is that?

Oh if Kevin would only learn something about language (say by reading Steven Pinker's "The Language Instinct") he would realize how slanted against backs he is being. Who determines what is the right way to speak or write Kevin? God?

[_beastie]

He kinda has a point when it comes to the Kevins of the world.

And can you imagine if Obama had a 17 year old unmarried, pregnant daughter? And how about if the father of that baby had a myspace account in which he used the African-American version of "f--ckin' redneck"?

"I'm a f - - -in' redneck" who likes to snowboard and ride dirt bikes.

"But I live to play hockey. I like to go camping and hang out with the boys, do some fishing, shoot some s- - - and just f - - -in' chillin' I guess."

"Ya f - - - with me I'll kick [your] ass," he added.

Man, the Kevins of the world would be trumpeting it as a prima-facie example of the contemptible nature of the "black pop culture", and how it will destroy the fabric of decent society.

[_Yoda]

I get very frustrated with generalizations and stereotypes I see here when I have had the opportunity to personally work with black youth and black adults within the North Carolina State College system.

I teach in a unique classroom setting; I teach Computer Science courses within the Continuing Education department. I teach a variety of GED preparation courses, in addition to Computer Applications, Web Design, and Programming courses designed to specifically aid students in changing careers based on the layoffs occurring within the textile industry here.

Many times, I have both the child and their parent(s) for students!

More times than not, I am the only white face in the room.

Some of the stories I have heard from these students are truly heart-wrenching. The parents of these kids are not just sitting on their asses collecting welfare. Most of them are single mothers working two jobs to make ends meet (and attempting to gain an education, which is why they're in my class).

The fathers, on the other hand, in many cases, are playing "dirty pool" in trying to avoid paying child support. Sometimes, they actually try to take the kids away from the mother, just so they don't have to pay! They put together trumped up charges regarding the mother being unfit, and, even though most of the time, it's not true, there is an investigation, which drags things through the courts for months, all so Dad doesn't have to pay any support. With this kind of stress going on in the home, it's no wonder Mom can't help the kids with homework.

I think that because I am a teacher, and I have been so entrenched in helping my students on an individual basis, I have become much more leery about statistics over the years. There are real people behind the numbers, and all of their circumstances are truly different.

If I can be a positive influence in helping folks who have previously seen their lives as hopeless embark on a new career, and feel good about themselves, then I'm doing my part to help the problem.

I think we need more teachers who can see beyond the numbers, and really care about the person behind the number.

[_moksha]

Man, the Kevins of the world would be trumpeting it as a prima-facie example of the contemptible nature of the "black pop culture", and how it will destroy the fabric of decent society.

Yes, it will be nice when the election is over and he can go back to John Gee and Islam.

[_asbestosman]

Who determines what is the right way to speak or write Kevin? God?

My top two guesses would be either Oxford and the OED, or Dr. Shades and the grammar police.

[_beastie]

Thank you, liz, for your comments. I do want to add one thing:

The fathers, on the other hand, in many cases, are playing "dirty pool" in trying to avoid paying child support. Sometimes, they actually try to take the kids away from the mother, just so they don't have to pay! They put together trumped up charges regarding the mother being unfit, and, even though most of the time, it's not true, there is an investigation, which drags things through the courts for months, all so Dad doesn't have to pay any support. With this kind of stress going on in the home, it's no wonder Mom can't help the kids with homework.

I have seen this same phenomenon - however, I do want to point out that this happens across racial lines. It isn't something unique to the black culture. You didn't imply that it was, but I wanted to make sure readers didn't assume as much.

Again, I want to heavily emphasize that educational problems are directly correlated to socio-economic status. They are not correlated to race. Minority children from middle class homes have no more educational problems than white middle class children. This fact alone debunks the nonsense being peddled on this thread that the "black pop culture", ie, the "rap culture", is somehow the cause of these difficulties. That is why I brought up country music - these poor white children being immersed in the redneck culture have the same problems, educationally, as the poor black children being immersed in the rap culture. And yet the country music culture reflects the "american pie" culture the Kevins of the world admire. The problem isn't rap music, or "black pop culture". The educational difficulties poor children have cross cultural lines (rap versus country) and long predate the emergence of the rap culture.

The problem is poverty.

[_EAllusion]

Take it a step further Beastie. Imagine a job interview situation. One applicant has Sarah Palin's accent. Another has Jay-Z's. If someone describes Jay-Z's vernacular as a sign of illiteracy and Palin's as a sign of charming folksiness, how do you think that will impact how he or she will see those applicants?

[_antishock8]

The problem is poverty.

Uh. No.

The problem is how people react to poverty. And you're going to have a hard time convincing people, who don't have their heads completely up their own asses, that certain demographics, indeed, react to poverty differently than others. Unless, of course, you continue to make excuses for them, that they're being held back, kept down, discriminated against, etc...

The facts, do not lie. There are opportunities for ANYONE in this country to get out from underneath their own circumstances. But they have to do it. They have to care about themselves. You can't always shift the burden and the blame to others when the problems that are being addressed are cultural, and not economic.

Money isn't the problem. It's the mindset. And you're going to have a hard time changing the mindset by throwing more money at it.