The 1826 Glass Looking Trial

[_Simon Belmont]

Here you go, Rich.

Read up, become informed.

http://www.fairlds.org/FAIR_Conferences ... Smith.html

[_rich kelsey]

Here you go, Rich.

Read up, become informed.

http://www.fairlds.org/FAIR_Conferences ... Smith.html

Simon, I have read that page several times. I am very well informed about details and controversies surrounding the 1826 Trial. I wouldn’t even call it a Glass Looking Trial if it were not known by that description.

And, even if the bill were a forgery, there is too much evidence that Smith was brought before Judge Neely for glass looking. One of the anti-Mormon writings about the legal proceeding adds a detail that is not found in other records with the words, “wherefore the court finds the defendant guilty.” If it were a hearing, and I believe it was this would not be the case.

I have done my best to present a well informed/honest history of Smith’s life, and I touch on this trial in a few of my articles.

If you care to read my works perhaps you could let us know where I say something in my articles which leads you to think that I have not read up on it.

Please use quotations from my works:

http://richkelsey.org/STORY%204.htm

http://richkelsey.org/STORY%20PART%20TWO.htm

Rich

[_Simon Belmont]

What leads me to think that you have not read up on it is simply this: It is clear from your articles that you have an agenda that is hostile toward my faith.

[_rich kelsey]

What leads me to think that you have not read up on it is simply this: It is clear from your articles that you have an agenda that is hostile toward my faith.

Well,

I'll just cut and paste a small section of an article and you can show the board where I am in error:

Joseph Knight’s Recollection:

One of Joseph’s Smith’s most trusted and faithful-friends was a farmer named Joseph Knight.

Speaking of Joseph Knight, Smith said,

“[He] was among the number of the first to administer to my necessities, while I was laboring in the commencement of the bringing forth of the work of the Lord, and of laying the foundation of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints."

Smith had told Knight about events leading up to his obtaining the golden plates. Knight penned a hand written account of Smith’s story. This account was written sometime between 1833 and Knight’s death in 1847. This manuscript is now in the LDS Church’s archives.

In 1976 the work was published at the LDS/Mormon University (BYU) as part of “BYU Studies” by Dean Jessee, who, during his career was a leading expert on the early writings of Joseph Smith; Jessee worked as a historian at the Church’s Historical Department.

The wonderful thing about Knight’s account is that it is an early version of the story based upon what Smith told him in the late 1820s.

The only part of the work that is missing is the first page or two which no doubt included the bedroom dream or vision that led Smith to the plates.

What is left of the manuscript starts with the words

“From thence he went to the hill where he was informed the Record was…”

The details of the story are:

· Smith went to the hill, uncovered a plain box and took out the book.

· He laid the book down by his side and went to cover the area back up because he thought that there might be something else there.

· Although he had been told to take the book and go right away.

· After he covered up the place he turned around to take the book but it [the book] was gone.

· When he opened the box for the second time he saw that the book was back in the box.

· He took hold of the book, but this time he could not move it.

· Smith asked, “Why..?”

· He was answered, “You can’t have it now.”

· Smith asked, “When can I have it.”

· He was answered, “The 22nd day of next September if you bring the right person.”

· “Joseph says, ‘Who is the right person?’”

· “The answer was, ‘Your oldest Brother.’”

· “But before September came his oldest Brother died.”

Let’s pause for a moment. This story has all the markings of typical American folklore and/or folk magic associated with buried treasure and guardian spirits. It doesn’t help that the spirit told Smith to bring his oldest Brother (Alvin) the next year, promising Smith that if he brought Alvin he could have the plates next September 22nd. Surely God knew that Alvin would be dead by then!

· Smith didn’t know what to do. Next September 22nd he went there again, and, “the personage appeared and told him he could not have it now.” “But the 22nd day of September next he might have it if he brought the right person.”

· “Joseph says, ‘Who is the right person?’ the answer was, ‘You will know.’”

· “Then he [Joseph Smith] looked in his glass and found it was Emma Hale.”

The reference “he looked in his glass” was a reference to one of Smith’s seer stones. During the very years that Smith was waiting to obtain the golden plates he was selling his services[liii] as a “glass looker.” Toward the end of Knight’s account of Smith’s early history, Knight mentions a trial[Las Vegas] in which a “warrant” had been issued against Smith for “pretending to see underground.” Knight claimed that this trial* lasted “all day,” and then, the next day “until midnight.”


The story continues:

· Joseph was married to Emma Hale.

· A seer by the name of Samuel Lawrence “had been to the hill and knew about the things in the hill and was trying to obtain them.”

· Come the next 22nd day of September, Joseph borrowed Knight’s horse and carriage without his knowledge and early in the morning Knight got up and noticed that the horse and carriage were gone.

· When Joseph returned with the horse and carriage, he exclaimed, “It is ten times better than expected… Then he went on to tell the length and width and thickness of the plates’ and said, ‘they appear to be Gold…' But he seemed to think more of the glasses… [Joseph Smith said] ‘I can see anything; they are Marvelus (sic).’”

If people were to look into the environmental settings the young Joseph Smith was raised in, they might get a better understanding of the folklore and/or folk magic which Smith based his stories upon. Knight’s account contains many of the same details as other early versions of the story; it is sugarcoated to some extent, but one can still get a taste of the bitter pill that lies underneath.

(An Incredible Story Part II — Joseph Smith's First Vision - Rich Kelsey)

http://richkelsey.org/STORY%20PART%20TWO.htm

[_Simon Belmont]

Sources, Rich?

[_rich kelsey]

Sources, Rich?

I removed the endnotes from the text to make the work easier to read on this board. If you go to the article the endnotes are clickable and they are in place.

Yet, I will also include them here:

[xlviii] (Joseph Knight’s Recollection of Early Mormon History, LDS publication, BYU Studies, 1976, by Dean Jessee)

[xlix] (Joseph Smith, Jr., History of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, ed. B. H. Roberts, 7 vols., 2nd ed. Revelation, Salt Lake City: Deseret Book, 1964, 4:124–125).

[l] “It appears from all the circumstances that the Prophet took Josiah Stoal and Joseph Knight into his confidence, as to the time when he was to receive the plates of the Book of Mormon, and hence their presence at the Smith residence on the morning of the 22nd of September, 1827. Messrs. Knight and Stoal had business at Rochester, New York, and in leaving their home in Chenango county, so timed their journey that they arrived at the Smith residence on the 20th of September and remained there for a number of days; and were not only present when Joseph Smith obtained the records, but were there when he brought them to the house a day or two later.” (New Witnesses for God, B. H. Roberts, p.354)

[li] "Joseph Smith Jr. never repudiated the stones or denied their power to find treasure."(Rough Stone Rolling - 2006, Richard L. Bushman, p. 51)

[lii] “…In the month of October, 1825, I hired with an old gentleman by the name of Josiah Stoal, who lived in Chenango county, State of New York. He had heard something of a silver mine having been opened by the Spaniards in Harmony, Susquehanna county, State of Pennsylvania; and had, previous to my hiring to him, been digging, in order, if possible, to discover the mine. After I went to live with him, he took me, with the rest of his hands, to dig for the silver mine, at which I continued to work for nearly a month, without success in our undertaking, and finally I prevailed with the old gentleman to cease digging after it. Hence arose the very prevalent story of my having been a money-digger. ( Joseph Smith, History of the Church, Vol. 1, Chapter 1:56)

[liii] “Joe used to be usually their guide, putting into a hat a peculiar stone he had, through which he looked to decide where they should begin to dig." (Gleanings by the Way, 1842, p. 225)

[liv] See existing court document:

Same [meaning People]
vs
Joseph Smith
the Glass Looker
March 20, 1826

[Las Vegas] ACCOUNT OF 1826 and 1830 TRIALS:

“Messrs. Editors -- In the sixth number of your paper I saw a notice of a sect of people called Mormonites; and thinking that a fuller history of their founder, Joseph Smith, jr., might be interesting to community, and particularly to your correspondent in Ohio, where, perhaps, the truth concerning him may be hard to come at, I will take the trouble to make a few remarks on the character of that infamous imposter. For several years preceding the appearance of his book, he was about the country in the character of a glass-looker: pretending, by means of a certain stone, or glass, which he put in a hat, to be able to discover lost goods, hidden treasures, mines of gold and silver, &c. Although he constantly failed in his pretensions, still he had his dupes who put implicit confidence in all his words. In this town, a wealthy farmer, named Josiah Stowell, together with others, spent large sums of money in digging for hidden money, which this Smith pretended he could see, and told them where to dig; but they never found their treasure. At length the public, becoming wearied with the base imposition which he was palming upon the credulity of the ignorant, for the purpose of sponging his living from their earnings, had him arrested as a disorderly person, tried and condemned before a court of Justice. But considering his youth, (he being then a minor,) and thinking he might reform his conduct, he was designedly allowed to escape. This was four or five years ago. From this time he absented himself from this place, returning only privately, and holding clandestine intercourse with his credulous dupes, for two or three years.

It was during this time, and probably by the help of others more skilled in the ways of iniquity than himself, that he formed the blasphemous design of forging a new revelation, which, backed by the terrors of an endless hell, and the testimony of base unprincipled men, he hoped would frighten the ignorant, and open a field of speculation for the vicious, so that he might secure to himself the scandalous honor of being the founder of a new sect, which might rival, perhaps, the Wilkinsonians, or the French Prophets of the 17th century.

During the past Summer he was frequently in this vicinity, and others of baser sort, as Cowdry, Whitmer, etc., holding meetings, and proselyting a few weak and silly women, and still more silly men, whose minds are shrouded in a mist of ignorance which no ray can penetrate, and whose credulity the utmost absurdity cannot equal.

In order to check the progress of delusion, and open the eyes and understandings of those who blindly followed him, and unmask the turpitude and villainy of those who knowingly abetted him in his infamous designs; he was again arraigned before a bar of Justice, during last Summer, to answer to a charge of misdemeanor. This trial led to an investigation of his character and conduct, which clearly evinced to the unprejudiced, whence the spirit came which dictated his inspirations. During the trial it was shown that the Book of Mormon was brought to light by the same magic power by which he pretended to tell fortunes, discover hidden treasures, &c. Oliver Cowdery, one of the three witnesses to the book, testified under oath, that said Smith found with the plates, from which he translated his book, two transparent stones, resembling glass, set in silver bows. That by looking through these, he was able to read in English, the reformed Egyptian characters, which were engraved on the plates.

So much for the gift and power of God, by which Smith says he translated his book.

Two transparent stones, undoubtedly of the same properties, and the gift of the same spirit as the one in which he looked to find his neighbor's goods. It is reported, and probably true, that he commenced his juggling by stealing and hiding property belonging to his neighbors, and when inquiry was made, he would look in his stone, (his gift and power) and tell where it was. Josiah Stowell, a Mormonite, being sworn, testified that he positively knew that said Smith never had lied to, or deceived him, and did not believe he ever tried to deceive any body else. The following questions were then asked him, to which he made the replies annexed.

Did Smith ever tell you there was money hid in a certain glass which he mentioned? Yes. Did he tell you, you could find it by digging? Yes. Did you dig? Yes. Did you find any money? No. Did he not lie to you then, and deceive you? No! the money was there, but we did not get quite to it! How do you know it was there? Smith said it was! Addison Austin was next called upon, who testified, that at the very same time that Stowell was digging for money, he, Austin, was in company with said Smith alone, and asked him to tell him honestly whether he could see this money or not. Smith hesitated some time, but finally replied, "to be candid, between you and me, I cannot, any more than you or any body else; but any way to get a living." Here, then, we have his own confession, that he was a vile, dishonest impostor. As regards the testimony of Josiah Stowell, it needs no comment. He swears positively that Smith did not lie to him. So much for a Mormon witness. Paramount to this, in truth and consistency, was the testimony of Joseph Knight, another Mormonite. Newell Knight, son of the former, and also a Mormonite, testified, under oath, that he positively had a devil cast out of himself by the instrumentality of Joseph Smith, jr., and that he saw the devil after it was out, but could not tell how it looked!

Those who have joined them in this place, are, without exception, children who are frightened into the measure, or ignorant adults, whose love for the marvellous is equalled by nothing but their entire devotedness to the will of their leader; with a few who are as destitute of virtue and moral honesty, as they are of truth and consistency. As for his book, it is only the counterpart of his money-digging plan. Fearing the penalty of the law, and wishing still to amuse his followers, he fled for safety to the sanctuary of pretended religion. A. W. B. S. Bainbridge, Chen., co., March, 1831.” (EVANGELICAL MAGAZINE AND GOSPEL ADVOCATE, Vol II Utica, NY. April 9. 1831 No. 15)

Note: The "A. W. B." who signed this letter was Abraham W. Benton of South Bainbridge, Afton twp., Chenango Co., New York. Joseph Smith spoke of a “young man named Benton …who swore out the first warrant against me” (History of the Church Vol. 1, Chapter 10)

[lvi] State of New York v. Joseph Smith:

“Warrant issued upon written complaint upon oath of Peter G. Bridgeman, who informed that one Joseph Smith of Bainbridge was a disorderly person and an impostor.

Prisoner brought before Court March 20, 1826. Prisoner examined: says that he came from the town of Palmyra, and had been at the house of Josiah Stowel in Bainbridge most of time since; had small part of time been employed in looking for mines, but the major part had been employed by said Stowel on his farm, and going to school. That he had a certain stone which he had occasionally looked at to determine where hidden treasures in the bowels of the earth were; that he professed to tell in this manner where gold mines were a distance under ground, and had looked for Mr. Stowel several times, and had informed him where he could find these treasures, and Mr. Stowel had been engaged in digging for them. That at Palmyra he pretended to tell by looking at this stone where coined money was buried in Pennsylvania, and while at Palmyra had frequently ascertained in that way where lost property was of various kinds; that he had occasionally been in the habit of looking through this stone to find lost property for three years, but of late had pretty much given it up on account of its injuring his health, especially his eyes, making them sore; that he did not solicit business of this kind, and had always rather declined having anything to do with this business… “ “Costs: Warrant, 19c. Complaint upon oath, 25 1/2c. Seven witnesses, 87 1/2c. Recognisances, 25c. Mittimus, 19c. Recognisances of witnesses, 75c. Subpoena, 18c. - $2.68.”

Oliver Cowdery wrote, “while Joseph Smith was in southern New York, some very officious person complained of him as a disorderly person and brought him before the authorities of the county…” (Messenger and Advocate in 1835)

[lvii] “But along toards fall Joseph and Oliver Cowdray and David Whitmore [Whitmer] and John Whitmore Came from Harmonyin Pennsylvany to my house on some Buisness. And some of the Vagabonds found theyware there and they made a Catspaw of a young fellow By the name of Docter Bentonin Chenengo County to sware out a warrent against Joseph for as they said pertending to see under ground. A little Clause they found in the york Laws against such things.The oficer Came to my house near knite [night] and took him. I harnesed my horses and we all went up to the villige But it was so late they Could not try him that nite andit was put of[f] till morning. I asked Joseph if [he] wanted Counsell he said he thot he should. I went that nite and saw Mr James Davison [Davidson] a man I was acquainted with. The next morning the gatherd a multitude of people that ware against him. Mr Davison said it looked like a squaley [squally] Day; he thot we had Better have John Read [Reid]a prety good speaker near by. I told him we would, so I imployed themBoth. So after a trial all Day jest at nite he was Dismissed. Then there was another oficer was Ridy [ready] and took him on the same Case Down to Broom County Below forth with. I hired Boath these Lawyers and took them Down home with me that nite. The next Day it Continued all Day till midnite. But they Could find no thing against him therefore he was Dismist., Joseph Smith’s account of this trial is found in HC 1:88–96” (Joseph Knight’s Recollection Joseph Smith’s Early History).

[lviii] he put forth his hand <and> took them up <but> when he lifted them from their place the thought flashed across his mind that there might be something more in the box that might would be a benefit to him in a pecuniary point of view in the excitement of the moment he laid the record down... The angel appeared to him and told him that he had not done as he was commanded in that he laid down the record… Joseph was then permited to open raise the stone again and there he beheld the plates the same as before he reached forth his hand to take them but was hurled back (First draft of Lucy Smith's History, LDS Church Archives/Early Mormon Documents, Vol. 1, p. 289-290)

[lix] “Certain ceremonies were always connected with these money-digging operations. Midnight was the favorite hour, a full moon was helpful, and Good Friday was the best date. Joe would sometimes stand by, directing the digging with a wand. The utmost silence was necessary to success. More than once, when the digging proved a failure, Joe explained to his associates that, just as the deposit was about to be reached, some one, tempted by the devil, spoke, causing the wished-for riches to disappear. Such an explanation of his failures was by no means original with Smith, the serious results of an untimely spoken word having been long associated with divers magic performances. Joe even tried on his New York victims the Pennsylvania device of requiring the sacrifice of a black sheep to overcome the evil spirit that guarded the treasure. William Stafford opportunely owned such an animal, and, as he puts it, ‘to gratify my curiosity,’ he let the Smiths have it. But some new ‘mistake in the process’ again resulted in disappointment. ‘This, I believe,’ remarks the contributor of the sheep,’ is the only time they ever made money-digging a profitable business.’(The Smiths ate the sheep)

These money-seeking enterprises were continued from 1820 to 1827 (the year of the delivery to Smith of the golden plates). This period covers the years in which Joe, in his autobiography, confesses that he ‘displayed the corruption of human nature.’ He explains that his father's family were poor, and that they worked where they could find employment to their taste; ‘sometimes we were at home and sometimes abroad.’ Some of these trips took them to Pennsylvania, and the stories of Joe's ‘gazing’ accomplishment may have reached Sidney Rigdon, and brought about their first interview. Susquehanna County was more thinly settled than the region around Palmyra, and Joe found persons who were ready to credit him with various ‘gifts’; and stories are still current there of his professed ability to perform miracles, to pray the frost away from a cornfield, and the like.” (quotes from Lippincott's Magazine, August, 1880 / narrative from the book: Mormon Origin, William Alexander Linn, Hackensack, n. j., 1901).

[lx] In her History, Joseph’s mother: Lucy Mack Smith speaks of the family drawing “magic circles,” “abrac” — which is short for (abracadabra), and “sooth saying.” Magic circles are used to form a space of magical protection from the spirit the person is invoking: “Let not the reader suppose that because I shall pursue another topic for a season that we stopt (sic) our labor and went at trying to win the faculty of Abrac drawing Magic circles or sooth saying to the neglect of all kinds of business.” (Rough Rolling Stone, Bushman, 2006, p.p. 50-51; quoted from, Biographical Sketches of Joseph Smith the Prophet and His Progenitors for Many Generations. Smith, Lucy Mack, Liverpool, England: S. W. Richards. 1853)

[_Doctor CamNC4Me]

Hello Mr. Kelsey,

Notice your exhaustively referenced posts, and now notice Mr. Simon's glib replies. Unless you're using him for a dupe (not the first time this has been done on this board), you're wasting your time.

V/R
Dr. Cameron

[_rich kelsey]

Hello Mr. Kelsey,

Notice your exhaustively referenced posts, and now notice Mr. Simon's glib replies. Unless you're using him for a dupe (not the first time this has been done on this board), you're wasting your time.

V/R
Dr. Cameron

Hi, Dr. Cameron,

I am very familiar with the material that Simon asked me to read. I went through that page on FAIR and used it as a reference in my studies.

Here is s link to a study page I made on the trial: http://richkelsey.org/1826_trial_testimonies.htm

I initially put that together for my own use.

As far as “wasting my time?” Maybe the back and forth comments could stir interest in someone else. Many people are unaware of the details surrounding this trial.

I was talking to a few missionaries about a month ago and they had never heard of it, or Martin’s interview with Joel Tiffany, where Martin gives the reason they stopped digging by speaking of an “enchantment” with was also mentioned in the trial by another witness.

Thanks for the heads up. I’m not trying to use anyone as a dupe.

Rich

[_LDS truthseeker]

Here you go, Rich.

Read up, become informed.

http://www.fairlds.org/FAIR_Conferences ... Smith.html

From reading this, it looks like the FAIR boys believe in dowsing. I guess magical thinking is not dead. And before anyone starts defending dowsing, I ask you to go to the James Randi foundation and prove that dowsing works and they will give you $1M.

From FAIR:

Dowsing

Before we could build a home on a couple of acres in Utah, we needed to get the property Perk tested. We also knew about nearby springs and were a little concerned about the problems of underground water. We didn't want to have trouble with our planned basement. A friend at work indicated that he had good success dowsing for water. He explained that he could tell where there was water, and even how deep it was. So I invited him to our lot.

He used two steel rods bent like a long L. He held the rods loosely in his hands and walked across the property. They started to cross as he approached underground water. He said that the distance from when they started to cross, to where they fully crossed was the distance below the ground that you would find water. It appeared that we had about three streams that went under our property, but they were down about twelve feet, which was just a little further than we could dig with the backhoe.

Was he actually successful in finding water? I don't really know. But he reported several other times that his prediction was within a foot of where they found water. He gave me the rods and I found that they performed similarly for me.

Dowsing has been ridiculed and generally ignored by the scientific community; however Duane Chadwick at Utah State did an interesting study concerning it. He postulated that maybe dowsers were responding to the changes in the magnetic field introduced by water below the surface. So he compared the results of various individuals with high precision measurements using a magnetometer. There was a slight correlation, but his test didn't make any attempts to actually find people who professed ability for dowsing. Unfortunately he never published his data in a refereed journal, which he later regretted.

[_rich kelsey]

Here you go, Rich.

Read up, become informed.

http://www.fairlds.org/FAIR_Conferences ... Smith.html

From reading this, it looks like the FAIR boys believe in dowsing. I guess magical thinking is not dead...

Well, my questions might be:

• Would it be best to dig for the water at night?
• Was a dead Indian guarding the water? i.e., was an “enchantment” involved?
And,
• Did the water move further down when the diggers got near it?
Finally,
• Did the water-diggers spell out an agreement on how to split the water if they found it?

These are just some of the details surrounding the 1826 trial (as it were) because in the trial it was really about coined silver buried in a chest as well as the silver mine from whence it came.

Because of uncertain times the ancient Americans were going to return to get the money later. So they hid it up!

One thing we know for sure: the witnesses who were defending Smith, including his father, testified of these things!

http://richkelsey.org/1826_trial_testimonies.htm