Jefferson Tells the Truth

[_Albion]

There was a whole succession of high priests, one after the other, because their eventual death prevented them from continuing in office, according to Hebrews Chapter 7: 23. "But because Jesus lives forever, he has a permanent priesthood. Therefore he is able to save completely those who come to God through him, because he lives to intercede for them." Verses 24 and 25. I am not a Greek scholar but the 24th verse literally says in Greek: "But he continues forever, so his priesthood is UNTRANSFERABLE." Jesus is the only one who has it because no one else can receive it.

[_gdemetz]

Hogwash Albion. Jesus ORDAINED His apostles, and they ORDAINED others with this priesthood power. THERE IS NO SUCH DOCTRINE IN THE Bible AS THE PRIESTHOOD OF THE BELIEVERS! If you think there is then show me from the Bible! That was a man made doctrine that evolved from the Baptist church! Note the following quote from the "Baptist History and Heritage Society {as they attempted feebly to try and figure out what the Bible really meant, but instead just drifted (no pun intended) deeper into apostasy!}:

"Eventually, with considerable influence from Calvinistic sources, the majority of Baptist churches standardized and promoted ordination practices. The institutionalization of Baptist life intensified the regularization of ordination. The Philadelphia Baptist Association's 1742 confession, for example, harking back to the ordination article of Congregationalist's 1658 Savoy Declaration, describes Baptist ordination in a form familiar to us Baptists two and a half centuries later: Christ called {supposedly}, Spirit gifted pastors and deacons {supposedly} chosen by church vote {instead of God and the Bible teaches} and set apart by prayer and the laying on of hands {at least it was a form of Godliness, which not even that exists now!}.

"The similarity within Baptist ordination views should not be allowed to obscure the great variations played upon the theme {but, "if ye are not one, ye are not mine"}. Indeed, some Baptists have refused to play along at all, referring to ordination as a ritual rendered null and void by the PRIESTHOOD OF BELIEVERS. Charles Spurgeon, the most celebrated Baptist minister of the nineteenth century {lying in wait to deceive}, is popularly believed to have said {rejecting the council of God} that ordination consisted of "laying idle hands on empty heads" {which no doubt was, at least in part, the truth}.

[_Albion]

What is hogwash, gdemetz...that there was a succession of High Priests? If you disagree you need to check Jewish history. Perhaps the hoghwash you are referring to is the original Greek of the verse I used? If it's hogwash, respond with reasoning as to why. Your opinion is not evidence and is in reality the real hogwash. Additonally, I think a little research will show that the idea of the Priesthood of All Believers predates Baptists by a long shot. Try as far back as Martin Luther.

[_gdemetz]

Albion, I never stated that the false idea of the priesthood of all believers initiated with the Baptists. It doesn't really matter who started the false idea. The fact remains that the Baptists as well as many other groups are tossed to and fro by which ever way the winds of false doctrine happen to blow. The fact also remains that it is a false and non biblical doctrine, and I defy you to show me that it is scriptural! I have already given you many quotes from the Bible to show otherwise, of which you don't even bother to address, such as these: the "ordinations" I referred to in the Bible, why was it necessary Bishop Timothy to receive his by the laying on of hands if he automatically would receive it just by believing, and many others!! The fact is that the laying on of hands is the doctrine of Christ (see Hebrews 6:1-2)!

[_Albion]

Which part of "...a man made doctrine that evolved from the Baptish church..." is not saying it began with Baptists. The Priesthood of All Believers is not so much a doctrine as the accepted belief that all believers are priests since the Levitical Priesthood ended with Jesus taking on the higher PH which totally encompasses it and superceeds it.

But again, was there or was there not a succession of high priest in Israel...one at a time whose primary function was to enter the Holy of Holies on the Day of Atonement and make sacrificial offerings firstly on behalf of themselves and then on behalf of the people? There is only one answer to this question, gdemetz, borne out by Jewish history and practice as any rabbi or Jewish historian will tell you. If you can repute my contention of the correct interpretation of the verse from the original Greek may I please hear it. There is not a single mention of priesthood in Hebrew 6:2. I have no problem with the principle and practice of the laying on of hands but you are reading things into this verse that are simply not there.

[_Albion]

Which part of "...a man made doctrine that evolved from the Baptish church..." is not saying it began with Baptists. The Priesthood of All Believers is not so much a doctrine as the accepted belief that all believers are priests since the Levitical Priesthood ended with Jesus taking on the higher PH which totally encompasses it and superceeds it.

But again, was there or was there not a succession of high priest in Israel...one at a time whose primary function was to enter the Holy of Holies on the Day of Atonement and make sacrificial offerings firstly on behalf of themselves and then on behalf of the people? There is only one answer to this question, gdemetz, borne out by Jewish history and practice as any rabbi or Jewish historian will tell you. If you can repute my contention of the correct interpretation of the verse from the original Greek may I please hear it. There is not a single mention of priesthood in Hebrew 6:2. I have no problem with the principle and practice of the laying on of hands but you are reading things into this verse that are simply not there.

[_Albion]

PS: Pot and kettle come to mind when you accuse me of not answering your points. Mostly, as in the case of my previous post you answer in one of three ways....with insult, by changing the subject, or just throwing up a smoke screen to obscure your refusal to look at facts. There is no priesthood as you proclaim it after Jesus. He is the only high priest...one who has literally entered the Holy of Holies and sits at the right hand of the Father making intercesiuon on behalf of believers. Before Jesus, there was only one priesthood, the Levitcal Priesthood and a person had to be a direct descendant of Levi to hold it...this priesthood was swallowed up in the MP of which Jesus is the only person of sufficient perfect and holiness to hold. That, whether you agree or not, is the teaching of Hebrews and you can discover this for yourself if you will prayerfully read it without allowing the false teaching of false prophets to predetermine what you think it says.

Gdemetz, I am done on this topic of priesthood. I refuse to go around in circles with you any longer on this subject.

[_gdemetz]

I don't blame you for refusing. You look really bad so far! It is quite obvious that you don't know what you are talking about since I already defined ordinance (meaning priesthood endowment) for you, I already showed you from the Bible how men were ORDAINED, and ordained by the laying on of hands! Why were the hands laid on Bishop Timothy, or anyone for that matter if they automatically received it by making a silly profession of faith?!?

[_Albion]

No, gdemetz, you didn't do any of those things but if it makes you feel better to believe so, have at it. I'm just tired of the circles you draw in the sand on this topic.

[_gdemetz]

If I didn't then answer those points!