Is our understanding of The Trinity and Godhead correct?

[Guest]

I am not sure how viewing all religion as manmade means I have a dark view of humans. I don't believe humans are sinners. Don't believe they are destined for hell. Don't believe that they are born broken and flawed and in need of some kind of divine intervention in order to be good enough.

I have a very dark view of the god described in the Bible. Humans are much, much better than him.

Just me, you state you do not believe humans are sinners or flawed yet you indicate they are guilty of devising believing and pushing others to believe ugly and evil religion and images of god. I cannot imagine creatures without serious flaws would do such a thing to each other.

Unless you believe the Bible to have been written by bad supernatural spirits everything you see wrong in it is an indictment of humans because it reflects what they desire to believe in their heart.

I think you are missing the point, huckleberry. The fact that humans are fallible and sometimes act irrationally and even self-destructively does not lend the slightest bit of credence to the proposition that the Bible or any other holy scripture is necessarily anything more than a product of human minds (especially when honestly acknowledging how flawed the Bible itself is). Nor does it lend any credence to the proposition that there necessarily exists an omnipotent, all wise and loving supernatural entity without whose intervention humankind has no chance of ever becomlng better and less flawed.

I share just me's dark view of the god described in the Bible (especially as described in the Old Testament). Judging by some of the actions attributed to him therein he can be and has been as malicious and horrible as even the worst of the other monsters dreamed up by human imagination in our mythologies. Yes, the Bible itself is indeed an indictment of human fallibility, and it does indeed reflect what many humans desire to believe in their heart! Which of us has denied that? Yet, it somehow manages to reflect, at times, some of the noblest aspirations and hopes of humankind, and has inspired some of the most admirable achievements in literature, arts and altruism, as well as some of the worst bigotry and atrocities, depending on what one chooses to take from reading it.

I would agree that no one (especially in Western society) can justifiably regard themselves as adequately educated and cognizant of their own culture and its origins without at least some acquaintance with the contents of the Bible and its contributions to that culture.

[_SteelHead]

I think we scared Thorwald away.

[_Gunnar]

I think we scared Thorwald away.

I hope he managed to gain some insight as to just how nonsensical some of his "Divinely inspired" claims really are before leaving. I doubt it, though.

[_huckelberry]

Unless you believe the Bible to have been written by bad supernatural spirits everything you see wrong in it is an indictment of humans because it reflects what they desire to believe in their heart.

I think you are missing the point, huckleberry. The fact that humans are fallible and sometimes act irrationally and even self-destructively does not lend the slightest bit of credence to the proposition that the Bible or any other holy scripture is necessarily anything more than a product of human minds (especially when honestly acknowledging how flawed the Bible itself is). Nor does it lend any credence to the proposition that there necessarily exists an omnipotent, all wise and loving supernatural entity without whose intervention humankind has no chance of ever becomlng better and less flawed.

I share just me's dark view of the god described in the Bible (especially as described in the Old Testament). Judging by some of the actions attributed to him therein he can be and has been as malicious and horrible as even the worst of the other monsters dreamed up by human imagination in our mythologies. Yes, the Bible itself is indeed an indictment of human fallibility, and it does indeed reflect what many humans desire to believe in their heart! Which of us has denied that? Yet, it somehow manages to reflect, at times, some of the noblest aspirations and hopes of humankind, and has inspired some of the most admirable achievements in literature, arts and altruism, as well as some of the worst bigotry and atrocities, depending on what one chooses to take from reading it.

I would agree that no one (especially in Western society) can justifiably regard themselves as adequately educated and cognizant of their own culture and its origins without at least some acquaintance with the contents of the Bible and its contributions to that culture.

Gunnar, It is possible I am missing the point. I posted to try and draw a clarification. Beyond that uncertain first sentence I could find no sentence in your post that I would disagree with.

[_SteelHead]

I think we scared Thorwald away.

I hope he managed to gain some insight as to just how nonsensical some of his "Divinely inspired" claims really are before leaving. I doubt it, though.

I'd reccomend a ct scan and a full psychological evaluation for him, but I am sure one or the other would ressult in hospital time of some sort.

[_Gunnar]

Gunnar, It is possible I am missing the point. I posted to try and draw a clarification. Beyond that uncertain first sentence I could find no sentence in your post that I would disagree with.

Thanks for that response, huckelberry! It seems that I may have misunderstood what you were really getting at. If so, it's not the first time I misinterpreted something someone else wrote, and probably won't be the last. My apologies!

For what it's worth, I have long found you to be one of the most level headed and charitable posters here, and greatly appreciate your inputs.

Cheers!

Gunnar

[_Bazooka]

I think we scared Thorwald away.

Nobody was interested in either buying his book or simply agreeing with everything he said.

[_Quasimodo]

I think we scared Thorwald away.

Nobody was interested in either buying his book or simply agreeing with everything he said.

It's a shame that he had to pay a vanity press to publish his opus. If he had found a legitimate publisher, he might not have had to make the rounds of religious discussion boards to sell his works.

After all, I think "Mein Kampf" was a bestseller in it's day.

[_LittleNipper]

"content to allow billions of human lives to be lost"

Just me , You have completely reversed the meaning of my comment. Perhaps you assume I am defending a fundamentalism which believes people are lost unless they get a b or better on the theology exam or must accept the correct religion. I was intending to step out side that sort of thing entirely in order to see the patterns of Gods help and concern reaching to all people.

I could have misunderstood you. Do you believe the Bible is completely of human creation and god had no hand in it?

I contend that if god had a hand in the creation of the Bible and expected it to be used as a means of bringing humans to salvation then he utterly and completely failed.

There are accounts of people being saved through reading the Bible. However, usually, a Christian comes along pointing such in that direction. God is out to achieve the "whosoever" will. "Whosoever" is a far cry from "everybody".

[_Gunnar]

Saved from what?