I HEREBY STEP DOWN FOR NOW

[canpakes]

This forum has 13 rules.

In a way, most of the rules section can be captured within one maxim:

“Act as you would if you were at a casual dinner party.”

There isn’t much that can’t be discussed in such a venue, provided it’s done with generally common sense behavior, and some semblance of respect for others and the setting.

But, hopping upon the dining table, smearing jello salad all over oneself, and flinging Swedish meatballs and sriracha sauce onto the crowd while shouting obscenities will likely result in being escorted to the door.

[Res Ipsa]

Mark, I know that's the common wisdom, but by now every troll in the world understands that it's a tactic being used against them. The response is often escalation after escalation until the members of the online community simply decide that trying to meaningfully participate just isn't worth the effort. The studies I've looked at indicate that the most effect methods of handling a troll are banning or deleting all their posts. (One can do both by simply deleting those accounts.) Of course, that has to be balanced here with the values of free speech. If you're talking about the kind of trolling that most folks here and everywhere do from time to time, I absolutely agree: stick '''em on ignore and they'll stop. But, if someone is trolling for the purpose of disrupting the community itself, ignoring doesn't provide much deterrence.

You got it. And - not unimportantly - the sight of a board with troll posts splurged all over it renders it unattractive to visitors who might otherwise stay and take part.

Remember - the stated aim of much of the trolling by Cultellus/Binger/AtlanticMike was to destroy the board as a retaliation for someone have told them they were sexists, racists, or just plain idiots. Which they often richly deserved.

They said so many different things that I’m not sure what they’re stated assumes were. And, although they posted at the same time, I’m not sure their objectives were the same other than creating disruption.

It occurred to me this morning that what I recall about Mike’s arrival here really represented when I first noticed him posting here. So I went back and read the first few threads he posted in. Sure enough, I didn’t notice Mike until he started trolling. Trying my best to read those threads without the benefit of hindsight, the genesis of the conflict between Mike and folks here is pretty clear. Unfortunately, he reacted with a mistake common on message boards: resorting to self-help to coerce other people to change their behavior. When the mod team came on board, he chose to continue despite the fact that mechanisms were in place to address the behavior he objected to. I think by then he was committed to running the people running the people he labeled “the Cabal” off the board even if that meant destroying it.

I’ve said at least a couple of times that Mike attacked the board from the beginning, That was inaccurate, in my opinion. That does not excuse or justify the choices he made or his conduct, especially after the mod team was in place. By that point, his desire to run the Cabal of the board had crowded out any desire to have substantive conversations on any subject,

[Markk]

LOL…Remember when I said I would show you, you are so predictable? You have no objectivity, you speak for your tribe as a “we or us”, and demand that yours and your tribes opinions are the only ones worthy. As Hor or Chap wrote, I can’t remember which, you are implying your tribe is the correct, and thus, dwell in your self righteousness as they wrote.

I speak to my first post since I have been back, you folks (the butt hurt ones going after Shades because you lose the narrative) are simply whining because you lost the narrative and simply put, “have run into a troll that is better than you trolls and nanny’s, and who is dishing it out better than you have done to others, like myself and MG. It is comical.

Markk, your comment doesn’t make much sense, because there’s no ‘narrative’ that you want to identify with within over 2000 posts composed almost entirely of obscenities and tantrums.

You really should poke around through a few of the 29 new pages (that’s over 700 new splits) in Spirit Prison that have been added since you dropped out of sight. Then, come on back and explain what ‘narrative’ they represent.

Nonsense in my view pakes. It is just one troll instead of many. If a conservative comes here and state a conservative point of view, they are instantly attacked…some aggressively, some passive aggressively. There are also nanny’s here, or at lease one nanny, that in in my opinion are more annoying than the troll, but like them can be laughed off or simply ignored.

The narrative in this instance is liberal dominance of the board. After all it is their religion cakes, and this forum is the church. AM has threatened the continuity of the forum and the as I wrote the narrative.

I get AM is a troll…but so is Kevin, schmo, Cam and others…either choose to converse with them or ignore them. You troll at times, just as I do…we all do.

Take care

[canpakes]

Markk, your comment doesn’t make much sense, because there’s no ‘narrative’ that you want to identify with within over 2000 posts composed almost entirely of obscenities and tantrums.

You really should poke around through a few of the 29 new pages (that’s over 700 new splits) in Spirit Prison that have been added since you dropped out of sight. Then, come on back and explain what ‘narrative’ they represent.

Nonsense in my view pakes. It is just one troll instead of many. If a conservative comes here and state a conservative point of view, they are instantly attacked…some aggressively, some passive aggressively. There are also nanny’s here, or at lease one nanny, that in in my opinion are more annoying than the troll, but like them can be laughed off or simply ignored.

The narrative in this instance is liberal dominance of the board. After all it is their religion cakes, and this forum is the church. AM has threatened the continuity of the forum and the as I wrote the narrative.

I get AM is a troll…but so is Kevin, schmo, Cam and others…either choose to converse with them or ignore them. You troll at times, just as I do…we all do.

Take care

I understand that you feel this way, as this is the same approach you took a few years back with your proclamation that the word ‘hate’ has the same meaning in all contexts, and - by extension - that there is no such thing as a ‘hate crime’, versus just ‘a crime’.

You will want to characterize a problem as having the same severity and solution, regardless of the context. I’ll always find that argument to be odd, especially given your profession, and the fact that any particular ‘problem’ that you run across in your work - as the same root thing but with varying context or intensity - does not always require or respond to the exact same type and level of ‘treatment’.

[Markk]

Then ignore it, he will get bored and move on eventually…trolls have to eat, quit feeding them. It is a choice, yours.

Mark, I know that's the common wisdom, but by now every troll in the world understands that it's a tactic being used against them. The response is often escalation after escalation until the members of the online community simply decide that trying to meaningfully participate just isn't worth the effort. The studies I've looked at indicate that the most effect methods of handling a troll are banning or deleting all their posts. (One can do both by simply deleting those accounts.) Of course, that has to be balanced here with the values of free speech. If you're talking about the kind of trolling that most folks here and everywhere do from time to time, I absolutely agree: stick ''em on ignore and they'll stop. But, if someone is trolling for the purpose of disrupting the community itself, ignoring doesn't provide much deterrence.

LOL…well, we certainly have a fundamentally difference of “being” on this, if that is the right word. I guess I am not emotionally attached to the board, I have a life beyond it. I would think if people take this crap that seriously then go ahead, kick Shades to the curb, disrespect him and his vision, and ban AM for life.

The board and many here helped me put Mormonism in a safe place…and I appreciate that…but this forum (SP) is much different than that, at least too me.

When I say ignore I don’t mean put them on ignore, I mean don’t give a crap about them or read their crap. AM sent be a dumb PM when I got here showing me he was truly a troll…he thought I was a confederate I guess…I just dumped the message and moved on. Dr. Cam after he spent three years on the Russian hoax, and after it fell apart he pretty much refused to discuss anything and just tried to meme me to death with gold fish…so what…I just shined it on unless I felt like responding, which was then on me.

[Markk]

Nonsense in my view pakes. It is just one troll instead of many. If a conservative comes here and state a conservative point of view, they are instantly attacked…some aggressively, some passive aggressively. There are also nanny’s here, or at lease one nanny, that in in my opinion are more annoying than the troll, but like them can be laughed off or simply ignored.

The narrative in this instance is liberal dominance of the board. After all it is their religion cakes, and this forum is the church. AM has threatened the continuity of the forum and the as I wrote the narrative.

I get AM is a troll…but so is Kevin, schmo, Cam and others…either choose to converse with them or ignore them. You troll at times, just as I do…we all do.

Take care

I understand that you feel this way, as this is the same approach you took a few years back with your proclamation that the word ‘hate’ has the same meaning in all contexts, and - by extension - that there is no such thing as a ‘hate crime’, versus just ‘a crime’.

You will want to characterize a problem as having the same severity and solution, regardless of the context. I’ll always find that argument to be odd, especially given your profession, and the fact that any particular ‘problem’ that you run across in your work - as the same root thing but with varying context or intensity - does not always require or respond to the exact same type and level of ‘treatment’.

I don’t remember that conversation , but I’ll take your word for it but I would have to see the context, I have a little deeper view than how you simplified it. I am confused what my profession has to do with it…elaborate please I am very curious?

But, just so I understand, are you saying that Trolling should be allowed, as long as it does not…______________________(fill in the blank?)

Thanks

[honorentheos]

Atlanticmike's posting was not comparable to other posters on this board. The creation of countless threads with no aim but to spam the board was disruptive in ways no other poster was engaging in at any point since ldsfaqs had to be put on queue. It's unfortunate that it went on a long as it did but I see why Shades had a difficult time deciding how to handle it. I think Shades is probably more sympathetic to Cultellus' and Atlanticmike's political views which seems to create this idea that their behavior was parallel to that of others on the board.

There are plenty of people on the board whose posting are 90% about other people that looks pretty close to trolling who aren't named Atlanticmike. And there are plenty of people who vote progressive/Democrat whose posting isn't typically much different from Atlanticmike's all-caps spam threads. Do these people engage in discussion if/when those topics get challenged? Yeah, most of the time and in their way. Which Atlanticmike didn't really do.

I have an idea, though. Post about ideas and topics and crap that isn't about other posters and board history because Jesus damned Christ.

[canpakes]

I don’t remember that conversation , but I’ll take your word for it but I would have to see the context, I have a little deeper view than how you simplified it. I am confused what my profession has to do with it…elaborate please I am very curious?

It’s trapped in the archived section of the board, so it’ll take some clever searching. I may take a look around for it, though. Even if we didn’t see eye to eye, it was a fun conversation.

But, just so I understand, are you saying that Trolling should be allowed, as long as it does not…______________________(fill in the blank?)

‘Violate the rules.’

As has been mentioned by others, ‘trolling’ - in and of itself - isn’t necessarily disallowed. It just needs to conform to the rule set. Sexual harassment, or repeated derailment, or crazy-arse repitition of hundreds of obscenities spread over dozens of posts within a single day, are examples of trolling that aren’t permitted.

[MG 2.0]

You got it. And - not unimportantly - the sight of a board with troll posts splurged all over it renders it unattractive to visitors who might otherwise stay and take part.

That was a concern of mine over on the old board. I would suppose there were at least a few folks that would pop in and see the overabundance of accusations of “troll” being thrown around in my direction and they decided that place wasn’t worth their time. I don’t blame them.

Some on this new iteration of the Discussions board have said that I’ve ‘changed my ways’ from the other board. Not really. Same guy. I do have a tendency now and then, if necessary, to call a spade a spade. And I did/have.

Why I’m not being ganged up on nowadays, who can say? Maybe people have just become more civilized. I’m not holding my breath though.

Different moderators? Some folks that WERE the culprits left? Not sure.

The discourse has been a bit more civil on this board with a few exceptions.

Doc, are you listening?

Anyway, I feel bad that Shades has been dog piled on and treated with an overabundance of drama which hasn’t been commensurate with his so-called sins, etc. Kind of sad. But my own experience tells me that there have been some very vindictive and unfair folks that pool together to take down those they don’t have any patience for and don’t agree with.

Good moderators can tell the difference between a troll and someone who is exercising their right to free expression in a healthy sort of way, more or less.

Regards,
MG

[MG 2.0]

Post about ideas and topics and crap that isn't about other posters and board history because Jesus damned Christ.

Not sure where you are going with this comment. Is it necessary?

Regards,
MG