Doctor CamNC4Me wrote: ↑Thu Nov 03, 2022 3:37 pm
canpakes wrote: ↑Thu Nov 03, 2022 2:00 pm
Jersey Girl, I picked this out from Doc’s post above because it mentions something that I’ve always wondered about, with respect to the idea of a world designed by a supreme being.
Simply put, nearly all life on this globe - be it closely spaced in a biological sense (Doc’s kudu and lion), to being about as different as imaginable (a virus within a person) - succeeds only by
consuming other life (plants sometimes excepted). And the life being consumed isn’t agreeable to the deal, nor does it revel in it. Rather, it’s usually painful, bloody, and ultimately destructive.
Why would either condition be necessary in a world designed by a loving god?
What made it
perfect?
Any being that set the conditions for this:
https://www.reddit.com/r/HardcoreNature ... _an_eland/
^ possible nsfw with regard to animal gore
is not a ‘loving god’. It’s a being that’s either completely indifferent to terror and pain, or it’s a being that revels in suffering. History is replete with horrors beyond our mind’s ability to comprehend (the Mongols exterminating entire hegemonies, for example) wherein the jewish god Jehovah passively observed his creations, from viruses liquidating organs to mankind absolutely brutalizing innocents without regard to their pain.
If a believer wants to take comfort in whatever notion they believe their god provides, then fine. It still doesn’t change a thing with regard to how this cruel, bloody, unholy world operates. The rules are in place, and if you want to believe your god is ‘loving’ by all means go for it. Stalin had a pet named Tishka, but does his love for an animal change who he was or what he did? Of course not - he was evil incarnate. Such is the duality of a ‘loving’ god.
- Doc
But Cam. If we as Christian believers develop the qualities described in the New Testament and if we follow the admonishments in the same, then WE would be the ones to relieve the garbage that goes on in the world. I believe that we are intended to be God's boots on the ground. I've said that many times over on this board. I see literally nothing in New Testament scripture that indicates otherwise.
Do not take that to mean that I think that non-believers aren't capable of the development of those qualities.
But Christianity, as I recall, is the largest world religion practiced on this very globe that we're screwing up so if Christians were doing what they were supposed to be doing in the first place, I think there would be change in the world.
This why I say to you don't blame the state of the world on the God of the Bible or Christianity (in terms of how you relate to me in this discussion), blame the state of the world on the multitude of people who identify as Christian believers who fail to do what is prescribed or what they are tasked with and taught to do.
It's not the religion, it's the people IN the religion. It's not Christianity and it's concepts. It's the Christians who give superficial lip service and fail to follow them.
It's like when I say that the only problem I have with organized religion are the people IN organized religion. Which is exactly why I stopped going to church so many years ago by now. I try to love people and I do to a certain extent, but I find it hard and distracting when people in churches start gossiping or arguing or looking down their noses at others while claiming they love them or vying for positions of authority and they DO. I find this distracting to the point that I left. I find myself being more of what I think God wants me to be
outside of the church walls.
We had one family (okay it was the mother) who threw a royal fit about an Easter Egg Hunt for the children.
I had that one youth pastor whom I really loved and respected until he did a class on cults for the youth which I attended and made a comment about "Mormon missionaries on their little bikes"...I HAD to stand up and comment about that and try to bring HIM back to topic and why he was doing the classes to begin with to encourage outreach.
I had my senior pastor whom I also loved and remain on friendly terms with who told me that he didn't know how I could be friends with my Mormon lady friend and I had to tell him, I didn't know how I could NOT be friends with her. I'm not supposed to love someone who isn't a New Testament Christian? Why not? Doesn't Jesus love her?
The church library had those stupid books The Mormon Puzzle and The God Makers. Those were the first books I ever read because that is all I could find available until I found (don't quote me here) Mama, Mormonism, and Me by Granny Geer. The first two books didn't turn me off Mormonism,they turned me off my own church's library because they were outrageously biased, arrogant, and nasty.
On the upside, I did have the former youth pastor who took me seriously when I complained about a comment made by one of our adult teachers in front of my friend's little Mormon daughter. He heard me out and promised to speak to the teacher.
But on the whole, I don't think it's the religion that is the problem. I think it's the human beings who are lazy minded, prone to arrogance, whose self image relies on elevating themselves over others. Human nature without a road map. But the New Testament DOES supply the road map of a type of human development that can and does positively impact humanity on the whole if only all of the Christians in this world would wake up!
Okay...ranting. Sorry not sorry.
Is it impossible for a Christian to accept Christ as their Savior, follow his teachings as described in the New Testament, strive to develop the qualities therein? NO, it's not. Can we do it 100%, 100% of the time? NO. Can we do it overall and successfully most of the time to our own benefit and to the benefit of others?
YES.
I'm maybe losing the narrative here. I'm NOT deleting or modifying the off the beaten path part of this post either.