What exactly Is Wrong with Polygamy anyway?

The catch-all forum for general topics and debates. Minimal moderation. Rated PG to PG-13.
User avatar
Physics Guy
God
Posts: 1961
Joined: Tue Oct 27, 2020 7:40 am
Location: on the battlefield of life

Re: What exactly Is Wrong with Polygamy anyway?

Post by Physics Guy »

The word for one person having exactly two spouses at once is bigamy. Polygamy normally implies a larger number, perhaps even unlimited. And it wasn't clear from your initial post that you were ruling out more than three in a marriage. Your mentions of a man marrying two wives just seemed like an example.

Why are you thinking of stopping at two wives, though? If two would be fine, what would be wrong with three or more? If three would be too many, why are you sure that two would not be?

I find it hard to believe that you don't see the legal difficulties in modern polygamy. How hard have you really thought this through? How much do you know about family law? About parenting?

Part of what makes family law complicated is that although the law does not care whether adults sleep with each other, the law does try to protect rights of children. What relationships do you imagine between half-siblings or between stepchildren and their parent's non-parental spouse? What legal status would you assign to these relationships?

What legal status do you imagine this legalised bigamy to involve at all, actually? It's not a crime nowadays for a man to sleep part-time with two different women, and even have children with them both. So what would be the difference between that kind of arrangement without any polygamous marriage, and a polygamous marriage? How could that difference be significant enough to be worth anyone having, and yet not be significantly more legally complicated than monogamous marriage?
I was a teenager before it was cool.
drumdude
God
Posts: 7188
Joined: Thu Oct 29, 2020 5:29 am

Re: What exactly Is Wrong with Polygamy anyway?

Post by drumdude »

So many men are leaving Mormonism. Polygamy may be the only way to have each woman sealed to a worthy priesthood holder.
KevinSim
Bishop
Posts: 514
Joined: Sun May 08, 2022 1:09 am

Re: What exactly Is Wrong with Polygamy anyway?

Post by KevinSim »

IHAQ wrote:
Mon Dec 12, 2022 4:54 pm
Yeah, so even if the arrange is bad for one or more of the participants, as long as some are happy that's okay?
IHAQ, why does the arrangement have to be bad for any of the participants?
IHAQ wrote:Is your wife aware you think there's something better than monogamy?
It's not monogamy I'm arguing against, IHAQ; it's celibacy. The alternative to polygamy is not monogamy; it's monogamy for the lucky and celibacy for the unlucky.
KevinSim
Bishop
Posts: 514
Joined: Sun May 08, 2022 1:09 am

Re: What exactly Is Wrong with Polygamy anyway?

Post by KevinSim »

Doctor CamNC4Me wrote:
Tue Dec 13, 2022 4:48 pm
Perhaps OP wants to get involved in polyamory and is looking for justification to do so, but I haven’t seen it work out with in real life acquaintances; in fact 100% of them have ended up in disaster.
Doc, I assure you I have no desire for involvement in either polyamory or polygamy. Just as a straight person could have come to wonder why gay marriage couldn't be legal (before Obergefell), so a monogamist like me can wonder why three-person polygamy (with adequate safeguards) can't be legal today.
KevinSim
Bishop
Posts: 514
Joined: Sun May 08, 2022 1:09 am

Re: What exactly Is Wrong with Polygamy anyway?

Post by KevinSim »

Doctor Steuss wrote:
Tue Dec 13, 2022 5:01 pm
My suggestion to Kevin would be to read some of the journals, and interviews of Brigham Young’s wives. If a wealthy prophet of God was unable (or unwilling) to properly provide for his wives and children, neglecting and abandoning them with wonton disregard whenever he became infatuated with a new wife, what exactly is right with polygamy?
What do the experiences of Brigham Young's seventy wives have to do with my suggestion that three-spouse marriages should be legal? I have made it clear from the outset that all I want is to consider the possibility that a marriage of three consenting adults might be better than the alternative.
KevinSim
Bishop
Posts: 514
Joined: Sun May 08, 2022 1:09 am

Re: What exactly Is Wrong with Polygamy anyway?

Post by KevinSim »

Marcus wrote:
Tue Dec 13, 2022 6:30 pm
Which concept PG fully addressed:
Physics Guy wrote:
Sun Dec 11, 2022 5:29 pm
If you want to talk on Mormon Discussions about a modern form of polygamy that has nothing to do with anything Mormon .... Modern polygamous marriage, as a new legal institution, would be a huge can of worms. There are probably only one or two people on these boards who could have anything to say on these legal topics that would be worth reading by anyone else. So what's to discuss about it?

And what else could there be to discuss, about modern polygamy?
Yes, and I responded to him.
User avatar
Doctor Steuss
God
Posts: 2164
Joined: Tue Oct 27, 2020 8:48 pm

Re: What exactly Is Wrong with Polygamy anyway?

Post by Doctor Steuss »

I'm reticent to engage, given our widely different moral and ethical baselines, but...
KevinSim wrote:
Fri Dec 30, 2022 6:35 pm
Doctor Steuss wrote:
Tue Dec 13, 2022 5:01 pm
My suggestion to Kevin would be to read some of the journals, and interviews of Brigham Young’s wives. If a wealthy prophet of God was unable (or unwilling) to properly provide for his wives and children, neglecting and abandoning them with wonton disregard whenever he became infatuated with a new wife, what exactly is right with polygamy?
What do the experiences of Brigham Young's seventy wives have to do with my suggestion that three-spouse marriages should be legal?
Brigham Young’s practice of polygamy is a direct reflection of the practice within the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, and its practice within a religious context.

If you wanted to talk about polygamy, outside of religion, then I’m wondering why you mentioned the Church from the onset.
I have made it clear from the outset that all I want is to consider the possibility that a marriage of three consenting adults might be better than the alternative.
What alternative? Monogamy?

If three consenting adults want to be in a committed relationship with each other, more power to them. If your wife wants a second husband, and you are ok with it, then I certainly see no problem with it.
KevinSim
Bishop
Posts: 514
Joined: Sun May 08, 2022 1:09 am

Re: What exactly Is Wrong with Polygamy anyway?

Post by KevinSim »

huckelberry wrote:
Tue Dec 13, 2022 6:35 pm
KevinSim wrote:
Tue Dec 13, 2022 6:27 pm
but I made it clear in the opening post that what I wanted to know was what was inherently wrong with marriages of three adults of any gender combination.
Kevin, I think there is a distinct possibility people do not know what you mean by inherently wrong. I do not know what you mean.
Huckelberry, if there's no way to practice polygamy without some enormous evil happening, and if things would be greatly better for everyone if polygamy wasn't practiced, then polygamy is inherently wrong. If the enormous evil was just from the way certain people practiced polygamy in the past, and the possibility exists that by tweaking the model, polygamy can be set up that doesn't have that enormous evil, then polygamy is not inherently wrong. Does that clear things up?
msnobody
God
Posts: 1102
Joined: Thu Oct 29, 2020 11:35 pm

Re: What exactly Is Wrong with Polygamy anyway?

Post by msnobody »

KevinSim wrote:
Fri Dec 30, 2022 6:51 pm
huckelberry wrote:
Tue Dec 13, 2022 6:35 pm
Kevin, I think there is a distinct possibility people do not know what you mean by inherently wrong. I do not know what you mean.
Huckelberry, if there's no way to practice polygamy without some enormous evil happening, and if things would be greatly better for everyone if polygamy wasn't practiced, then polygamy is inherently wrong. If the enormous evil was just from the way certain people practiced polygamy in the past, and the possibility exists that by tweaking the model, polygamy can be set up that doesn't have that enormous evil, then polygamy is not inherently wrong. Does that clear things up?
Marriage is meant to be a picture of Christ and the church. Polygamy would equate to whoring after other gods or idolatry. That is about all I have to say.
"Now to him who is able to keep you from stumbling and to present you blameless before the presence of his glory with great joy” Jude 1:24
“the blood of Jesus his Son cleanses us from all sin.” 1 John 1:7 ESV
drumdude
God
Posts: 7188
Joined: Thu Oct 29, 2020 5:29 am

Re: What exactly Is Wrong with Polygamy anyway?

Post by drumdude »

KevinSim wrote:
Fri Dec 30, 2022 6:51 pm
huckelberry wrote:
Tue Dec 13, 2022 6:35 pm
Kevin, I think there is a distinct possibility people do not know what you mean by inherently wrong. I do not know what you mean.
Huckelberry, if there's no way to practice polygamy without some enormous evil happening, and if things would be greatly better for everyone if polygamy wasn't practiced, then polygamy is inherently wrong. If the enormous evil was just from the way certain people practiced polygamy in the past, and the possibility exists that by tweaking the model, polygamy can be set up that doesn't have that enormous evil, then polygamy is not inherently wrong. Does that clear things up?
If my grandmother had wheels, she would have been a bike.
Post Reply