Reviving the Board

[Res Ipsa]

Hey DD

I’m curious what you think has gone wrong with the board.

I'm not comfortable expressing my entire thoughts. One of the reasons that I am hesitant (a big one to me) is how fond I am of the person who created this board. I like him quite a bit and I have enjoyed his board for many years. I think he has been very fair to all members spanning many years. What made this board the best one I have ever participated on (I have been on more than a few before I found this one) was two basic but critical ideas: Free speech and all are welcome here (meaning everyone has place to voice their thoughts and opinions).

That's all I am willing to say in a public post.

Ceebs, were you a member of the board back when Dan Peterson, Will Schryver, etc. posted here. I think you’ll find that what you object to all went on during that period of time. in my opinion, the Board culture that developed during those times of direct interaction was combative, to the point of toxicity at times. At some point, the apologists started calling this board the trailer park, with the implication being those who posted here are “trailer trash.” If I recall correctly, they used it pretty commonly before they left. I think that the conduct you are alluding to is the inheritance of that culture.

Another point that is worth considering is the growing use of the non-Mormon side of the board. That side of the board used to be Kingdom called “off topic.” in my opinion, it was always rough and tumble. I don’t recall what the conduct rules were for “off topic,” but the behavior there reminds me more of Spirit Prison than Spirit Paradise.

You aren’t the only member of the board whose interest in Mormon issues has waned over time, and the result has been an increase in use of the non-Mormon side of the board, especially when it comes to politics. And politics has gotten so polarized and toxic that it’s not surprising political discussions aren’t welcoming.

And that’s part of the dilemma of a free speech board. That all are welcome to participate and post, people also have to be free to speak their minds. We don’t demand that people “welcome” The contents of everyone’s speech.

There is a tendency for people to construct a vision of a rosy past that was “better” than the present. When examined more closely, I think what we find is that we’ve simply forgotten what the past really was like when it was the present.

I don’t think there is a going back to “better” times. There is only going forward and doing the best we can. I’m happy to talk about both problems and suggestions for change in private.

[malkie]

Perhaps there is a lack of discussion about whales and raccoons?

[ceeboo]

Malkie! Hope all is well with you and yours.

Perhaps there is a lack of discussion about whales and raccoons?

For you, my friend.

From this:


To this:


AMAZING!

[Res Ipsa]

Malkie! Hope all is well with you and yours.

Perhaps there is a lack of discussion about whales and raccoons?

For you, my friend.

From this:


To this:


AMAZING!

Some things never get old.

[malkie]

Malkie! Hope all is well with you and yours.

Perhaps there is a lack of discussion about whales and raccoons?

For you, my friend.

From this:


To this:


AMAZING!

ceeboo, we are as well as can be expected for our age & stage of life - thanks for asking.

I hope that you and your family are likewise well and happy.

It is amazing, is it not? Of course, there are some steps missing in between one and the other.
As my father would say: "Wonderful, the works of a wheelbarrow!"

[ceeboo]

ceeboo, we are as well as can be expected for our age & stage of life - thanks for asking.

Great to hear. Someone asked me about my parents a while ago (thy are 80 and 79) and my reply was almost exactly what you said above.

I hope that you and your family are likewise well and happy.

We are indeed - Thanks!

It is amazing, is it not? Of course, there are some steps missing in between one and the other.

Yes, probably two or three steps. Although just looking at the raccoon and whale, I am kind of shocked by the stark similarities.

As my father would say: "Wonderful, the works of a wheelbarrow!"

Like it! Awesome to engage you, Malkie!

[ceeboo]

Some things never get old.

Indeed! Still can't believe that Shades didn't pin any of the raccoon/whale discussions in the "Hall of Fame" threads.

[drumdude]

Hey DD

I'm not comfortable expressing my entire thoughts. One of the reasons that I am hesitant (a big one to me) is how fond I am of the person who created this board. I like him quite a bit and I have enjoyed his board for many years. I think he has been very fair to all members spanning many years. What made this board the best one I have ever participated on (I have been on more than a few before I found this one) was two basic but critical ideas: Free speech and all are welcome here (meaning everyone has place to voice their thoughts and opinions).

That's all I am willing to say in a public post.

Ceebs, were you a member of the board back when Dan Peterson, Will Schryver, etc. posted here. I think you’ll find that what you object to all went on during that period of time. in my opinion, the Board culture that developed during those times of direct interaction was combative, to the point of toxicity at times. At some point, the apologists started calling this board the trailer park, with the implication being those who posted here are “trailer trash.” If I recall correctly, they used it pretty commonly before they left. I think that the conduct you are alluding to is the inheritance of that culture.

Another point that is worth considering is the growing use of the non-Mormon side of the board. That side of the board used to be Kingdom called “off topic.” in my opinion, it was always rough and tumble. I don’t recall what the conduct rules were for “off topic,” but the behavior there reminds me more of Spirit Prison than Spirit Paradise.

You aren’t the only member of the board whose interest in Mormon issues has waned over time, and the result has been an increase in use of the non-Mormon side of the board, especially when it comes to politics. And politics has gotten so polarized and toxic that it’s not surprising political discussions aren’t welcoming.

And that’s part of the dilemma of a free speech board. That all are welcome to participate and post, people also have to be free to speak their minds. We don’t demand that people “welcome” The contents of everyone’s speech.

There is a tendency for people to construct a vision of a rosy past that was “better” than the present. When examined more closely, I think what we find is that we’ve simply forgotten what the past really was like when it was the present.

I don’t think there is a going back to “better” times. There is only going forward and doing the best we can. I’m happy to talk about both problems and suggestions for change in private.

Do you know anywhere online where apologists still engage critics in discussion?

That’s a huge difference now than the past. And one that the apologists alone are responsible for.

[malkie]

Some things never get old.

Indeed! Still can't believe that Shades didn't pin any of the raccoon/whale discussions in the "Hall of Fame" threads.

IKR - I remembered about the whale, but had to use Search to confirm the progenitor. Sheesh!

[Physics Guy]

I think communities of all kinds go through stages. Ones that form around some purpose can last for a long time, recruiting new members steadily, especially if the purpose is serious enough that community membership comes with a salary. Ones that try to serve young people who are sent there by parents, like schools or clubs or sports teams, can be practically immortal because they have a steady source of new blood. Communities based on common interest in a subject that remains significant, like scientific research communities, can endure over several human lifetimes.

Communities that mainly exist just to be fun communities often last less long because they succeed to death. A close-knit group forms, and that's great, but precisely because it's so great, new people find it hard to break into the group. Recruiting drops off while the group is having too much fun being itself to notice. After a few years, core members leave for various unavoidable reasons, and everyone misses them too much to think about replacing their irreplaceable friends with uninteresting newbies. None of this is necessarily wrong, or anyone's failure; it's the natural lifespan of the organism. A duller group might have lived longer, for certain values of "lived".

Groups that form around shared aversion to something might have an even harder time persisting, because their success leads to death more directly. Once people get away from the thing they don't like, it stops bothering them, and the bond of shared aversion to it weakens.

This board is a complex community that has been linked by ties of all those kinds. It may well experience cyclical phases of expansion and contraction like an industrial economy, rather than a once-through life cycle of growth and decay, because some of the more durable parts of the board may keep it alive after others collapse, until the collapsed parts restart.

Or if the board dies, that may just be mortal nature. I don't think message boards have a survival instinct. Insofar as they can be considered as a collective life form, they're not really interested in changing species, to become a different kind of thing, just to live a bit longer. When their time comes, I reckon, they just die as they've lived.