Trump attempted assassination at Rally Today?! He was bleeding

[bill4long]

[Gadianton]

Just an expression like, "You'll have to twist his arm to get him off the computer and go watch the football game," or when Donald Trump said, "I could stand in the middle of 5th Avenue and shoot somebody and I wouldn’t lose voters.” There is a reason why you didn't provide the full sentence.

quick question: if Donald Trump walked into the street and shot somebody, would he lose your vote, Bill?

If you would like an example of somebody literally talking about killing Donald Trump in a speculative and possibly promotional way, and not as an idiom or expression or figure of speech, then look into the episode of Infowars a few months ago where Ivan Raiklin dared the deep state to assassinate Trump or RFK, because if that happens, then "America" invokes a target list of people like Hilary Clinton and Mike Pence as revenge targets. Then Ivan reveals once Trump is gone, the person who takes his place will be so much better for the right and so much worse for the left. To which Alex Jones responds,

"I was about to say, Kill him, that's the best case scenario, from a sick level, from a sick level of 'oh please kill him!', oh I mean, it's soo good after that!"

And then Raiklin fills in the details, "It's going to be the best cleansing and the fastest cleansing after that, the fastest cleansing that we've ever seen in my lifetime."

This really leaves it open for a dutiful right-winger to read between the lines. If sacrificing Trump raises somebody even crazier and at the same time ushers in the revenge killing of a whole list of political figures MAGA Republicans hate, then shouldn't a dutiful right-winger take one for the team and do it? Because the entire right wing has already declared that person, long before it ever happens, an agent of the deep state no matter who it is, and so there's just no way for the plan to go wrong.

[Res Ipsa]

I tried to say it as slow as I could, but I’m never going to stretch that sentence out to 9 years.

[Gadianton]

I tried to say it as slow as I could, but I’m never going to stretch that sentence out to 9 years.

[canpakes]

Well, Bill, not only is that quote 9 years old, but Wilson was a conservative Republican when he said it.

And he’d argue that he’s still a conservative Republican.

[Gunnar]

Points well taken, but whether or not the shooter "agreed with me politically", it would have been incredibly stupid of him to think that his act would have helped ensure Biden's reelection. Besides that, if he actually believed this was a proper course to take, he certainly did not agree with me politically.

Bless your heart. Is this how you treated Americans after January 6 which was attended by still anonymous FBI agents? Cry me a river.

Well, I certainly think that it was both wrong and stupid for the Jan 6 riot attendees to try to violently overturn Biden's legitimate election by force, if that's what you mean. I don't know that there were anonymous FBI agents in the crowd, though. If there were FBI agents in the crowd, though, because the FBI felt there was good reason to suspect nefarious and unlawful activity was likely, and wanted to catch the perpetrators in the act, there would not necessarily be anything sinister about them being anonymous, would there? Or are you proposing the totally unfounded and ridiculous notion that anonymous FBI agents were actively trying to incite the crowd to violence? Who would benefit by them doing that, other than Trump or his supporters?

[Res Ipsa]

I’ve heard nothing about anonymous FBI agents in the crowd. There were anonymous FBI confidential informants in the crowd. But they weren’t there to snitch on the attendees at the event.

Following the protests after the death of George Floyd, Trump’s FBI embedded confidential informants in the Proud Boys. But the purpose wasn’t to gather intel on the Proud boys or any other right wing group. They were embedded to gather intel on Antifa — presumably to reach down those Anti buses were rumored to be heading everywhere but never actually appeared anywhere.

These Anti-Antifa CIs were embedded in different chapters in different cities by different field offices. About 12 of the CIs went to the J6 rally along with many other Proud Boys. But the FBI did not ask them to go and they had no reason to tell the FBI they were going.

After the riot, prosecutors charged several members of the Proud Boys. They did not intend to call any of the CIs as witnesses or use any intel from them at trial. However, it turned out that lawyers for several of the defendants planned to call some number of the CIs as witnesses for the defense. At that point, the prosecution informed the defense attorneys that some of the witnesses they intended to call were CIs. The disclosure resulted in an initial brouhaha that was resolved daily quickly. The FBI told the defense lawyers that the CIs were tasked with gathering intel Antifa and not the Proud Boys, which was confirmed by the CIs themselves. The defense attorneys were satisfied that the prosecution wasn’t sandbagging them with undisclosed evidence and the cases proceeded to trial.

Naturally, the usual suspects manufactured a conspiracy narrative to impugn the FBI, the prosecution and the Biden Administration. I did a fair amount of looking, but this was all I found regarding anonymous FBI anything present during the rioting.

ETA: This USA Today fact check debunks the mountains of disinformation spread by right wing media and politicians on this topic. https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/fac ... 753276002/

[Kishkumen]

I can’t imagine thinking it is unfair of the criminal justice system to incarcerate people engaged in a violent coup.

Let’s say you were there on J6 and thought you were only protesting, not seeking to overturn the election.

I have some sympathy for you in that case. I don’t want to see you rot in prison. But I wonder how anyone is supposed to know for certain what was in your mind and heart when you walked into the Capitol on J6 with people who WERE seeking to hold Pelosi hostage, or kill Mike Pence for not doing Trump’s bidding.

I once spent a couple of weeks working in an Utah state prison as a psych tech. In group therapy sessions, I heard prisoner after prisoner claim they were just in the wrong place at the wrong time. Totally innocent. Maybe some were, but how would I know?

J6 was an insurrection and attempted coup. Had it succeeded, Trump would have tried to hold onto power. If Senate Republicans had honored their sacred oath to protect the Constitution, Trump would have been impeached and he would now be in prison. THAT was the correct outcome. The minute all those Republicans violated their oath to defend the Constitution was the beginning of the end of the Republic, in a sense.

Mass refusal to keep the sacred oath of their office spells disaster. Now every supporter of Trump does not believe that Trump’s attack on the system was such. Senate Republicans gave them all a pass. No wonder we are in a world of hurt.

The GOP went rogue and many if not most of their constituents are just fine with it. Binger and ceeboo feel completely justified in defending Trump’s unconstitutional actions because they have an entire apparatus telling them they ain’t no such thing.

[Kishkumen]

I’ve heard nothing about anonymous FBI agents in the crowd. There were anonymous FBI confidential informants in the crowd. But they weren’t there to snitch on the attendees at the event.

Following the protests after the death of George Floyd, Trump’s FBI embedded confidential informants in the Proud Boys. But the purpose wasn’t to gather intel on the Proud boys or any other right wing group. They were embedded to gather intel on Antifa — presumably to reach down those Anti buses were rumored to be heading everywhere but never actually appeared anywhere.

These Anti-Antifa CIs were embedded in different chapters in different cities by different field offices. About 12 of the CIs went to the J6 rally along with many other Proud Boys. But the FBI did not ask them to go and they had no reason to tell the FBI they were going.

After the riot, prosecutors charged several members of the Proud Boys. They did not intend to call any of the CIs as witnesses or use any intel from them at trial. However, it turned out that lawyers for several of the defendants planned to call some number of the CIs as witnesses for the defense. At that point, the prosecution informed the defense attorneys that some of the witnesses they intended to call were CIs. The disclosure resulted in an initial brouhaha that was resolved daily quickly. The FBI told the defense lawyers that the CIs were tasked with gathering intel Antifa and not the Proud Boys, which was confirmed by the CIs themselves. The defense attorneys were satisfied that the prosecution wasn’t sandbagging them with undisclosed evidence and the cases proceeded to trial.

Naturally, the usual suspects manufactured a conspiracy narrative to impugn the FBI, the prosecution and the Biden Administration. I did a fair amount of looking, but this was all I found regarding anonymous FBI anything present during the rioting.

ETA: This USA Today fact check debunks the mountains of disinformation spread by right wing media and politicians on this topic. https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/fac ... 753276002/

Ahah! That explains a lot. Binger ought to read this. I think this was something he found highly suspicious.

[Binger]

Binger and ceeboo feel completely justified in defending Trump’s unconstitutional actions because they have an entire apparatus telling them they ain’t no such thing.

Kish, have you ever considered not being a liar? Has that ever crossed your mind?