Trump is not a fascist

[canpakes]

But yeah, let's dodge our butts off and ask...so what's the left's plan?

“Due process”.

Markk must not like that answer.

[Jersey Girl]

Hey Markk. Let's look at some art, k?

Here is our President.
His name is Donald.
He is holding a picture.
He's trying to show us the the MS 13 tattoos on Mr. Garcia's left hand.
Look at Donald's face.

Do you think there is trouble?



Do you know how to find your left hand?
Here I will help you out.
Put your hands flat on the table. Stick out your thumbs. Do you see the fingers that make the letter "L"?

That is your Left hand!

Let's get a closer look at those MS 13 tattoos.
Do you have a magnifying glass?
No?

That's okay. I will make a bigger picture!



What do your eyes see?
My eyes see a belly button, a "M", "S", "1" and a "3", a pot plant, a smiley face, a cross, and a spooky bone face.

Do you think that gang members are spooky?

Here is a picture of a MS 13 gang member.
Do you see his tattoos?



Do his MS 13 tattoos look like these?



No?
I don't think so either.
Do you think Donald is playing a joke on us?

Me too!

FYI: The above observation and verbal exchange sequence can be easily understood by a typical peer 4 year old. I guarantee it. And just look at all those open ended questions that help children to develop critical thinking skills. I freakin' rock!

[Gadianton]

These guys are essentially engaged in sending people to what is effectively a concentration camp, and some portion of Americans are cheering for it.

The cheering for evil, especially when thinking of oneself as a Christian is interesting. I'd first point out that among the boisterous supporters, there is a heavy tendency to fit the pop-psych/business world mode of being called "unconsciously incompetent", while forever evading introspection.

If I were to say to my right-wing friend, hey friend, you know, I really support Trump on immigration, we've got to do something about this nonsense, we're being overran! I am a little worried about this particular case though... There is a decent chance that he will become concerned about it as well. I also know he's been on the side of certain people in his life who he believes were unfairly treated by the law and I could tie it into that, if I'm careful.

But if I say, hey friend, this is clear violation of due process, the Supreme Court agrees 9-0, this is a travesty of justice (which it is), he's going to cheer for it and hope for more of the same. "get 'em out of here", "he shouldn't have been here to begin with and it wouldn't have happened!" "Why don't you pay for all the illegals if you want 'em here!?" The response doesn't even need to fully connect with the concern.

Well, the point is, there is a disconnect between the cheering and the object of the cheering, because there is ignorance, lack of values, and personal self-defense to the point that the matter isn't seriously being considered. When I say lack of values, I mean he could talk for 10 minutes and contradict himself 20 times. Of course he thinks he has values but you'll never get anything close to a coherent summary of those values.

[Markk]

The the Supreme Court has ruled that Trump is in defiance of the standing court order. Period. End to it.

Sorry, but you don't know jack about the case. I'd like to see a primary source that determined Mr. Garcia was a member of MS-13.

Dish it up, buddy.

Hey Jersey Girl,

It is debatable whether or not he is in defiance. The court told him to facilitate bringing him back to the state, which, as Garcia being a citizen of El Salvador, and a gang member according to El Salvador, and their laws, they have every right to keep him in his country and incarcerated.

I have shown the primary sources, several times Jersey Girl. Two judges and a DHS deportation officer among others. Jersey Girl, he was on is way to being deported, partly because he was identified as a MS-13 gang member,....and because he claimed asylum, because he would be in danger of other gangs, he was given what is called protection.

https://www.justice.gov/ag/media/1396906/dl?inline

Also a few days ago, it came out that he was pulled over in Tennessee for speeding, with 8 other persons in his vehicle, with no luggage, and he told the officers he was taking them to Maryland for construction, again with no luggage. He told the officers that the truck belonged to his construction boss. Today, if what I am reading is correct, it turns out that the truck is registered to a Jose Ramon-Hernandez Reyes, allegedly a self-admitted human trafficker.

He wore a hat that is often associated with MS-13. He had a sweatshirt that had a illustration that is common with gangs, and he has a tattoo on his leg with a devil with horns that is an MS-13 symbol, along with the tattoo on his knuckles that you pasted on another post, that may or may not refer to MS-13.

There's now a hand written complaint by a person that claimed to be the father of Garcia's wife two previous children, who said he was worried that she was dating a gang member.

He was arrested in a Home Depot parking lot, throwing pot under a car, with validated MS-13 members.

On top of all that, besides he was in the US illegally, he beat the crap out of his wife, made her bleed and gave her a black eye, in a hand written signed complaint by his wife.

So Jersey Girl, I can back up everything I wrote here, and I have already done so with most of it, but I encourage you do the homework on your own, don't believe me, but at least check it out on your own.

That said, what kind of person do you believe Garcia is, and why? Do you just believe this is all a conspiracy, that two federal judges gave him deportation orders 6 years ago, and a protection grant, because he was a member of MS-13, is just a lie?

[Dr Exiled]

Replying to the thread title:

He's not a fascist if he follows the right path, according to the self-proclaimed "smart" people and a certain country. If he doesn't do what they want, then of course he's a fascist. So, when do we attack Iran? They think the oil in their country is theirs, go figure. Little do they realize that it really belongs to BP and Exxon and Chevron and maybe Eni and Total. The Shah and his secret police were misunderstood. They were good people! Let's bring them back and avoid fascism.

[Markk]

We certainly have different world views.

God, yes. Unlike you, I do not believe that the ends justify the means.

Well, we also disagree on what our "ends that justify our means" so to speak.

What is your end and plan on this issue? From what I am seeing the lefts plan, in regard to illegal immigration was and is to do nothing. Chaos seems to be the plan.

This topic is a great example of it. What is the lefts plan to mitigate the mess created by the complete lack of order at the boarder over the past 3 decades or so, and especially the last four years of Biden. What do we, as a country do about all the illegal criminals in our country?

Do you support the early release from prison, of the illegal immigrant that killed two young people in So Ca in a DUI accident, that had a criminal record and was deported and yet came back, twice?

Holman stated ...""U.S. Immigration and Customs Enforcement placed a detainer with North Kern State Prison, Delano, California, June 9, 2022, on Oscar Eduardo Ortega-Anguiano, 43, of Mexico. He is serving time after being convicted of gross vehicular manslaughter while intoxicated. His previous criminal convictions include burglary in 2005; vehicle theft in 2007; and battery on spouse with kidnapping in 2014, ..."

The Trump administration stated he will be arrested and given 20 years or so upon release, for violation the US code, I have mention that code number upstream some days ago here, I think it was 1325, or 1326.

Is this good thing that Trump is doing with getting this guy locked up....can you give him credit here for interceding here because of California's insane decision of letting this illegal murderer out early?

Update: As I write this, watching the news, having my morning coffee with Kish, it is being reported that CA. will actually comply to ICE, and allow them to apply a detainer on this guy, which CA. and sanctuary cites and states typically refuses to do with illegal immigrants. I guess it takes burning two citizens alive to do so.

What is your plan and the lefts for the mess of all these illegal criminals here, how do we get these folks in jail and out of here Kish? What the superior plan as a means to the end to this obvious problem, or do you believe it is not an issue?

[Markk]

But yeah, let's dodge our butts off and ask...so what's the left's plan?

“Due process”.

Markk must not like that answer.

Markk's question is what is the plan to get these illegal immigrant folks rounded up and identified so due process and the acts and laws can be applied to them. Can you answer that question? As an example how do we find those that have been deported via the standard due process, process, and yet came back again.... which allows us to immediately deport them, or fine and imprison them per the US codes I have discussed here? What is the plan?

[Markk]

Hey Huck,

He went through the due process, process, and by two judges because of the collaborating evidences, he was determined to be a ranking member of MS-13, and because of the due process, process, he was given protection, which is basically a stay of executing his deportation. This was put into effect, because of the due process he received. When Trump invoked the EAE, this allowed the government to deport Garcia, because of his determined membership with MS-13, by two judges, during the due process, process.

Huck didn't write that.

There was a standing court order stating there was a single country he could not be deported to. That court order was violated. This was a denial of due process. Full stop.

Every single Supreme Court justice, including the two most conservative justices in the entire history of the court, who have a long documented history of accepting undisclosed "gifts" from MAGA-adjacent billionaires, disagrees with you. One of the most respected Raegan appointees still serving disagrees with you.

I'm not a lawyer, and certainly no legal expert, so I personally am left to rely on them and their interpretation of events and the Constitution, and assume they have access to things I don't. Usually, when not even a single Justice dissents, I would think it's safe to assume the issue is pretty black and white.

That was a protection order, he was deported as a terrorist, which is what will be heard by the the Supreme Court. And in reality, what is on the table if the the Supreme Court actually amends the current facilitate order, and El Salvador decides to release their own citizen from prison and send him back. ICE can simple re-arrest him, and go before a judge, and have him deported as a validated MS-13 gang member, because El Salvador has mitigated their gang problem and the asylum protection he had, as a gang member no longer applies.

That same Supreme Court members wanted the courts that opposed Trump, to give them more information, they did not make the concrete decision you are implying, there is much more to it....we will see what happens. they are expected to speak more on this. They told the government to facilitate his return, which they did and the President of El Salvador recused to do, in that context, the government did what the court had asked.

This is going to be a very interesting decision.

[canpakes]

… he told the officers he was taking them to Maryland for construction, again with no luggage.

As I understand it, he has also ripped the tag off of his mattress.

[Kishkumen]

Well, we also disagree on what our "ends that justify our means" so to speak.

What is your end and plan on this issue? From what I am seeing the lefts plan, in regard to illegal immigration was and is to do nothing. Chaos seems to be the plan.

Your off-brand Kool Aid is pretty weak and tastes bad, but it sure does a number on you.

Presidents have been deporting millions of undocumented immigrants for decades now, legally and Constitutionally. Unlawful, inhumane, and unconstitutional methods are not justified.