Jesus and the Bible encourage sociopathology

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Gadianton
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Jesus and the Bible encourage sociopathology

Post by Gadianton »

this poll dropped a couple of days ago and it's not unexpected but it's still interesting.

On one of the recent MG topics, I mentioned Joseph Smith was a sociopath, which I truly believe, and that senior leadership of the church tends toward sociopathology, which is evident in their stance to burn the kids to protect the club. MG went on to make one of his word salads about the Church leaders not being sociopaths while he was gearing up for another outing to avoid the Lord's command to serve a senior mission.

First, let's talk just a bit about sociopathology or anti-social personality disorder. From the webmd article:
webmd wrote:Sociopath is an outdated, informal term for someone who has antisocial personality disorder (ASPD). This disorder can cause you to lack empathy, which means you don't care about or understand other peoples' feelings. You might not feel remorse for bad things you do, and you might often take advantage of others for your own personal gain.
Now, hold on. Let's go back to this poll. What was it that Evangelicals -- with Mormons coming in second place -- think shouldn't be foundational? Was it empathy? So, in other words, according to the most fervent believers in Jesus and holy writ, the thing that keeps people from being serial killers is bad, m'kay?

If only 45% of Bible thumpers believe empathy is foundational, then Jesus has personally failed. The consensus among EVs was, in my reasonable experience interacting with them as a missionary and even dating some later on, that the difference between the real Jesus and the Mormon Jesus is that good works flow after salvation, not as a means of obtaining salvation. Once saved, the Holy Spirit takes over and guides the person like a captain guides a ship through the stormy seas of life. What that means is that once a person gets Jesus as their personal savior to guide the boat, that they are twice as likely to look for religious and political leaders who are sociopaths to serve society.

The fact of the matter is that Jesus in his mortal ministry (prior to guiding people as the captain of a ship from heaven) was a thorn in the side of the institution. His message was radical empathy, "he who is without sin, let him cast the first stone." This doesn't mean the stone could never be cast -- he was without sin and so he was qualified to cast it, yet he didn't. The empathy is in the first move, to deeply understand where the person is coming from, without that first move, the second move to show mercy will never be available.

For religious conservatives, the first move is dangerous, you must "nip it in the bud" as they say, and so in the end, the presumed God, known as Jesus, got totally owned -- nailed to a cross by Pontius Pilot. Pilot was a no-nonsense administrator who was able to make the "hard decisions" and put down opinions before they got too loud by drastic means. Let severe punishment be a deterrent so we can keep the status quo with less work. In other words, Jesus is leading all these people like a captain guiding a ship to empower religious and political leaders who are much like man who ended him, if not worse, if you account for the times.
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huckelberry
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Re: Jesus and the Bible encourage sociopathology

Post by huckelberry »

Gad,I checked a church source and see a senior mission is an invitation not a commandment. That is a part of why I keep feeling puzzled over people giving out condemnation for not going. That seems perhaps a bit of empathy lack.

Anyway I share your dislike of these EV trends. EV can be awful proud of their fine distinctions over grace.

,,,,,
Adding , I see it as strange to see a detail about grace being seen as taking priority over following Jesus admonitions.
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Gadianton
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Re: Jesus and the Bible encourage sociopathology

Post by Gadianton »

Why was this moved to SP? The main context was the Todd C. thread and MG saying his leaders aren't sociopaths.

Guess Hound isn't the only one the mods have it in for.
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Re: Jesus and the Bible encourage sociopathology

Post by huckelberry »

Gadianton wrote: ↑
Sun Oct 25, 2026 3:28 pm
...........

If only 45% of Bible thumpers believe empathy is foundational, then Jesus has personally failed. The consensus among EVs was, in my reasonable experience interacting with them as a missionary and even dating some later on, that the difference between the real Jesus and the Mormon Jesus is that good works flow after salvation, not as a means of obtaining salvation. Once saved, the Holy Spirit takes over and guides the person like a captain guides a ship through the stormy seas of life. What that means is that once a person gets Jesus as their personal savior to guide the boat, that they are twice as likely to look for religious and political leaders who are sociopaths to serve society.
...........
Gad, I selected a piece of your interesting post because I thought it picked out a crucial piece of the mystery of ev subjugation to bad leadership.

I believe as a matter of saving faith one should strengthen one's own decision making skills, especially right from wrong and how to understand understand others ( empathy )
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Some Schmo
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Re: Jesus and the Bible encourage sociopathology

Post by Some Schmo »

I used to think religion made people suck, but now I realize it's a symbiotic relationship of freely exchanged suckiness between individuals and religious institutions.

What I do know is that religion is attractive to crappy people. I'm fairly sure that I was turned off church because the community's vibe made me want to crawl out of my skin. Most religious people I've met are just damned weird in one way or another.
Religion is for people whose existential fear is greater than their common sense. It's also the favored cover for hypocrites.

The god idea is popular with desperate people.
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Gadianton
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Re: Jesus and the Bible encourage sociopathology

Post by Gadianton »

I wonder how MG reconciles the results of this study that only 65% of Mormons think empathy is important, the second lowest in the study; the fact that lack of empathy is the root of anti-social personality disorder, and the fact that Mormon leaders care more about church image than ending abuse. It seems like all these facts are mutually reinforcing.
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MG 2.0
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Re: Jesus and the Bible encourage sociopathology

Post by MG 2.0 »

Gadianton wrote: ↑
Sun Oct 25, 2026 3:28 pm

Now, hold on. Let's go back to this poll. What was it that Evangelicals -- with Mormons coming in second place -- think shouldn't be foundational? Was it empathy? So, in other words, according to the most fervent believers in Jesus and holy writ, the thing that keeps people from being serial killers is bad, m'kay?
I don't know whether or not this might add to or take away from your thesis, but here are the actual statements that were placed before the respondents to this survey:

Statement 1: "Empathy is a foundational moral value that helps build a healthy society."

Statement 2: "Empathy can become dangerous when it leads people away from a society guided by God's truth."

The results you are referring to in your post reflect what the numbers were in each religious group that agreed with or leaned toward Statement 1. Could it be that those that chose statement 2 might be framing empathy as conditional...and even that it could become dangerous if it conflicts with a higher authority ?

God's truth, for example?

The thread having to do with Prop. 1 in Idaho might be held up as exhibit one.

Regards,
MG
Last edited by MG 2.0 on Tue Oct 27, 2026 12:21 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Jesus and the Bible encourage sociopathology

Post by MG 2.0 »

Some Schmo wrote: ↑
Mon Oct 26, 2026 4:20 pm
I used to think religion made people suck, but now I realize it's a symbiotic relationship of freely exchanged suckiness between individuals and religious institutions.

What I do know is that religion is attractive to crappy people. I'm fairly sure that I was turned off church because the community's vibe made me want to crawl out of my skin. Most religious people I've met are just damned weird in one way or another.
Says the guy who is showing his butt on a message board. :lol:

Regards,
MG
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Re: Jesus and the Bible encourage sociopathology

Post by MG 2.0 »

Gadianton wrote: ↑
Sun Oct 25, 2026 3:28 pm
MG went on to make one of his word salads about the Church leaders not being sociopaths...
I suppose that's one way of avoiding what I actually said. ;)

Regards,
MG
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Gadianton
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Re: Jesus and the Bible encourage sociopathology

Post by Gadianton »

Exactly MG, you shut down empathy before it has the chance to lead to sympathy or compromise, or anything but hardline obedience to your authority.

The point is, empathy isn't a slippery slope that leads to Armageddon, but this is the root of your reactionary doctrine. You want leaders without out it, in order to guard against the slippery slope. The result is things like mass child abuse that goes unaddressed.
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