LDS Church uses charitable donations to support Prop 1 battle in Idaho

[Limnor]

Why is the LDS patriarchy seeking to hinder the agency of pregnant women in Idaho?

What’s more, IHQ, the Church seems to be attempting to impose its moral standards on people who have never accepted its religious authority in the first place. While there are additional historical contributors to the situation, that approach didn’t end well in Missouri.

[I Have Questions]

Let's see ... MG's deity set up the universe and laid down the rules by which it runs. OK, so he set up a universe in which there can be very big physically strong entities, who are left free to torture and kill weaker ones who have done no harm. (Think big tough man who enjoys raping and murdering little pre-teen girls, for instance).

If one of those weak and harmless victims goes to MG's deity after being raped and murdered and says "Hey, you placed me in an environment where the rules of the game you set up meant that horrible strong people were free to do bad stuff to me if they wanted to. And one of them did. Why did you set up such a horrible world where that could happen to me, and put me in it?" Then what does MG's deity do? Shrugs and says "That's free-will for you, sweetie-pie!"?

Will someone explain what better answer MG's deity can give to that particular little girl?

If someone designs a machine for the general public that randomly kills 20% of the people who use it MG would simply say that is nature running its course. There would be no need for accountability. MG seems to have the perspective that when a pedophile or another person SA's a child or another victim there will be recompense in heaven with the reanimated supreme primate that goes something like this. Hey sweetie pie see that man over there that killed your entire family and graped you? Go over and get to know him I forgave him.

This whole it’s nature not God malarkey is laughable. If God cannot influence nature, then why do Mormons fast and pray for rain, or for rain to stop? If God can influence nature to change weather patterns then he can change miscarriage patterns. You cannot have it both ways. At least, not if we’re all being intellectually honest. Unfortunately, defending Mormonism will have you arguing one thing today, but the opposite thing tomorrow. Defending Mormonism will make a liar out of you at some point. Always. [url=https://www.churchofjesuschrist.org/stu ... =engHere’s[/url] how Mormonism describes God

God created all things and is the ruler of the universe, being omnipotent, omniscient, and omnipresent (through His Spirit)

Which means he should be able to influence nature, otherwise God is not omnipotent.

[I Have Questions]

Why is the LDS patriarchy seeking to hinder the agency of pregnant women in Idaho?

What’s more, IHQ, the Church seems to be attempting to impose its moral standards on people who have never accepted its religious authority in the first place. While there are additional historical contributors to the situation, that approach didn’t end well in Missouri.

Yes. Can you imagine the Church’s reaction to a campaign to legislate that the Church had to solemnise gay marriages? Forcing your religious standards on others, not of your religion, can work both ways.

[I Have Questions]

Here is a real and recent case

It didn't take long for doctors to see that something was amiss with Rebecca Crozier's pregnancy.

At her eight-week ultrasound in 2025, they mentioned a possible neural tube defect, she said, but after some research, she thought it was something that could be managed or treated.

"If it was a fixable problem, I was ready to quit my job and full-time care for a disabled child," said Crozier, who is now 27. "That was something that we were prepared to do."

In the time between the two ultrasounds, she had a dream that she was carrying a baby girl, and she and her husband named her Haven.

The couple lived in eastern Idaho at the time, and drove two hours to the Boise area to see the maternal-fetal medicine specialists at St. Luke's, the state's largest health system. Now at 11 weeks' gestation, the specialists told her Haven had anencephaly, which occurs when the brain does not develop normally and the skull is left open, exposing brain tissue to amniotic fluid that causes the tissue to dissolve. It is a fatal condition.

She was missing a lot of brain tissue," Crozier recalled. "They were very clear that this baby will not go home with you. You will not take this baby home. This baby will die in the hospital if the baby survives that long."

In many states, even ones with abortion bans, Crozier would have had the option to terminate the pregnancy. But Idaho's near-total prohibition includes no exceptions for fatal anomalies. It's one of 11 states that do not have exceptions for anencephaly or other fatal anomalies.

Next Tuesday, Idahoans will vote to determine whether the state's near-total abortion ban should remain the law. Proposition 1, the title of the citizen-led ballot measure, would restore access to abortion until fetal viability, which was the state law before the U.S. Supreme Court's decision to overturn Roe v. Wade in 2022.

The LDS Church’s male leaders want people to vote against this woman having a choice, and is spending $1 million to try and ensure they enforce their opinion on this woman, who isn’t a Mormon. Ironically

The couple have family members who live in Utah. Crozier called clinics in Utah, where abortion is permitted up to 18 weeks, and got an appointment at a hospital within two weeks. Her mom flew in from California to be by her side.

[MG 2.0]

Let's see ... MG's deity set up the universe and laid down the rules by which it runs. OK, so he set up a universe in which there can be very big physically strong entities, who are left free to torture and kill weaker ones who have done no harm. (Think big tough man who enjoys raping and murdering little pre-teen girls, for instance).

If one of those weak and harmless victims goes to MG's deity after being raped and murdered and says "Hey, you placed me in an environment where the rules of the game you set up meant that horrible strong people were free to do bad stuff to me if they wanted to. And one of them did. Why did you set up such a horrible world where that could happen to me, and put me in it?" Then what does MG's deity do? Shrugs and says "That's free-will for you, sweetie-pie!"?

Will someone explain what better answer MG's deity can give to that particular little girl?

If someone designs a machine for the general public that randomly kills 20% of the people who use it MG would simply say that is nature running its course. There would be no need for accountability. MG seems to have the perspective that when a pedophile or another person SA's a child or another victim there will be recompense in heaven with the reanimated supreme primate that goes something like this. Hey sweetie pie see that man over there that killed your entire family and graped you? Go over and get to know him I forgave him.

What do you do with 'nature' and human agency/free will? To have it your way wouldn't you have to have a God that sets up a world in which evolution does not take its course? Bacteria and viruses do not mutate... they're all productive and harmless? A world in which accidents of nature cannot happen? A world in which car accidents and other freakish happenings do not occur?

A world without genetic mutation?

Thus, a world magically (because that's what it would take) created in which nothing bad ever happens...and if it did/does, God steps in every time to correct the mishap/problem/disease and bad decisions by people making their own choices.

Is this the world you visualize?

Shangrala?

Regards,
MG

[MG 2.0]

Why is the LDS patriarchy seeking to hinder the agency of pregnant women in Idaho?

What’s more, IHQ, the Church seems to be attempting to impose its moral standards on people who have never accepted its religious authority in the first place. While there are additional historical contributors to the situation, that approach didn’t end well in Missouri.

It's not rocket science. The church is exercising it's moral authority by exercising it's right as an institution give voice to what it sees as a moral issue.

That's it. It's a free country with free speech rights and freedom of association. Freedom of association allows for the church to have influence on those that freely associate with it and the values that it teaches/promotes.

Whether or not others outside the church agree or disagree with the church's stance is totally up to them. In the end the public, as a whole, and in a majority vote, will have it's way at the ballot box

As it should be.

You exercise your right to free speech. Your own organizations that you belong to can do the same thing. It's actually a wonderful part of our constitutional federal democratic republic.

We have a voice through our representatives and through majority vote. Religious institutions and other organizations should always have the freedom to use their voice and the influence they have through freedom of association to speak out.

Regards,
MG

[MG 2.0]

Unfortunately, some of these freedoms are on the wane in Europe and the UK.

We don't want to go there.

Regards,
MG

[Rivendale]

If someone designs a machine for the general public that randomly kills 20% of the people who use it MG would simply say that is nature running its course. There would be no need for accountability. MG seems to have the perspective that when a pedophile or another person SA's a child or another victim there will be recompense in heaven with the reanimated supreme primate that goes something like this. Hey sweetie pie see that man over there that killed your entire family and graped you? Go over and get to know him I forgave him.

What do you do with 'nature' and human agency/free will? To have it your way wouldn't you have to have a God that sets up a world in which evolution does not take its course? Bacteria and viruses do not mutate... they're all productive and harmless? A world in which accidents of nature cannot happen? A world in which car accidents and other freakish happenings do not occur?

A world without genetic mutation?

Thus, a world magically (because that's what it would take) created in which nothing bad ever happens...and if it did/does, God steps in every time to correct the mishap/problem/disease and bad decisions by people making their own choices.

Is this the world you visualize?

Shangrala?

Regards,
MG

God intentionally created world where gratuitous suffering must happen. Could he not have done it differently? What does human free will have to do with natural disasters that unalive hundreds of thousands of people? Was it necessary for free will to create a planet that randomly executes living beings? Are you seriously saying genetic mutations must have collateral damage in order to operate? How does child bone cancer allow free will to operate?

What parameters regulate when god steps in to interfere? Enforcement of polygamy? God magic is superfluous throughout almost all religious traditions making your critique of evolutionary magic insipid. Your defense of POE is also insipid.

[MG 2.0]

What do you do with 'nature' and human agency/free will? To have it your way wouldn't you have to have a God that sets up a world in which evolution does not take its course? Bacteria and viruses do not mutate... they're all productive and harmless? A world in which accidents of nature cannot happen? A world in which car accidents and other freakish happenings do not occur?

A world without genetic mutation?

Thus, a world magically (because that's what it would take) created in which nothing bad ever happens...and if it did/does, God steps in every time to correct the mishap/problem/disease and bad decisions by people making their own choices.

Is this the world you visualize?

Shangrala?

Regards,
MG

God intentionally created world where gratuitous suffering must happen. Could he not have done it differently?

Open to ideas. Best go into detail on evolutionary biology and plate tectonics.

Regards,
MG

[MG 2.0]

...your critique of evolutionary magic insipid. Your defense of POE is also insipid.

I will, as a favor, not call any of your ideas in response to my previous post "insipid".

I'm hoping you will go into some detail on how it would all 'work'.

Regards,
MG