Well said. In my family, I was designated by my father, early on, as the "brainy" one. He was big into labels. He bragged to anyone and everyone about his smart daughter for years. And then, his smart daughter used her brain to leave the LDS church. The insult that generated, at least in his mind, was intolerable. As a parent myself, I don't understand AT ALL a father turning on his child the way mine did, but clearly he valued being the father of a smart daughter who validated his choices by staying in the LDS church, more than the actual daughter. The 'feeling good' part was only there if I stayed LDS, hence the shunning, as you noted. Sadly.
Up front, in no way am I saying I’m in anyone’s league here intellectually, not even close - I’m an idiot, but I can relate! My dad used to say things like, “You’re too smart for your own good.” Or, “Your brain is going to get you into trouble some day.” And, “You need to think less.”
It was like he thought I was going to think myself out of the Church, and to his credit I did. What a shame for both of us that he didn’t take the time to nurture that quality he saw in me. A little love and mentoring might’ve benefited both of us, but instead he let his fear of us leaving his church destroy his relationship with us. Too bad. He missed out on a lot of good times.
- Doc
Couldn't agree more. That's what is so bizarre--in a church that preaches family, family, family, they really mean only family that doesn't rock the boat.
"…I dreamed last night I got on the boat to heaven...
For the people all said
"Beware you're on a heavenly trip"
The people all said
"Beware, beware you'll scuttle the ship
And the devil will drag you under
By the fancy tie 'round your wicked throat
Sit down, sit down, sit down, sit down
Sit down you're rockin' the boat"
… And as I laughed at those passengers to heaven
A great big wave came and washed me overboard
And as I sank, and I hollered, "Someone save me"
That's the moment I woke up, thank the Lord."
IHAQ wrote:How can my conviction of the Church be strengthened simply by hearing other people talk about their conviction, founded on their perspectives about things? That’s the process by which MLM’s and Affinity Frauds function - feel good about this product/scheme because I feel good about it. Testimony Meeting is the same as an MLM party. An echo chamber.
I agree to a point; MLMs work great in Mormon culture for that reason. But I can give some credit to MLMs and pyramid schemes. If I'm in an MLM, there's a huge benefit to testimonials and nobody questioning. As long as the MLM can expand, people can actually make money. It gets harder and harder, and some never will make money, but the reality is that everyone in an MLM has a hope that maybe they will be the one. And if they work hard enough, they can be the one. Lots of dumb people have made good money in MLMs. There is no such hope within the Church. Nobody benefits. Only people who fall within cluster B personality disorders benefit to the degree that they wield power or obtain social notoriety in leadership positions. There are further benefits likely at the top of the chain and being among the royal families. The average member has no hope, it would be way better for them to join Amway instead.
So there's more of an incentive in an MLM to actually feel good about the product. In Mormonism, there is more of an incentive to lie, and say you feel good about the product. That is, for people who aren't cluster B. This is why I don't think testimonies are that much about feelings and I'm skeptical of people who say they've had tremendous spiritual experiences.
Social distancing has likely already begun to flatten the curve...Continue to research good antivirals and vaccine candidates. Make everyone wear masks. -- J.D. Vance
I note that your additional sources are also not independent...
Nor are they factually based, scientifically accurate, or realistic. That site promotes drivel. But, having mg send lurkers there will certainly have an effect. Not the one he is hoping for, however.
You get your information from COINTELPRO and are saying something isn't scientifically accurate?
Nor are they factually based, scientifically accurate, or realistic. That site promotes drivel. But, having mg send lurkers there will certainly have an effect. Not the one he is hoping for, however.
You get your information from COINTELPRO and are saying something isn't scientifically accurate?
Yes Marcus please get your information from a reliable source like QAnon or Catturd on a reliable site like Elon Musk’s X (formerly branded less successfully as Twitter).
Having mentalgymnast send messages to lurkers is helping them more than he realizes. He is so disingenuous and so frequently dishonest that I am sure they are getting quite the picture of what it takes to believe in something like the LDS church claims.
I guess we’ll never know. It’s kind of like when out on a mission and teaching first discussions a million times. You never know as to whether you might have planted a seed and folks will ‘study it out’ later and be converted to the gospel.
Lurkers...don't listen to them. More information is always better than less. Be patient. Search. Seek. Find. Faith comes through feasting on the words of Christ. Don't leave the scriptures to collect dust. Pick them up and read them even when you're going through tough stuff in regards to faith issues.
And continue to pray and have faith that God exists and is interested in your welfare and wants the best for you.
He will help you sort things out.
Regards,
MG
Or do your research properly, across a variety of sources, not just the ones that have a vested interest in one side of the story, and recognise that doubts are your subconscious telling you that you know something ain’t right.
And of course it can go the other way. People become converted to the Gospel of Jesus Christ and their lives change for the better.
Having mentalgymnast send messages to lurkers is helping them more than he realizes. He is so disingenuous and so frequently dishonest that I am sure they are getting quite the picture of what it takes to believe in something like the LDS church claims.
I guess we’ll never know. It’s kind of like when out on a mission and teaching first discussions a million times. You never know as to whether you might have planted a seed and folks will ‘study it out’ later and be converted to the gospel.
Regards,
MG
No, how you post is pretty obvious upfront, and you're quite consistent. But it's pretty funny that you think intellectual dishonesty and disingenuousness 'sow seeds' that lurkers can use later.
I guess we’ll never know. It’s kind of like when out on a mission and teaching first discussions a million times. You never know as to whether you might have planted a seed and folks will ‘study it out’ later and be converted to the gospel.
Regards,
MG
No, how you post is pretty obvious upfront, and you're quite consistent. But it's pretty funny that you think intellectual dishonesty and disingenuousness 'sow seeds' that lurkers can use later.
Marcus, I suppose that the grudge you have against me will always be there and come through in your responses to me. I’m willing to let all that has come before be as water under the bridge. I realize that sometimes it’s difficult to let go of things.
But when you go on and on about one little thing or another simply trying to derail a discussion and take it into an ‘all about MG’ thread it’s not fair to the rest of the posters.
