Ex-Mormons Shut up and Sing

[_Runtu]

I think the most compassionate thing to do on this board is to politely ignore or engage Smart Bitch in dialogue.

Why? I think she is quite representative of the level of education, study, intellect, morals and ethics of most of the posters on this Board. I admire her continued participation.

I can only assume that you include yourself among those whom she represents.

[_desert_vulture]

I think the most compassionate thing to do on this board is to politely ignore or engage Smart Bitch in dialogue.

Why? I think she is quite representative of the level of education, study, intellect, morals and ethics of most of the posters on this Board. I admire her continued participation.

I can only assume that you include yourself among those whom she represents.

Am I included in the group? Is there no help for the widow's son?

[_OUT OF MY MISERY]

I think the most compassionate thing to do on this board is to politely ignore or engage Smart Bitch in dialogue.

Why? I think she is quite representative of the level of education, study, intellect, morals and ethics of most of the posters on this Board. I admire her continued participation.

I can only assume that you include yourself among those whom she represents.

Am I included in the group? Is there no help for the widow's son?

Well yes I will engage you in discussions and I love your avatar.....Is this from the Mummy returns???

[_beastie]

Wade,

This is incredibly obtuse, even for you.

Wade states that:

Whether it suggest that their story can't be trusted or not (no reasonable person would believe that it does), this does not invalidated the "experiences and feelings of lots of exMormons because they won't shut up" any more or less than you have invalidated Juliann's experiences and feelings about those ex-Mormons by falsely asserting she "misuses sources" and thus can't be trusted. You want her to shut up about "apostates".

Honestly, what is WRONG with your comprehension? You say it isn't your disability, but good grief, what IS it?

How can anyone read:

Deconversion stories are carefully crafted by those who need admittance into another group (whether it be a religion or the internet).

An exie that is aligning with anti-Mormons can't stay with a message of peace and love toward all. So the exit story has to morph into what the group demands. That is why they are so formulaic.

As the person seeks acceptance with a new group, they will have to tailor their exit tale to be acceptable to that group.

and then, with a straight face, claim that no reasonable person could believe these statements mean that this means the story cannot be trusted?????



There is something wrong with your reading comprehension.

Carefully crafted, morph into, tailor the exit tale, all these words mean that the exiter is making things up in order to be accepted into the new group.

If I stated that testimonies that LDS give in testimony meeting have been "carefully crafted and morph into a tale that includes a clear revelatory response from God in order to be accepted into the new group", would you really think I wasn't saying "you can't trust their testimonies as reliable?"

Note: this does NOT deal with whether or not the "tailoring" is deliberate or an unconscious response to social pressure.

Now, the second mind blowing statement you make is this:

you have invalidated Juliann's experiences and feelings about those ex-Mormons by falsely asserting she "misuses sources" and thus can't be trusted. You want her to shut up about "apostates".

What are you talking about????

This conversation was NEVER about "Juliann's experiences and feelings about exmormons". Not even SHE would claim that is what it is about. It is about a sociological definition of "apostate" and the model it is embedded within.

I understand you will never, never, admit that she misused her sources. That is a different disagreement. But the THEORY that she has constructed is that the stories exmormon apostates tell are not reliable and cannot be trusted. That means these same stories have been invalidated from the get-go.

And the reason this equates "shut up and sing" is that the ONLY difference between what she now calls a "leave taker" and an apostate is that the "leave taker" shuts up and doesn't talk about it.

(reminder to self: you have only yourself to blame. you have had plenty of experiences in the past with Wade, and you KNOW this is how these conversations always go. Black is white. Up is down. Words no longer mean what they have always meant.)

[_Ray A]

Ex-Mormons are encouraged to Shut up and Sing

If this really is the case, why are there so many ex-Mormons posting on FAIR? Why are there so many critics on FAIR?

[_Runtu]

Ex-Mormons are encouraged to Shut up and Sing

If this really is the case, why are there so many ex-Mormons posting on FAIR? Why are there so many critics on FAIR?

Just because we're encouraged to shut up doesn't mean we actually do. :-)

[_Ray A]

Just because we're encouraged to shut up doesn't mean we actually do. :-)

You posted on FAIR. Were you told to "shut up"? Or were you banned? I don't know, you tell me.

[_Runtu]

Just because we're encouraged to shut up doesn't mean we actually do. :-)

You posted on FAIR. Were you told to "shut up"? Or were you banned? I don't know, you tell me.

Nope, I was not banned from FAIR. What does that have to do with anything?

I've been told many times to suppress my "unhealthy" feelings toward the church.

[_beastie]

Ray,

The difference between a benign "leave taker" and an "apostate" (whose narrative is carefully crafted and morphs into what the new group wants) is only that the "apostate" speaks up. The "leave taker" does not.

I specifically addressed this point on those FAIR threads. I used the example of my sister, who is an atheist like me, and has the same opinions regarding the truth claims of the church as I do. But she doesn't talk about it with anyone aside from a couple of family members like me. So because she goes quietly and is never heard from again, she's an ok "leave taker". Because I talk about it, I would be an "apostate".

This is how the message to "shut up" is conveyed. If you "shut up", you can avoided being labeled and described in pejorative terms. If you don't shut up, then your narrative is crafted, morphing, tailored, and you have created an "entire new identity" based on opposing the church.

Of course this doesn't work on exmormons, for the most part. But it still reveals something about the thought processes of the believers making these sort of statements.

[_Ray A]

Nope, I was not banned from FAIR. What does that have to do with anything?

I've been told many times to suppress my "unhealthy" feelings toward the church.

If you want to criticise someone, or their beliefs, sarcasm or cynicism is not the way to do it. If you were sarcastic or cynical (I don't know), then that might have been the cause of the reproof. This is what you people just don't get (not referring to you specifically, because I don't know your circumstances), if you go on "Mormon Territory", you can't expect to get away with crass criticisms. That is all they are saying, you can be critical, but do not mock us.