How Much do the GAs Make?

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_Mister Scratch
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How Much do the GAs Make?

Post by _Mister Scratch »

Recently, there have been a series of threads examining Church finances, discussing whether the SLC mall was paid for using tithing funds, whether the Church is pennypinching by having janitorial work as a "calling." Further, on a Celestial Forum thread, I noted that I thought I'd heard somewhere that the GAs receive a stipend somewhere in the neighborhood of $70,000. I was informed that I was off somewhat.

Anyways, a poster over at RfM called "Flew the Coop" has recently been posting some intriguing information on this subject. Apparently, the men at the top of the hierarchy receive a whopping $600,000 per year! This on top of whatever earnings they pull in from book sales, etc. Anyways, here is one of "Flew the Coop'"s posts:

Flew the Coop wrote:
leaving the morg wrote:I was told from a friend who had a friend who worked in the finance department up until a couple of years ago that the first pres. and 12 were at that time paid 600K a year and that the 70 were paid about 120K. Can you confirm this?


Your figures are approximately right for the mid- nineties and reflect changes that Hinckley made when he first became president.I have to believe it is significantly more now. In addition, in the mid-ninety the members of the First Presidency each had unlimited, unaudited charge cards. Hinckley lived in a million dollar condo with servants all provided by Church funds. Earlier in his life under conservative presidents, I understand that he lived in a more modest home on the East side somewhere. GA's have significant other benefits like the vacation retreat owned by the Church down by ST. George, free tuition in Church colleges for their families, world-wide travel pretty much any time they want.

The seventies are paid differently according to their time and connections with the First Presidency. There are token seventies who are not from elite families(non-americans mostly) who will never progress to an apostle. The second quorum is a testing ground where their loyalty and ability to keep secrets and PR acumen are tested.

Also, there are other significant benefits that have to do with the businesses that the Church owns. This is not only the obvious radio,TV,newspapers, cattle ranches, farms, grain elevators, etc. that everyone should know about, but other business that the Church owns partnership in.
Church employment is not bad like some would report. When

To give you an idea of Church middle management. I left in the mid-nineties, I was a 28 level under their then current personnel system. I earned about 100,000 per year with benefits including pension. I could travel pretty much anywhere world-wide with little justification. They did watch your temple recommend closely and were very picky about vacation and sick days. You felt like a child sometimes. It was able to land work on the outside that paid more but I had to work a lot harder to get it.


The thing about the "unaudited charge card" would seem to confirm Dr. Shades' remarks about the credit card on the Celestial Forum. In any case, while a bit of skepticism is surely healthy, if this is true, it ought to lay to rest the frankly absurd claims from TBMs that the GAs receive "modest" compensation.
_harmony
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Post by _harmony »

Holy Moly! No wonder they won't open the books!
_guy sajer
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Post by _guy sajer »

harmony wrote:Holy Moly! No wonder they won't open the books!


Why do we need financial transparency when we have faith? If so and so, such as my father-in-law, says that the Bretheren are good men and he has faith that they are good stewards over the tens of millions of dollars the Church rakes in by way of tithes, fast offerings, and donations, well by golly and gee whiz, that's good enough for me.
God . . . "who mouths morals to other people and has none himself; who frowns upon crimes, yet commits them all; who created man without invitation, . . . and finally, with altogether divine obtuseness, invites this poor, abused slave to worship him ..."
_harmony
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Post by _harmony »

guy sajer wrote:
harmony wrote:Holy Moly! No wonder they won't open the books!


Why do we need financial transparency when we have faith? If so and so, such as my father-in-law, says that the Bretheren are good men and he has faith that they are good stewards over the tens of millions of dollars the Church rakes in by way of tithes, fast offerings, and donations, well by golly and gee whiz, that's good enough for me.


It's good enough for most LDS. It's just not good enough for me.
_Bond...James Bond
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Post by _Bond...James Bond »

guy sajer wrote:
harmony wrote:Holy Moly! No wonder they won't open the books!


Why do we need financial transparency when we have faith? If so and so, such as my father-in-law, says that the Bretheren are good men and he has faith that they are good stewards over the tens of millions of dollars the Church rakes in by way of tithes, fast offerings, and donations, well by golly and gee whiz, that's good enough for me.


(my emphasis)

Isn't that stewardship over tens of billions of dollars?

I personally don't care how much faith a person shows, I wouldn't trust many people with that much money if there's no outside group watchdogging the whole operation.
"Whatever appears to be against the Book of Mormon is going to be overturned at some time in the future. So we can be pretty open minded."-charity 3/7/07
_OUT OF MY MISERY
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Post by _OUT OF MY MISERY »

harmony wrote:Holy Moly! No wonder they won't open the books!


Harmony
forget the bar you and I are going to become GA's...are you with me.....Wait just a minute we are lacking something a penis.....but for that kind of money I would think about it especially that credit card....Wait I could just pretend to be a man...cause there is no power of dosernment .........so Harmony want to go to Paris and bring the family...cause I will bring mine.....Everyone is invited by the way...I have the CREDIT CARD...
When I wake up I will be hungry....but this feels so good right now aaahhhhhh........
_Jason Bourne
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Post by _Jason Bourne »

well interesting but all here say and speculation.

by the way, if the FO and Twelve make 600k a year it would not bug me int the least.

But I think they should disclose it.

But having read numerous bios of many top leaders and knowing, at least according to the BIOs, how modestly they live, I doubt they make this much. SWK lived in a very modest home on the east side of the Salt Lake Valley until he was not able to care for himself. They then moved him into the Hotel Utah. GBH's home in the Millcreek area till he was President was very small and its growth was all added on by him building it himself.

Study thier lives and it does not look like they live all that extravegent.
_harmony
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Post by _harmony »

Jason Bourne wrote:well interesting but all here say and speculation.

by the way, if the FO and Twelve make 600k a year it would not bug me int the least.

But I think they should disclose it.

But having read numerous bios of many top leaders and knowing, at least according to the BIOs, how modestly they live, I doubt they make this much. SWK lived in a very modest home on the east side of the Salt Lake Valley until he was not able to care for himself. They then moved him into the Hotel Utah. GBH's home in the Millcreek area till he was President was very small and its growth was all added on by him building it himself.

Study thier lives and it does not look like they live all that extravegent.


We have a different concept of extravagent, Jason. And trustworthy, obviously. Perhaps you missed the part of the thread that said this changed when Pres Hinckley became prophet, so SWK's situation has no bearing on this discussion. Or maybe you just skipped over that part, because it hurts you to think that our prophet may not have clean hands. I don't give my 10% so someone perfectly able to take care of themselves can sup at the church's trough. With no oversight and no accountability, there is no trust. If they don't disclose (and they don't), then trust is impossible.
_Jason Bourne
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Post by _Jason Bourne »

harmony wrote:We have a different concept of extravagent, Jason. And trustworthy, obviously. Perhaps you missed the part of the thread that said this changed when Pres Hinckley became prophet, so SWK's situation has no bearing on this discussion. Or maybe you just skipped over that part, because it hurts you to think that our prophet may not have clean hands. I don't give my 10% so someone perfectly able to take care of themselves can sup at the church's trough. With no oversight and no accountability, there is no trust. If they don't disclose (and they don't), then trust is impossible.


I may have missed that part. But I have no problem with the Church president living in an expenive condo. He is high profile, security is an issue etc. Besides that value may be more a factor of rising property values then what the Church may have paid for it initially. But maybe not.

So, for a full time leaderhip role in the Church what do you think a leader should be paid? I am for a paid ministry-Bishops and SPs at at least. What would you pay them?

But we are on the same page Harmony. I am for open books, accountability, all that. Very much so.
_harmony
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Post by _harmony »

Jason Bourne wrote:I may have missed that part. But I have no problem with the Church president living in an expenive condo. He is high profile, security is an issue etc. Besides that value may be more a factor of rising property values then what the Church may have paid for it initially. But maybe not.

So, for a full time leaderhip role in the Church what do you think a leader should be paid? I am for a paid ministry-Bishops and SPs at at least. What would you pay them?

But we are on the same page Harmony. I am for open books, accountability, all that. Very much so.


Pres Hinckley's living quarters is not a concern to me. I think maid service and security guards are also appropriate. But a $600,000 salary on top of that? That's excessive (and I don't much care about other overpaid, bloated salaries for CEO's of multi-billion dollar corporations. This is a church, not a business. This is God's money, not Pres Hinckley's. And I think CEO salaries are currently obscene and a disgrace, and it shames me that my prophet has joined them).

Cash or the whole package?

I'd say in the neighborhood of $250,000 for a GA, $125,000 for a 70. And take away the unlimited unaudited credit card. Replace it with the same credit card any responsible executive has.
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