juliann's Paranoia Erupts in Anger

[_Bond...James Bond]

Bond, how about an inner dialogue of Juliann wrestling with whether she is an internet or chapel Mormon?

It's on the list.

[_Runtu]

Bond, how about an inner dialogue of Juliann wrestling with whether she is an internet or chapel Mormon?

It's on the list.

Sometimes I wonder if some of the "angrier" critics over there are sockpuppets for the pseudoacademics who espouse certain theories about such apostates. If you think about it, you can't have a theory about "angry exies" unless there actually are some. I've always suspected that the more virulent folks on RfM (such as the "would you have killed Joseph Smith" guy) are trolls.

[_Bond...James Bond]

Bond, how about an inner dialogue of Juliann wrestling with whether she is an internet or chapel Mormon?

It's on the list.

Sometimes I wonder if some of the "angrier" critics over there are sockpuppets for the pseudoacademics who espouse certain theories about such apostates. If you think about it, you can't have a theory about "angry exies" unless there actually are some. I've always suspected that the more virulent folks on RfM (such as the "would you have killed Joseph Smith" guy) are trolls.

It wouldn't suprise me considering RfM allows people to post without registering or logging in (by the way: I think a whole thread could be dedicated to the outdated message board setup at RfM, which allows anonymous posting, but I digress). I don't really read RfM though so I don't know what's going on over there much.

[_Runtu]

It wouldn't suprise me considering RfM allows people to post without registering or logging in (by the way: I think a whole thread could be dedicated to the outdated message board setup at RfM, which allows anonymous posting, but I digress). I don't really read RfM though so I don't know what's going on over there much.

I think it's important over there for people to be able to post anonymously, but it does invite a lot of abuse, and I'm sure it's abused regularly. I've heard it said that at least a few believers from MA&D have posted over there.

I've pretty much stopped going to RfM. For a while it was very helpful in letting me know I wasn't alone. And later on, it was a good place for me to feel like I was helping people who were still in shock. But I don't really have anything to add there anymore, and the negativity does get to one. Of course, I'd probably be saying the same thing about MA&D if they hadn't banned me. :-)

[_Dr. Shades]

Wow.... Who knew that the label of "Internet Mormons" would summon up such ire from juliann? Well done, Shades!

Thanks! What's all the more baffling is that she repeatedly accuses me of plagiarizing from some old Sunstone article about "Liahona" vs. "Iron Rod" Mormons. The thing is, A) I'd never heard of that particular article until she started bringing it up, and B) the Liahona/Iron Rod paradigm refers only to the amount of "wiggle room" various Mormons allow themselves. Unlike the Internet Mormon/Chapel Mormon concept, it does not refer to the widely different doctrines espoused by each group.

Wow.... Who knew that the label of "Internet Mormons" would summon up such ire from juliann? Well done, Shades!

What is bizarre is that this same idea has been repeatedly expressed by believing Mormons, just using different terminology. Juliann is well aware of this. I've seen citations from LDS blogs or boards proving it on threads on which she has participated.

I've noticed that too, and it never ceases to amaze me. It's as though a glass of orange juice tastes wonderful when it's handed to you by a fellow-Mormon, but tastes terrible when it's handed to you by an ex-Mormon, even though both glassfuls were poured out of the same container!

I think they detest the term because there is more than a grain of truth therein.

The reason Juliann detests the whole concept is because she didn't think of it first.

Good observations, beastie & harmony!

[_Runtu]

I'll say it again that I acted offended and ripped on you, Shades, when I first heard your theory, but as I reflected on it, I thought you were absolutely right. At least one believer on FAIR agreed with you way back when.

I guess I went so far out of the chapel that I'm not even in the church anymore.

[_Blixa]

I've found the internet/chapel concept to be very helpful.

When I first started thinking about Mormonism again (after a good 30 years or so of it not crossing my mind much at all), I was surprised at how much had changed--for the worse. Of course there was still much I recognized, but also a lot of very strange and unbelievably, uh, "unorthodox," stuff I kept running across on the F-boards. I didn't know how to begin to explain what that was all about.

I think it was beastie, under another name and on another board, who introduced me to the Shadian Paradigm and that gave me a lens that brought much into sharper focus.

[_Gazelam]

I don't find the Internet vs. Chapel Mormon arguement to be the same as the old Iron Rod vs. Liahona Mormon arguement.

Liahonas are those who exist on the Old Mormon feelgood stories as opposed to education gained through scripture study and prayer (Iron rodders = "The iron rod is the word of God") Liahonas are those who are tossed to and fro by every wind of doctrine. No foundation gained through true and faithful study.

Internet Mormons, as I understand the term, are those who are not afraid to ask hard questions regarding their faith and can look at it with a critical eye. Chapel Mormons are those (as I understand the term) who refuse to bend to any question regarding their faith. The church is the church and it is not to be questioned.

My understanding is that a real member of the church is an Iron rodder. And I believe that an Iron rodder can contain elements of both an internet and a chapel Mormon.

Heres the Iron Rod talk:http://www.zionsbest.com/people.html

And here is a rebuttal by Harold B. Lee:http://www.zionsbest.com/ironrod.html

[_beastie]

I think it was beastie, under another name and on another board, who introduced me to the Shadian Paradigm and that gave me a lens that brought much into sharper focus.

I bet I know who you are!

[_Fortigurn]

I've found the internet/chapel concept to be very helpful.

When I first started thinking about Mormonism again (after a good 30 years or so of it not crossing my mind much at all), I was surprised at how much had changed--for the worse. Of course there was still much I recognized, but also a lot of very strange and unbelievably, uh, "unorthodox," stuff I kept running across on the F-boards. I didn't know how to begin to explain what that was all about.

I think it was beastie, under another name and on another board, who introduced me to the Shadian Paradigm and that gave me a lens that brought much into sharper focus.

It's an excellent distinction, and makes a lot of sense of people's conflicting experiences with Mormons. Even better, it will be found to apply to most (if not all), Christian denominations guided by an allegedly infallible, prophetic, or 'Spirit-led' leadership. I have found it the key to understanding Catholics, JWs, and SDAs, all of whom exhibit the same division among their members.