Sure, Faithful Parents Save Wayward Children.. no problem.

[_Gazelam]

Come to think of it, Cain (or bigfoot) will be another one of those celestial surprises.

Not to highjack this thread, but I've heard this before, anyone have any idea where this rumor got started? Cain being Bigfoot?

[_Gazelam]

I think the idea is that parents teachings will carry on in their children as they relate things in their lives as thewe grow older.

This flys in the face of the doctrine that those who reject the greater knowledge (Laman & Lemuel for instance) are subject to a proportional condemnation (a curse of dark skin along with being shouldered with the culpability of all their posterity's sins). But it might make for sinless grandchildren, sortof.

Joseph Smith is not just talking about the living, but children that have passed on as well.



Nehor,

If those are the only cards you're holding, let it ride man.

I only meant to say that faithful parents plant seeds in the hearts of their children by ensureing their children are taught the gospel. And yes this does condemn the children if they rebel against the teaching as Laman and Lemuel did. If a person knows a principle is true and then rebels against it, it condemns them.

Non members who have never heard a gospel teaching ,but know a principle is true but live against it, are equally guilty.

[_Inconceivable]

Come to think of it, Cain (or bigfoot) will be another one of those celestial surprises.

Not to highjack this thread, but I've heard this before, anyone have any idea where this rumor got started? Cain being Bigfoot?

It's cool, Gaz, not a hijack at all.


I happen to know bigfoot personally (he's a fishing buddy). On one occasion I pinned him down with that very question. After shaking his head and letting out a big sigh he muttered that not only was he Cain but his dad was actually God (according to a conversation that he had with Brigham Young a number of years before). He also said that Brigham was emphatic that he would be saved because of his dad's (God's) righteousness. After giving bigfoot my opinion of Brigham Young's personal character, he concurred that the word of a Spaniard had more credibility than his. After that we just sat there and thought about it and lit another stick of dynamite. The subject that's he's really touchy about is how bad he smells. I'm figuring it's more part of the curse than he lets on.

[_Inconceivable]

I only meant to say that faithful parents plant seeds in the hearts of their children by ensureing their children are taught the gospel. And yes this does condemn the children if they rebel against the teaching as Laman and Lemuel did. If a person knows a principle is true and then rebels against it, it condemns them.

Non members who have never heard a gospel teaching ,but know a principle is true but live against it, are equally guilty.

Church of Gaz,

that is not what the revelation specifically states. If you read carefully, there is no deadline on repentence or even a moritorium for children of righteous Mormon parents. In fact, since time is only measured to man, I may be pestered for eternity to cave into believing Joseph Smith is a prophet.

If you're more inclined to believe that James E. Faust is a liar or just a misled special witness and apostle of the Lord Jesus Christ you have every right to feel that way. I've been tempted with that thought as well.

[_Inconceivable]

I'll add my perspective on this...

It's a complete pile of absolute and utter crock, with not very nice implications.

I can handle that 'God' is a nepotist. But if 'God' is a nepotist then he/she/it INCLUDES ALL of his/her/its children... From the pygmy tribes to the aborigine, the maori, the chinese, the arabs, and the west. We are all a human family, and he loves us all EQUALLY...

In my opinion.

Miss Taken,

Though I am not sure anymore, I would hope that what you are saying is the truth.

My children know in their hearts that my wife and I don't play favorites. You'd think a heavenly parent would have inspired us with this philosophy/conviction by living it as well.

[_The Nehor]

Miss Taken,

Though I am not sure anymore, I would hope that what you are saying is the truth.

My children know in their hearts that my wife and I don't play favorites. You'd think a heavenly parent would have inspired us with this philosophy/conviction by living it as well.

Yes, but would you give the keys to your car to your child who has fascination with running into things? To that child letting the responsible one drive seems like horrible favoritism.

[_Mary]

Nehor said:

Yes, but would you give the keys to your car to your child who has fascination with running into things? To that child letting the responsible one drive seems like horrible favoritism.

Well, I'm trying to understand your point here Nehor?
Are you really suggesting that all non-mormons are irresponsible and want to crash the car?
Which, if you are, just goes to show that Mormonism seems to unconsciously (often) foster an elitist, arrogant and insular mindset in its adherants.

Mary

[_Inconceivable]

Yes, but would you give the keys to your car to your child who has fascination with running into things? To that child letting the responsible one drive seems like horrible favoritism.

I think I understand what you are saying. I guess if I had a child that was a muslim extremist, I'd probably not invite him to go dynamite fishing with with me and bigfoot. Just because some kids require more discipline or even institutionalization does not mean I love them any less.

Perhaps you're confusing favoritism with irresponsible nurturing. I've gotten past my children's shortsightedness as to whether or not they perceive us as being fair.

[_Mary]

Well, I may have misread Nehor's comments!!

Nehor, can you come back and clarify what you meant!!!???

[_The Nehor]

Well, I may have misread Nehor's comments!!

Nehor, can you come back and clarify what you meant!!!???

I'm not suggesting that all non-mormons can't drive. Based on my trip down I-35 earlier I don't think anyone but me can drive. The fascination with running into things was hyperbole.

I'm even extreme enough on Premortality to believe that some people's election was made sure before they were born. Brigham Young taught that having your election made sure means that if approaching circumstances are coming that could break your faith or a temptation that you will succumb to that God will take you as opposed to letting you fall. Yes, that is a euphemism meaning that God will kill you.

To a lesser degree some were promised the Gospel in this life or other gifts/powers. I'm not sure how far to take this. Does this mean that people who are stupid fell short in some way? People who are ugly? People who continually fall ill? I don't know. The parable of the 10 Sons in the D&C is a strong warning against judging these kinds of states based on this criteria. Still, for some it may be true.

God has told me that some of my strengths came from before this life. He has also shared with me that one of my besetting sins came from there as well.

In regards to the Stake President's adulterous son I do not know what to say. Maybe he earned something before he came here. Back when I was a Temple Worker I had long conversations with sealers about the nature and power of the sealing ordinance. I really can't go any further though as much as I would like to.

My rule of thumb when dealing with anything to do with Premortal worthiness or lack thereof is to apply it to ME and ONLY ME. Applying it to anyone else is going in with too few of the factors known.

I hope that answers what you meant to ask, I've had a little trouble following what the question is. If I missed the mark by a mile, please tell me.