PBS Mormons Part 2 Thread

[_Blixa]

I've just skipped through part II and found most of the same things interesting that others have. I enjoyed seeing friends of mine as well as footage of people I find truly reprehensible. I'll leave you to decide for yourselves who goes on what side of that equation.

My favorite parts though---really more than anything else---were two remarks that for me summed up Mormonism:

1) Dallin Oaks's statement that members must NEVER question authorities even when the criticism is true (delivered half-grinningly). There it is folks. And he's not ashamed to admit it.

2) Margaret Toscano's description of Mormon "vicious niceness," as a cover for violence and an enactment of it.

Far more interesting to me, however, has been reading responses by TBMs to the programs on several boards. I'm interested both in the range of responses and also the notes that are hit over and over. Over at MAD its adnominem as usual, with smirking misogyny worth of Lou Midgely in some of the posts.

[_Runtu]

I've just skipped through part II and found most of the same things interesting that others have. I enjoyed seeing friends of mine as well as footage of people I find truly reprehensible. I'll leave you to decide for yourselves who goes on what side of that equation.

My favorite parts though---really more than anything else---were two remarks that for me summed up Mormonism:

1) Dallin Oaks's statement that members must NEVER question authorities even when the criticism is true (delivered half-grinningly). There it is folks. And he's not ashamed to admit it.

2) Margaret Toscano's description of Mormon "vicious niceness," as a cover for violence and an enactment of it.

Far more interesting to me, however, has been reading responses by TBMs to the programs on several boards. I'm interested both in the range of responses and also the notes that are hit over and over. Over at MAD its adnominem as usual, with smirking misogyny worth of Lou Midgely in some of the posts.

I just couldn't bring myself to watch it. I will maybe later. But I will not go over to MAD and read the responses. That's just too much for me today. I'm going to remember "vicious niceness," as it's perfect.

[_Dr. Shades]

Man, the story about the wife dieing in childbirth killed me. It's crap like that that really bugs me about religion. People ignore common sense because they think they've had some type of religious experience telling them to go against it. How people can still rely on 'spiritual promptings' over common sense after experiencing something like that, I'll never understand.

That story pissed me off. Not at the church, but at the utter STUPIDITY of some people! Not to be insensitive, but for God's sake, after all that medical advice they received, what the Hell did they expect OTHER THAN that she'd die?

DUUUUUUH!

But even worse, the part that made me want to reach through the screen and THROTTLE that idiot of a widowed husband was when he said, "If I had to do it all over again, . . . I think. . . well, . . . I'd probably have to reconsider."

What kind of insensitive jerk would allow his wife to die all over again just to bring a kid he'd never met and hadn't even been concieved yet into the world? Kid #8 or whatever it was?

[_Who Knows]

But even worse, the part that made me want to reach through the screen and THROTTLE that idiot of a widowed husband was when he said, "If I had to do it all over again, . . . I think. . . well, . . . I'd probably have to reconsider."

What kind of insensitive jerk would allow his wife to die all over again just to bring a kid he'd never met and hadn't even been concieved yet into the world? Kid #8 or whatever it was?

Well, he was in a no-win situation. If i understood correctly, the kid is still alive. How would you like your dad to say that he wished you were never born?

He lost either way.

[_Who Knows]

That story pissed me off. Not at the church, but at the utter STUPIDITY of some people! Not to be insensitive, but for God's sake, after all that medical advice they received, what the Hell did they expect OTHER THAN that she'd die?

DUUUUUUH!

That was my point. The church drives it into our brains that we can all receive 'personal revelation'. Apparently, they thought they received some personal revelation - god telling them that it was a-ok for them to have another baby.

So what they hell did they expect? I'm sure they expected everything to work out fine.

[_Runtu]

That was my point. The church drives it into our brains that we can all receive 'personal revelation'. Apparently, they thought they received some personal revelation - god telling them that it was a-ok for them to have another baby.

So what they hell did they expect? I'm sure they expected everything to work out fine.

Here's how it seems to work.

1. Someone has a feeling, which they interpret as the spirit telling them to do something.
2. They do it, sure in the promise of its success.

Then one of two things happens:

a. The result is positive, and they feel vindicated in following the spiritual prompting.
b. The result is negative, in which case they are told that "we don't know God's purpose," "it's just a test of your faith," or worse, "you didn't have enough faith or did x, y, or z, so God couldn't bless you."

Either way, there's an out, and the prompting is always right.

[_Dr. Shades]

How would you like your dad to say that he wished you were never born?

Actually, I'm pretty used to it. :-)

[_Rollo Tomasi]

But even worse, the part that made me want to reach through the screen and THROTTLE that idiot of a widowed husband was when he said, "If I had to do it all over again, . . . I think. . . well, . . . I'd probably have to reconsider."

What kind of insensitive jerk would allow his wife to die all over again just to bring a kid he'd never met and hadn't even been concieved yet into the world? Kid #8 or whatever it was?

I really felt for the dude. Obviously he loves kid #8, so to choose in hindsight between his wife and that child would be impossible for anyone, in my opinion. I don't feel I can fault him for anything.

[_Blixa]

That kind of thing was endemic in the ward I grew up in. I knew more than a few women crippled from multiple late births. I always thought my friends's moms were a lot older than mine; it was only later that I realized why they were so prematurely aged.

What was it my seminary teacher told the young men? Never marry a girl unless she answers the question, "How many children do you want?" with "As many as the lord sends."

[_Runtu]

That kind of thing was endemic in the ward I grew up in. I knew more than a few women crippled from multiple late births. I always thought my friends's moms were a lot older than mine; it was only later that I realized why they were so prematurely aged.

What was it my seminary teacher told the young men? Never marry a girl unless she answers the question, "How many children do you want?" with "As many as the lord sends."

Reminds me of something my uncle said about my cousin, who had 2 children in rapid succession: "She said they weren't going to use birth control because Heavenly Father wouldn't send him more children than they could handle. She found out that he'll send you a hell of a lot of children if you let him."