Seven wrote:(Sorry for the silly analogy) I view religion or our choice of belief as a vehicle. We may get to choose our car or have one given to us but who cares what it is as long as it gets us to the right destination? For me that destination isn't making it "home to God" in the LDS sense, but in becoming the best person I can be by serving my fellow brothers and sisters and following my conscience. If in doing this I am becoming like my Savior, then I think I will have made it to my destination. If my car isn't taking me to this place then I need a new one.
My car was a lemon and not what I had purchased so I am shopping around. Haven't decided which car I will drive next.
Gaz, in answer to your question, I agree with Seven.
I think that Abraham would have just as many descendants who remembered him as he does today, however with less war and strife.
Religious fundamentalism comes from forcing beliefs and fear.
Each one has to find his peace from within. And peace to be real must be unaffected by outside circumstances. -Ghandi
GIMR wrote:Where would society be if everyone were encouraged to follow their own spiritual paths, insted of many being conditioned into one at an early age....
GIMR, I know your a faither so when I say this realise that you can't have your cake and eat it too. Dogmatism is inherent in faith and indoctrination starts at a young age in Mormonism and any other faith when given the chance to do so.
Pushing faith on children is how these destructive memes spread.
And crawling on the planet's face Some insects called the human race Lost in time And lost in space...and meaning
GIMR wrote:Where would society be if everyone were encouraged to follow their own spiritual paths, insted of many being conditioned into one at an early age....
GIMR, I know your a faither so when I say this realise that you can't have your cake and eat it too. Dogmatism is inherent in faith and indoctrination starts at a young age in Mormonism and any other faith when given the chance to do so.
Pushing faith on children is how these destructive memes spread.
Dogmatism is inherent in faith simply because insecure humans put it there. Faith does not need to be fear-based. Mine isn't.
I once told someone that I refused to live my life based on someone else's opinion of what would happen to me when I die.
I may be a "faither", but I'm not your average. Still, I am aware that from the community of those who do not adhere to theism of any kind, folks like me look a little crazy. I do not return the sentiment, as two wrongs do not make a right.
Each one has to find his peace from within. And peace to be real must be unaffected by outside circumstances. -Ghandi
GIMR wrote:Where would society be if everyone were encouraged to follow their own spiritual paths, insted of many being conditioned into one at an early age....
GIMR, I know your a faither so when I say this realise that you can't have your cake and eat it too. Dogmatism is inherent in faith and indoctrination starts at a young age in Mormonism and any other faith when given the chance to do so.
Pushing faith on children is how these destructive memes spread.
What other option is there? Adults can hardly believe in a religious tradition and not affect their children. The option of 'letting the children decide' is worse in my experience as a 6 year old really can't make a decision between Hinduism, Mormonism, Scientology, and the Church of the Sixth Cosmic Christ when they are that young.
Unless we have a faithless society I don't see a solution. The same holds true with ethical systems.
"Surely he knows that DCP, The Nehor, Lamanite, and other key apologists..." -Scratch clarifying my status in apologetics "I admit it; I'm a petty, petty man." -Some Schmo
The Nehor wrote:What other option is there? Adults can hardly believe in a religious tradition and not affect their children. The option of 'letting the children decide' is worse in my experience as a 6 year old really can't make a decision between Hinduism, Mormonism, Scientology, and the Church of the Sixth Cosmic Christ when they are that young.
Unless we have a faithless society I don't see a solution. The same holds true with ethical systems.
What about an 8 year old?
WK: "Joseph Smith asserted that the Book of Mormon peoples were the original inhabitants of the americas"
Will Schryver: "No, he didn’t." 3/19/08
Still waiting for Will to back this up...
I don't have kids yet, so I have yet to try my experiment.
I will take my kids to church with me on sunday, but they will most likely go off to Awana (kiddie church), and I and my hubby will go off to service.
I have every right to tell them that the most important thing is being a good person, rather than being a good Christian. And I intend to do just this. That's the problem, people are often concerned with being a good Christian, and their meager ability to interpret what they read (or their laziness in just listening to pastor), creates a situation where they feel they can judge and condemn others.
Not every person who adheres to theism has to be dogmatic. My major is religious studies, I go to a Christian school, but I don't want to stop at my faith. I feel there's a lot of good to be discovered in the various belief systems/philosophies out there, even if the only good comes from understanding what they are. That is my quest, I don't have to tell my kids what to believe.
Where did the whole Age of Accountability thing come from again?
Each one has to find his peace from within. And peace to be real must be unaffected by outside circumstances. -Ghandi
The Nehor wrote:What other option is there? Adults can hardly believe in a religious tradition and not affect their children. The option of 'letting the children decide' is worse in my experience as a 6 year old really can't make a decision between Hinduism, Mormonism, Scientology, and the Church of the Sixth Cosmic Christ when they are that young.
Unless we have a faithless society I don't see a solution. The same holds true with ethical systems.
What about an 8 year old?
An 8 year old can decide if they want to get baptized and get the (vital) Gift of the Holy Ghost. Baptism is fairly easy to recant when you become older if you choose to.
"Surely he knows that DCP, The Nehor, Lamanite, and other key apologists..." -Scratch clarifying my status in apologetics "I admit it; I'm a petty, petty man." -Some Schmo
The Nehor wrote: I had one or I wouldn't have forced myself out of bed at 6 am to drive to the Church building for Seminary.
I hate to say it, but you never had a testimony, you had a perjure... you just didn't know it at the time.
Seven wrote:I view religion or our choice of belief as a vehicle. We may get to choose our car or have one given to us but who cares what it is as long as it gets us to the right destination? For me that destination isn't making it "home to God" in the LDS sense, but in becoming the best person I can be by serving my fellow brothers and sisters and following my conscience. If in doing this I am becoming like my Savior, then I think I will have made it to my destination. If my car isn't taking me to this place then I need a new one.
My car was a lemon and not what I had purchased so I am shopping around. Haven't decided which car I will drive next.
I suggest you walk on your own two feet.
God belief is for people who don't want to live life on the universe's terms.
GIMR wrote:Where would society be if everyone were encouraged to follow their own spiritual paths, insted of many being conditioned into one at an early age....
GIMR, I know your a faither so when I say this realise that you can't have your cake and eat it too. Dogmatism is inherent in faith and indoctrination starts at a young age in Mormonism and any other faith when given the chance to do so.
Pushing faith on children is how these destructive memes spread.
What other option is there? Adults can hardly believe in a religious tradition and not affect their children. The option of 'letting the children decide' is worse in my experience as a 6 year old really can't make a decision between Hinduism, Mormonism, Scientology, and the Church of the Sixth Cosmic Christ when they are that young.
Unless we have a faithless society I don't see a solution. The same holds true with ethical systems.
How about teaching your kids to think for themselves, and use reason and evidence to decide what to do? Outrageous, I know.
My 6 y/o daughter knows I don't believe in any gods, but I insist on telling her that's just what I believe, and it's up to her to think about this issue over the course of her lifetime and make her own decision on it. She tells me she doesn't believe in god, and I point out that she likely believes that because it's what I believe, and that's OK (I mean, she is only six, after all), but eventually, she'll need to justify that belief for herself.
I also teach her that being good to other people is its own reward. There doesn't have to be any eternal consequences involved. It's just common sense. Life is easier when you treat others the way you want to be treated. End of story.
God belief is for people who don't want to live life on the universe's terms.
Some Schmo wrote:How about teaching your kids to think for themselves, and use reason and evidence to decide what to do? Outrageous, I know.
My 6 y/o daughter knows I don't believe in any gods, but I insist on telling her that's just what I believe, and it's up to her to think about this issue over the course of her lifetime and make her own decision on it. She tells me she doesn't believe in god, and I point out that she likely believes that because it's what I believe, and that's OK (I mean, she is only six, after all), but eventually, she'll need to justify that belief for herself.
I also teach her that being good to other people is its own reward. There doesn't have to be any eternal consequences involved. It's just common sense. Life is easier when you treat others the way you want to be treated. End of story.