The Nehor wrote:No, I think it posits that because the LDS believe that Homosexual conduct is a sin that the logical consequence of that belief is that we will become Reverend Phelps. Moksha's last sentence connects LDS belief with an anti-homosexual agenda gone haywire.
So there are good anti-homosexual agendas and bad anti-homosexual agendas?
I wasn't making a moral statement. I was saying that assuming that one belief automatically leads to that extreme is a faulty assumption.
My hope was that the LDS people could take a look at what Phelps is doing and come away with a big question mark as to whether lobbying against the rights of Homosexuals is a kind and loving thing for our religion to be doing. What Phelps is doing by exhibiting such unabashed hatred, seems to me to be antithetical to Christianity.
The Nehor wrote:No, I think it posits that because the LDS believe that Homosexual conduct is a sin that the logical consequence of that belief is that we will become Reverend Phelps. Moksha's last sentence connects LDS belief with an anti-homosexual agenda gone haywire.
So there are good anti-homosexual agendas and bad anti-homosexual agendas?
I wasn't making a moral statement. I was saying that assuming that one belief automatically leads to that extreme is a faulty assumption.
My hope was that the LDS people could take a look at what Phelps is doing and come away with a big question mark as to whether lobbying against the rights of Homosexuals is a kind and loving thing for our religion to be doing. What Phelps is doing by exhibiting such unabashed hatred, seems to me to be antithetical to Christianity.
What has to be stood against is the wave of modern social thinking that says homosexuality is perfectly normal and ok. The screwed up way of thinking that justifies that type of behavior has to be stood up to.
wrong is wrong, even if everyone thinks its right.
We can easily forgive a child who is afraid of the dark; the real tragedy of life is when men are afraid of the light. - Plato
I'm sorry you feel that way, Gaz. I can't see any justification for that outside of religious strictures that not everyone believes in.
But to take this back to the topic of the thread, I don't know whether I see Phelps as the foot of a slippery slope of "christian" homophobia, or something entirely sui generis. I'm inclined to go with the latter since nobody but nobody has also gone the route of picketing the funerals of soldiers killed in Iraq as some kind of protest against homosexuality.
It's disgusting to think there could be people low enough to picket the funerals of homosexuals (including those murdered by homophobes) or funerals of non-homosexuals who died from aids, but Phelps has gone far, far beyond even these contemptible actions. For him its as if everything the currently exists is defined by or connected to homosexuality: a completely homocentric world view!
From the Ernest L. Wilkinson Diaries: "ELW dreams he's spattered w/ grease. Hundreds steal his greasy pants."
Blixa wrote:I'm sorry you feel that way, Gaz. I can't see any justification for that outside of religious strictures that not everyone believes in.
But to take this back to the topic of the thread, I don't know whether I see Phelps as the foot of a slippery slope of "christian" homophobia, or something entirely sui generis. I'm inclined to go with the latter since nobody but nobody has also gone the route of picketing the funerals of soldiers killed in Iraq as some kind of protest against homosexuality.
It's disgusting to think there could be people low enough to picket the funerals of homosexuals (including those murdered by homophobes) or funerals of non-homosexuals who died from aids, but Phelps has gone far, far beyond even these contemptible actions. For him its as if everything the currently exists is defined by or connected to homosexuality: a completely homocentric world view!
I'm going to coin a new phrase now. Fred Phelps is an example of Tabloid Christianity.
Get it?
Jersey Girl
Failure is not falling down but refusing to get up.
Chinese Proverb
Jersey Girl, I really like that. Phelps is an example of Tabloid Christianity.
Mormonism ceased being a compelling topic for me when I finally came to terms with its transformation from a personality cult into a combination of a real estate company, a SuperPac, and Westboro Baptist Church. - Kishkumen
By the way, Phelps has a way of uniting people. That's not too hard, since he's so far out on the fringe that virtually everyone in the country is on the same side compared to him.
Isn't it interesting that all the TBMs and all the critics are suddenly united on MAD in condemning Phelps? It's more than that, though. You get the likes of Falwell's supporters and gay rights advocates united in condemning Phelps. Isn't that remarkable? This guy can single-handedly bring America together by being so f*cked up in his world-view that every other American agrees with each other in condemning and abhoring him.
Interesting isn't it?
Mormonism ceased being a compelling topic for me when I finally came to terms with its transformation from a personality cult into a combination of a real estate company, a SuperPac, and Westboro Baptist Church. - Kishkumen
The Nehor wrote:No, I think it posits that because the LDS believe that Homosexual conduct is a sin that the logical consequence of that belief is that we will become Reverend Phelps. Moksha's last sentence connects LDS belief with an anti-homosexual agenda gone haywire.
So there are good anti-homosexual agendas and bad anti-homosexual agendas?
I wasn't making a moral statement. I was saying that assuming that one belief automatically leads to that extreme is a faulty assumption.
My hope was that the LDS people could take a look at what Phelps is doing and come away with a big question mark as to whether lobbying against the rights of Homosexuals is a kind and loving thing for our religion to be doing. What Phelps is doing by exhibiting such unabashed hatred, seems to me to be antithetical to Christianity.
To me the issue of homosexuality is one I shy away from. Until I have a better understanding of what it means, why it happens, and what I should do about it I take no actions about it, pro or con. I can't make it work theologically within my framework. More information is needed.
I don't pass judgement on it though I believe it is a sin as it cuts one off from the penultimate relationship with God. When talking with a bisexual friend of mine he shared with me that his attraction to each gender was very different so I threw out my paradigm that homosexuality was the same feelings I've experienced with a different target. For now I lump it with other things that I believe are wrong but also have never been tempted with. Not having been tempted with it I do not know how difficult it is so I try to err on the side of empathy if possible.
"Surely he knows that DCP, The Nehor, Lamanite, and other key apologists..." -Scratch clarifying my status in apologetics "I admit it; I'm a petty, petty man." -Some Schmo