Why We Need Religion

[_beastie]

On which thread is the discussion between Tarski and log occurring?

[_asbestosman]

On which thread is the discussion between Tarski and log occurring?

I think Sethbag was referring to my thread, "Mud (and Soylent Greens) are People".

[_SatanWasSetUp]

I believe the xtian in question on RfM posts under the name "beaglie" not "beastie."

Ah yes, I believe i did mistake Beaglie for Beastie. Sorry Beastie.

[_SatanWasSetUp]

I think basic evolution explains why most Atheists, and even most religionists, don't desire to rape, murder, steal, etc. We are all descended from beings with the best survival genes. Anti-social people do not create as many offspring as those who get along with others and follow the laws of their society/tribe/village. Selfishness was not a smart survival strategy in the not-too-distant past. Anti-social criminals of the past were executed, banished, and imprisoned. You don't create many offspring from that lifestyle. Our genes are made up from those who got along with their neighbors, contributed to the tribe, found a partner, and produced offspring.

That doesn't give you any good reason to follow your genetic instincts though. In addition that's a very recent evolutionary standard. Rape would increase your chances of genetic continuance. The lust for murder could lead one to become a great warrior possibly increasing your chances of mating. Theft within the tribe/family would be unlikely to win you any accolades but stealing from the tribe next door would win you praise. Depends on the society though I suppose.

I suppose it depends on the part of the world your group evolved from. In some societies, rape, murder, etc. are not "bad" in certain cases. Even the Bible allows for the rape of murder of those who do not worship the biblical god. So, as Beastie points out, eveolution explains the existence of those traits that allow for the greatest survival within your group.

[_huckelberry]

"Why does your life only matter if it makes a difference when compared to eternity?"

Good point beastie, and I enjoyed the whole post, thanks for taking the time to make it.

As a theist I would make a parallel observation that if you do not find meaning in the small pieces of the present you wont find much more in an eternity.

[_The Nehor]

I suppose it depends on the part of the world your group evolved from. In some societies, rape, murder, etc. are not "bad" in certain cases. Even the Bible allows for the rape of murder of those who do not worship the biblical god. So, as Beastie points out, eveolution explains the existence of those traits that allow for the greatest survival within your group.

That's rather quick evolution though. If you believe in evolution we are on the wrong track right now. With the exception of some religious families the size of western families is inversely proportional to the material success of the family. Those with an aptitude for intelligence, adaptation, etc. are probably becoming smaller, not larger.

[_Mr. Coffee]

Those with an aptitude for intelligence, adaptation, etc. are probably becoming smaller, not larger.

Might have something to do with there not being any natural predators of humans. Also, as far as I know, it's still illegal for me to hunt stupid people for sport.

[_huckelberry]

good behavior from evolution?

I think to consider the contribution of rape to continuing the genes of individuals predisposed to raping it should be remembered that genetic servival includes the successful servival of the child, not simply freqentf fertilization. Children of rape may not get the necessary care to survive as well as children of couples. There are similar considerations with stealing. Stealing from neighbors may be useful as long as you can keep the neighbors convinced not to kill you for it. Continue stealing that could become a tall order.

But it is perhaps a tall order sometimes met by invention, ingenuity, diplomacy, and perhaps deception. Curiously those are qualities human evolution has developed.

Actually what is striking about hunam evolution is that we have developed a substantial capacity to invent actions not detremined by our genetic programing. I do not mean that we have not inherited important behaviour patterns. Instead we have along with those, inherited a capability to reject those patterns, rethink those patterns, and to invent new patterns. It would be in the area of our capacity to invent behaviour that people get concerned about the reasons shaping choices. We do not get to act on automatic. We are burdened with deciding all sorts of stuff again and again. It is natural we seek some sort of understanding to guide the decisions.

[_The Nehor]

Those with an aptitude for intelligence, adaptation, etc. are probably becoming smaller, not larger.

Might have something to do with there not being any natural predators of humans. Also, as far as I know, it's still illegal for me to hunt stupid people for sport.

Vote Scorched Earth in the next election or move to Britain where new developments might help if we can switch racism to intellectual elitism: http://www.matazone.co.uk/animpages/Mr- ... nting.html

[_huckelberry]

evolution and smaller families.

It could be kept in mind that evolution functions through the servival of groups not individuals. In those terms groups with the best stratagy survive in the long run not necessarily the most prolific.

Natural predators? Well now perhaps only ourselves and some microscopic predators. In our early years lions tigers bears wolves hyenas etc would have all be serious threats. I think a critical event in our history was when our forebearers started taking the risks of leaving the safty of trees. One person and a lion, the person is prey. Three or four people with spears and the lion is prey. Cooperation and violence founding our race.