Polygamy & Big Love

[_barrelomonkeys]

Hi Mocnarf...

The show makes the Henderson family look like what Polygamy was meant to be.

To me, it is like having a program showing how slavery was meant to be... where the slaves are doing their best to make a horrible situation fine... slaves accepting their position as how God intended it. Slaveholders trying to be good slaveholders.... ya know? It just really rubs me the wrong way! I can't think about it without bringing to my mind and heart the sorrow, heartache, pain, abuse, and suffering of so many women trying to do "God's will." I just can't see it in a funny light.

I have a difficult time with anything that makes light of a very cruel, degrading, and abusive practice.

I say this again, not judging those who want to engage in whatever form of alternative lifestyle they wish... I'm talking about the idea that God commands/demands women share their husbands while the husband can %$#@ whomever he wishes or rather whomever he can can get to "marry" him. Two very different situations.

~dancer~

You know... I keep thinking about it and as a woman it would be so difficult for me to deal with this. I think the hardest part would be accepting a new wife, wathching my husband deeply in love (you know how passionate and euphoric new love is) with another woman. I think that would be absolutely devastating.

[_truth dancer]

Hi Barrelofmonkeys... :-)

I do not understand how some folks seem to think women should just get over it or something. (At least not women who love their husbands and enjoy being married).

It is no different than a woman faced with her husband falling in love with another woman and having an affair..... except she is supposed to love the other woman and the affair is for eternity. (sigh).

In my husband's family, there is a journal of a first wife whose husband took a second... it is the most heartwrenching thing one could ever read... basically she died of a broken heart. She went into a deep melancholy and truly just could not take it. Her children watched her die as did her husband and his new wife...

Apologists will say the woman was weak and selfish.

As I said, I just can't make light of something so cruel.

~dancer~

[_Seven]

Thanks, Seven, TruthDancer, Nehor.... I appreciate your comment. I, do, however beleive the show has shown the bad side of polygamy as well as the good side, I.e. Compound life. Those families do not make polygamy look appealing.

The show makes the Henderson family look like what Polygamy was meant to be. (at least in the first season) But I think that even in the Henderson Family, it shows how difficult it is to make it work for everyone in the family. Their are incredable stress on not only the adult members of the family but on the children.

My wife grew up in Kanab Utah, and related a story to me about a situation that occurred in her Junior High when she was young. It happen that a girl form a polygamist family was enrolled in their school and the kids, just tormented the girl terribly. Not physically mind you... but by words and otracism. Junior High kids can be so mean. If your not in the in group, your a no-body. Unfortunately she was one of the tormentors and is still ashamed of the way she acted way back then.
.

Truth Dancer's comments echo what I feel. That is the reason I do not care for the show. When you say this is what polygamy was meant to be like, what do you mean? There is not a man out there who can practice polygamy without making women his posessions. (consensual or not, it is degrading to women) When you read the journals of modern day women who lived it, they had brain washed themselves into believing it brought happiness. For a woman to find peace in polygamy she must submit herself to man and remove the natural feelings of love that man and wife should have. Sure, there are going to be those women who really don't desire any intimate realtionship and friendship with a man and for them polygamy wouldn't be a problem. What is a problem is that children are involved. They are setting a horrible example to their sons & daughters by embracing that system of marriage.

Would I want my girls raised to believe that it's acceptable for a man to have more than one wife as an alternative form of marriage? Absolutely not. It would be destructive to society and to women if people begin accepting this as just another partnership that should be tolerated. Especially with the boys in these families that are being taught, by example, that women are posessions. I hope it remains illegal.

Like Bond, I think it's sad that this show will make polygamy more tolerated in society. It has already had this effect with some friends and family I know that watch it. They don't see the big deal with polygamy now. Before the show, it was a very disturbing topic to them.

Almost all polygamists practice this because of doctrinal reasons. (LDS doctrine being the most common in the US) With that in mind, you know the children being born into these families are being taught this is what God expects of them.
Even the Hendersen family on Big Love practices polygamy for doctrinal reasons.

[_Seven]

Hi Mocnarf...

The show makes the Henderson family look like what Polygamy was meant to be.

To me, it is like having a program showing how slavery was meant to be... where the slaves are doing their best to make a horrible situation fine... slaves accepting their position as how God intended it. Slaveholders trying to be good slaveholders.... ya know? It just really rubs me the wrong way! I can't think about it without bringing to my mind and heart the sorrow, heartache, pain, abuse, and suffering of so many women trying to do "God's will." I just can't see it in a funny light.

I have a difficult time with anything that makes light of a very cruel, degrading, and abusive practice.

I say this again, not judging those who want to engage in whatever form of alternative lifestyle they wish... I'm talking about the idea that God commands/demands women share their husbands while the husband can %$#@ whomever he wishes or rather whomever he can can get to "marry" him. Two very different situations.

~dancer~

You know... I keep thinking about it and as a woman it would be so difficult for me to deal with this. I think the hardest part would be accepting a new wife, wathching my husband deeply in love (you know how passionate and euphoric new love is) with another woman. I think that would be absolutely devastating.

Yeah, and imagine helping deliver the babies of these women.......it doesn't get much more devestating than that.

It sickens me to see apologists defend plural marriage. They almost seem giddy about practicing it in the future.
I think these women (apologists on MAD) don't desire the type of love and relationship with their spouse that most monogamous couples share. This type of woman might be happier with a sister wife than a husband.

The thought of my DH having an orgasm with another woman while I am in the next room forced to accept it as God's command makes me feel heartache for the women that were coerced into it.

[_truth dancer]

Hi Seven,

Great points!

It sickens me to see apologists defend plural marriage. They almost seem giddy about practicing it in the future.
I think these women (apologists on MAD) don't desire the type of love and relationship with their spouse that most monogamous couples share. This type of woman might be happier with a sister wife than a husband.

I have observed the same thing.

I think those women who are fine and dandy with polygamy see marriage more as a living arrangment rather than an intimate passionate, uniting, loving relationship. And of course women who do not enjoy sex or don't care for the physical aspect of intimacy are great with not having to engage.

A while ago I read a blog by a woman who really didn't like men at all but wasn't lesbian, and thought it would be great if she could live with a bunch of women friends, and they could go visit a guy once in a while for sex. She was not religious but I thought... she would be perfect for polygamy.

For those women and men who enjoy the unity, intimacy, connection and love that is only available in a monogamous relationship, polygamy just doesn't work.

~dancer~

[_beastie]

I think this season may be getting ready to delve into some of the complications that were glossed over in the first season. Barb still struggles with it, and it becomes clear that she accepted polgyamy because she thought she would lose Bill if she didn't. Nikki makes it clear that plural marriage isn't about love, and that, in fact, love is a weak foundation for marriage in her eyes - the foundation is religious devotion and determination (some would say fanaticism). It becomes more obvious that Margene needs "mothers" in her life, and attaches herself to older women quite a bit, but even she begins to worry about her place, why Bill loves her, and if she's the "newest" and will be replaced, although her desire for another mother figure seems stronger than that fear.

It will be interesting is seeing how Barb deals with her oldest son's understanding of "the principle". When he stated that it would be ok to get married young, because even if she "wasn't really the one", and he fell in love with someone else later, it would be ok because he would just marry her, too, as second - the pain on Barb's face was clear.

So while I agree that the first season did gloss over some of the real life complications of polygamy, mainly stressing the sexual aspect plus social disapproval, I think this season won't.

[_Blixa]

I have much to say. Will try to do so soon.

(Under migraine quarintine. First time with migraine-induced hallucinations. Very fascinating/terrifying. Google Hildegard of Bingen for religious tie-in).

[_The Nehor]

Truth Dancer's comments echo what I feel. That is the reason I do not care for the show. When you say this is what polygamy was meant to be like, what do you mean? There is not a man out there who can practice polygamy without making women his posessions. (consensual or not, it is degrading to women) When you read the journals of modern day women who lived it, they had brain washed themselves into believing it brought happiness. For a woman to find peace in polygamy she must submit herself to man and remove the natural feelings of love that man and wife should have. Sure, there are going to be those women who really don't desire any intimate realtionship and friendship with a man and for them polygamy wouldn't be a problem. What is a problem is that children are involved. They are setting a horrible example to their sons & daughters by embracing that system of marriage.

There is not a man who can have a marriage at all without making a woman his possession. But the axe swings both ways and they also are owned by her. Is that degrading? I hope not.

I've seen polygamy and polyamory work and the participants are happy. I don't see it as a monstrosity.

[_JAK]

Truth Dancer's comments echo what I feel. That is the reason I do not care for the show. When you say this is what polygamy was meant to be like, what do you mean? There is not a man out there who can practice polygamy without making women his posessions. (consensual or not, it is degrading to women) When you read the journals of modern day women who lived it, they had brain washed themselves into believing it brought happiness. For a woman to find peace in polygamy she must submit herself to man and remove the natural feelings of love that man and wife should have. Sure, there are going to be those women who really don't desire any intimate realtionship and friendship with a man and for them polygamy wouldn't be a problem. What is a problem is that children are involved. They are setting a horrible example to their sons & daughters by embracing that system of marriage.

There is not a man who can have a marriage at all without making a woman his possession. But the axe swings both ways and they also are owned by her. Is that degrading? I hope not.

I've seen polygamy and polyamory work and the participants are happy. I don't see it as a monstrosity.

Nehor stated:
There is not a man who can have a marriage at all without making a woman his possession. But the axe swings both ways and they also are owned by her. Is that degrading? I hope not.

I've seen polygamy and polyamory work and the participants are happy. I don't see it as a monstrosity.

Just how wide is your survey for your all-inclusive declaration?

Your blithe, hasty generalization in no way refutes the analysis of Seven and truth dancer. They are correct in analysis, not you.

JAK

[_truth dancer]

Hi Nehor...

There is not a man who can have a marriage at all without making a woman his possession. But the axe swings both ways and they also are owned by her. Is that degrading? I hope not.

Wow... I completely disagree with your idea marriage is about possession, or one spouse is the possession of the other. I find it a very odd way to describe a partnership.

I've seen polygamy and polyamory work and the participants are happy. I don't see it as a monstrosity.

As I have stated... there are folks who happily engage in all sorts of alternative relationships. Some folks like to be owned, treated as slaves, hurt, punished. Some folks like all sorts of things most of us find disgusting and cruel... so?

If folks want to engage in whatever weird/odd/icky/perverted/nasty/unusual or whatever partnering behavior, then fine... so long as children are not hurt and they engage in their behavior without coercion, manipulation, threat... and they are ADULTS!

~dancer~