Sam Harris on Sarah Palin

[_EAllusion]

Thanks for that. One thing I think is important to note is that Couric asked for specific examples where McCain had pushed for more regulation.

She starts with a quote about reform and asks about McCain pushing for regulation. This is because a breakdown in regulatory oversight is almost universally cited by economists as a major factor in the current meltdown, but if Palin had a problem with the question she could've simply listed other form of reform of business she felt was relevant. One of the main talking points in Palin's speeches is about the great reformer McCain. It is one of their two or three main rhetorical points in the campaign. It's their "change" theme. Asking for a few examples of this record of reform is easily expected. She was incapable of giving a reply. She tried to weasel out of the question with continuing to assert vague buzzwords about McCain until she gave up when Couric belabored the point. It was rather pathetic.

Since you seem willing to defend Palin on any point, I should let you know your next task likely will be explaining why Palin couldn't name a single Supreme Court Case outside of Roe vs. Wade when asked.

[_dartagnan]

Ray, I suspect that is because politics reflects the here and now and religion reflects the hereafter. What is immediate sometimes takes precedence.

Not true. Religion is also the here and now, and I was marginalized here previously for refusing to follow their beaten path to atheism. Politics is just another subject of common contention.

Sex, religion and politics. The three things you're not supposed to talk about in public. People are generally highly opinionated on all three, and few agree on all topics.

[_dartagnan]

She starts with a quote about reform and asks about McCain pushing for regulation. This is because a breakdown in regulatory oversight is almost universally cited by economists as a major factor in the current meltdown, but if Palin had a problem with the question she could've simply listed other form of reform of business she felt was relevant.

Regulation and oversight are frequently mentioned in the same breath, but there is a technical distinction, especially within the context of McCain's proposed policies. For example he has been for deregulation and for more oversight.

One of the main talking points in Palin's speeches is about the great reformer McCain. It is one of their two or three main rhetorical points in the campaign. It's their "change" theme.

Exactly.

Asking for a few examples of this record of reform is easily expected.

I don't think it is. "Change" has been the trumpeted call from the Obama camp from day one. So when was Biden asked to name examples of Obama's "change" policies? The standard is double EA, just face it.

She was incapable of giving a reply.

Possible, but you have to consider the fact that Couric was going back and forth between regulation and oversight. Palin responded to the first question and Couric changed the point. Now it is about McCain's history as a "deregulator." Palin didn't deny this. She simply reiterated the point that McCain has spent the better part of his time in Washington trying to convince others of the need to reform government.

What was she looking for? Exact times and exact citations where he had spoken on this on the senate floor? This isn't a moot point. McCain is well known as a reform seeker. This is like asking someone to point out examples where MLK opposed discrimination. How many specific times and places can you name off the top of your head?

She tried to weasel out of the question with continuing to assert vague buzzwords about McCain until she gave up when Couric belabored the point. It was rather pathetic.

I think Couric was rather pathetic. She was fishing for the next day's headline, and she never would have done this to Biden. You make it sound liek it is such an easy thing to do to name "examples" where someone tries to convince other politicians the need to reform. Wouldn't most of this be taken for granted as hsi reputation is clearly a "maverick," the "sheriff," etc? Who can seriously deny McCain has pushed for reform? Is Palin supposed to name time and place in his entire history when he did this?

Since you seem willing to defend Palin on any point

And you seem willing to attack her on any.

I should let you know your next task likely will be explaining why Palin couldn't name a single Supreme Court Case outside of Roe vs. Wade when asked.

You'll have to tell me what you're referring to first. But I'll respond as soon as you explain to us why Biden ranted incorrectly about who was President during the depression and why he spoke forcefully against clean coal when Obama has campaigned on the issue?

[_EAllusion]

Regulation and oversight are frequently mentioned in the same breath, but there is a technical distinction, especially within the context of McCain's proposed policies. For example he has been for deregulation and for more oversight.

Palin could've said this. Maverick!

I don't think it is. "Change" has been the trumpeted call from the Obama camp from day one. So when was Biden asked to name examples of Obama's "change" policies?

This happened during the primaries and is a regular aspect of his speeches. That's why. It would be a silly question. By contrast, McCain doesn't talk much about why he is a reformer during his speeches because doing things like mentioning campaign finance reform or immigration reform would not go over well with the people attending his speeches. A more appropriate analogy would be to ask Obama surrogates what Obama's legislative accomplishments were during the period his experience was coming under intense scrutiny. But that also occurred frequently during the primaries. There was a famous bit on Hardball where a supporter couldn't name one.

Couric's question simply was attempting to add substance to the reform rhetoric given McCain's reputation. The trap in that question is the type of reforms McCain has been known to push, but Couric leaves an out in the way she asks it. This is the sort of question the camp should've been able to anticipate. All Palin had to do is list some polices the McCain camp supports to provide reform and she would've got passed the question. That's what McCain would've done. Palin tried to bluff her way through and just did very badly.

Possible, but you have to consider the fact that Couric was going back and forth between regulation and oversight. Palin responded to the first question and Couric changed the point.

No she didn't. Palin did not at any point actually give a response. He first reply was to refer to the example Couric handed her when Couric specifically asked her to name something besides that example.

And you seem willing to attack her on any.

No, not really.

You'll have to tell me what you're referring to first.

CBS has let it be known that they're holding on to some damning tape still. One of the leaked points - call it a fairly reliable rumor - is that Palin couldn't name a Supreme Court Case outside of Roe vs. Wade. By contrast, I'd have no problem competently discussing dozens and I'm not in her position, nor do I have a minor in Poli Sci like she does.

From politico:

Of concern to McCain's campaign, however, is a remaining and still-undisclosed clip from Palin's interview with Couric last week that has the political world buzzing.

The Palin aide, after first noting how "infuriating" it was for CBS to purportedly leak word about the gaffe, revealed that it came in response to a question about Supreme Court decisions.

After noting Roe vs. Wade, Palin was apparently unable to discuss any major court cases.

There was no verbal fumbling with this particular question as there was with some others, the aide said, but rather silence.

http://www.politico.com/blogs/jonathanm ... story.html

We'll see. You can start working on your Palin apologia now, though.

But I'll respond as soon as you explain to us why Biden ranted incorrectly about who was President during the depression

FDR was president during the depression. But yeah, I know what you are talking about. He was getting cute with his rhetorical point and let his mouth get ahead of his mind. Bad Biden. Bad.

and why he spoke forcefully against clean coal when Obama has campaigned on the issue?

He's against it - or thought it would be appropriately bold to say he is - and didn't think through or know whether Obama was when he was running his mouth.

[_antishock8]

I find it interesting that the Leftists on this board are so focused on the VP, frankly. As a spam email forwarded by a friend so eloquently puts:

A little over one year ago:

1) Consumer confidence stood at a 2 1/2 year high;
2) Regular gasoline sold for $2.19 a gallon;
3) the unemployment rate was 4.5%.
4) the DOW JONES hit a record high--14,000 +
5) American's were buying new cars, taking cruises, vacations overseas, living large!

But American's wanted 'CHANGE'! So, in 2006 they voted in a Democratic Congress and yes--we got 'CHANGE' all right. In the PAST YEAR:

1) Consumer confidence has plummeted ;
2) Gasoline is now over $4 a gallon & climbing!;
3) Unemployment is up to 5.5% (a 10% increase);
4) Americans have seen their home equity drop by $12 TRILLION DOLLARS and prices still dropping;
5) 1% of American homes are in foreclosure.
6) as I write, THE DOW is reaching another low~~ $2.5 TRILLION DOLLARS HAS EVAPORATED FROM THEIR STOCKS, BONDS & MUTUAL FUNDS INVESTMENT PORTFOLIOS!

What was the Democratically held Congress' approval rating again?

What was Governor Palin's approval rating?

I rest my case. Amen.

[_antishock8]

http://elections.foxnews.com/2008/09/30 ... shot-iraq/

I think Dart is accurate when he states that Governor Palin is getting treated differently than either Senator Obama or Senator Biden. Can we at least agree that's the case?

[_LifeOnaPlate]

I find it interesting that the Leftists on this board are so focused on the VP, frankly.

The VP is a choice of the presidential candidate. It was a poor decision on an important matter and McCain messed up.

I think Dart is accurate when he states that Governor Palin is getting treated differently than either Senator Obama or Senator Biden. Can we at least agree that's the case?

Treated differently by whom? They're all treated differently by different people. In regards to media coverage, part of the problem with Palin is the hunkered and defensive stance of the campaign in not allowing many interviews, etc.

[_Some Schmo]

I think Dart is accurate when he states that Governor Palin is getting treated differently than either Senator Obama or Senator Biden. Can we at least agree that's the case?

Treated differently by whom? They're all treated differently by different people. In regards to media coverage, part of the problem with Palin is the hunkered and defensive stance of the campaign in not allowing many interviews, etc.

Exactly true.

Of course she's treated differently. Why shouldn't she be? If Obama or Biden said the kinds of things she has in the limited number of allowed interviews, they'd receive the treatment she's getting.

[Guest]

Exactly true.

Of course she's treated differently. Why shouldn't she be? If Obama or Biden said the kinds of things she has in the limited number of allowed interviews, they'd receive the treatment she's getting.

I see plenty of negative press regarding Obama and Biden. Much of the media coverage on Palin is negative in a different sense; negative in a quantitative sense, coming from her at least.

McCain's blaming "the media" for their devious "gotcha" techniques was just ridiculous. I used to wonder if McCain really "endorses" his commercials because they are so dumb. Now I firmly believe he does approve them; his talk about the "gotcha" questions and the media was ill-conceived.

[_Some Schmo]

I see plenty of negative press regarding Obama and Biden. Much of the media coverage on Palin is negative in a different sense; negative in a quantitative sense, coming from her at least.

No question. I didn't mean to imply Obama and Biden weren't receiving negative press.

I was just pointing out that, yes, there's a difference, but that the difference is deserved.