Inequality - the moral of the Book of Mormon

[_RockSlider]

Having several hours of plane time to Munich and back, I listened to the DCP interview tapes on Mormon stories.

After listening to his experience as a Bishop, it was pretty clear that he had taken the responsibility of that position as the ward's "judge" pretty seriously.

His most humbling experience with one other educated, academic cohort and a third that was at least a white collar worker, with the broken canning machine was also very touching.

It must be nice to be one of the few that are somehow privileged enough to live a life of pure academia and world travel. Was PhD. Dan Peterson born with the so called silver spoon in his mouth, or is his story one of humble parents that sacrificed all for his education?

In the final tape, at Witherspoon's request DCP bore his testimony on the Church's one and only truth claim. Very disappointing, but not surprising.

Gee I'll bet Dan has something, somewhere and someone real important to be with this coming week. For me, it's back to the "sweat of thy brow shall thy earn thy bread, all the days of thy life"

My summary of the 4 hours:

By their fruits ye shall know them.

Verily I say unto you, Inasmuch as ye have done it unto one of the least of these my brethren, ye have done it unto me.

[_Daniel Peterson]

I loved the members of my ward, and I tried my best to serve them. I spent hundreds of hours each year counseling with them, trying to help them (materially and in career terms, as well as spiritually). They lined up outside my office door by the scores every Sunday and every Wednesday, and contacted me on most days in between. I was typically in my office until past midnight.

From what I can tell, members of that ward seemed to tolerate me okay. Many of them still call me, drop by for visits, invite me to their weddings and receptions, drop me notes to tell of their progress, etc. Most are gone now, but I've been invited back to the ward by them several times to speak at dinners, parties, and the like.

You seek to portray me as an arrogant, out of touch elitist who was born with a silver spoon in his mouth. The fact is that I come from a working class family (my mother never attended college, my father managed to get in two years), worked construction myself through graduate school, etc.

If you choose to judge me harshly and negatively, though, that's certainly your right.

[_RockSlider]

I encouraged my TBM wife to listen to the tapes with me. At first she refused, as she will not tolerate any anti-Mormon material (in the true TBM definition of anti-Mormon). After explaining your position with MI she agreed. In-between tapes, she was pleased that she had listened, and mentioned how well you have stated many things that she could not express.

And then came your description of those whom you “served” as bishop. She took off the head phones, quite upset, and would listen no more. We both reflected on how those who have served missions among a downtrodden people would speak of their love for that society and people after serving them. Your comments were so strange and foreign to us in this aspect.

I hope those ward members that do hold you in high esteem, never hear that interview. Your summary thoughts of them seem such a betrayal.

[_Daniel Peterson]

And then came your description of those whom you “served” as bishop. She took off the head phones, quite upset, and would listen no more. We both reflected on how those who have served missions among a downtrodden people would speak of their love for that society and people after serving them. Your comments were so strange and foreign to us in this aspect.

I hope those ward members that do hold you in high esteem, never hear that interview. Your summary thoughts of them seem such a betrayal.

I guess I'll have to listen to at least that part of the interview.

It's possible that I misspoke. It's also possible, if just barely, that you misheard.

I did have people in my ward who were dysfunctional. I suspect that most bishops do. But I loved them as well as I loved the others, and I think that those with whom I spent time knew it.

I'm glad that you're not my judge.

I have to admit that I'm perplexed by the view of me that you've taken away from that podcast. It seems a minority take, but you're probably not the only one with such a verdict. I conclude from that fact that my image is probably unsalvageable in certain quarters, and that I shouldn't lose much sleep over it.

Postscript: I've just listened to the passage in the podcast to which, I think, you're referring. I think you've grossly, grotesquely, misread it.

[_Will Schryver]

And then came your description of those whom you “served” as bishop. She took off the head phones, quite upset, and would listen no more. We both reflected on how those who have served missions among a downtrodden people would speak of their love for that society and people after serving them. Your comments were so strange and foreign to us in this aspect.

I hope those ward members that do hold you in high esteem, never hear that interview. Your summary thoughts of them seem such a betrayal.

I guess I'll have to listen to at least that part of the interview.

It's possible that I misspoke. It's also possible, if just barely, that you misheard.

I did have people in my ward who were dysfunctional. I suspect that most bishops do. But I loved them as well as I loved the others, and I think that those with whom I spent time knew it.

I'm glad that you're not my judge.

I have to admit that I'm perplexed by the view of me that you've taken away from that podcast. It seems a minority take, but you're probably not the only one with such a verdict. I conclude from that fact that my image is probably unsalvageable in certain quarters, and that I shouldn't lose much sleep over it.

Postscript: I've just listened to the passage in the podcast to which, I think, you're referring. I think you've grossly, grotesquely, misread it.

Come la vedi, la vedi, ma è tutto in come la vedi.

O, se preferisca:

”A man hears what he wants to hear, and disregards the rest.”

This place is absolutely unrivaled in its capacity to dynamically mold its impressions to conform to its prejudices, and then to unanimously—almost instinctively—transform those manufactured impressions into an unquestioned consensus.

No matter what you say and do from this point forward, you will forever be the LDS bishop who publicly disdained his congregation—and the more you protest the characterization, the more it will be repeated. With some it will be a very conscious and deliberate exercise in propaganda; with others it will consist of little more than mindless mimicry.

Isn’t this a fun place to hang out?

[_RayAgostini]

And then came your description of those whom you “served” as bishop. She took off the head phones, quite upset, and would listen no more. We both reflected on how those who have served missions among a downtrodden people would speak of their love for that society and people after serving them. Your comments were so strange and foreign to us in this aspect.

I don't think most people realise what bishops hear in interviews. It's like going on a journey to the dark side of the moon. Everyone sees the bright side, but it's mainly bishops who are "privileged" with the dark side, and only bishops know how dark it can really get. I didn't think there was anything unrealistic about DCP's statement, and I doubt that most bishops would disagree with the term "dysfunctional". Liz has often referred to this board as a "dysfunctional family". I don't recall anyone being offended, because it's a realistic description.

The fact is that there are dysfunctional people in every ward, even if you exclude the definition of how well one lives the gospel, and extend it to life outside of Church meetings. I suspect that if DCP had given an "all rosy" picture of people ready to meet Enoch and his City, he would have been criticised for "glossing over the reality".

[_RockSlider]

This place is absolutely unrivaled in its capacity to dynamically mold its impressions to conform to its prejudices, and then to unanimously—almost instinctively—transform those manufactured impressions into an unquestioned consensus.

And yet, after the horrible beating you took, here you are back again ... amazing.

[_Everybody Wang Chung]

This place is absolutely unrivaled in its capacity to dynamically mold its impressions to conform to its prejudices, and then to unanimously—almost instinctively—transform those manufactured impressions into an unquestioned consensus.

Are you describing the MAD Board? If so, that's a very accurate description.

[_Yoda]

(Moderator Note) I have moved off topic conversation to the following thread:

viewtopic.php?f=5&t=20217

Please do not derail threads in the Celestial Forum. Thank you.

[_Yoda]

And then came your description of those whom you “served” as bishop. She took off the head phones, quite upset, and would listen no more. We both reflected on how those who have served missions among a downtrodden people would speak of their love for that society and people after serving them. Your comments were so strange and foreign to us in this aspect.

I don't think most people realise what bishops hear in interviews. It's like going on a journey to the dark side of the moon. Everyone sees the bright side, but it's mainly bishops who are "privileged" with the dark side, and only bishops know how dark it can really get. I didn't think there was anything unrealistic about DCP's statement, and I doubt that most bishops would disagree with the term "dysfunctional". Liz has often referred to this board as a "dysfunctional family". I don't recall anyone being offended, because it's a realistic description.

The fact is that there are dysfunctional people in every ward, even if you exclude the definition of how well one lives the gospel, and extend it to life outside of Church meetings. I suspect that if DCP had given an "all rosy" picture of people ready to meet Enoch and his City, he would have been criticised for "glossing over the reality".

QFT +1000