Apostles...witnesses of what exactly?

[_subgenius]

So what is your opinion on Joseph Smith who stated he saw not only Christ but God as well?

i believe it to be correct.

And if yes, do you believe subsequent Prophet's have an equal opportunity to see God in the same way?

i believe everyone has an equal opportunity to see God in the same and many other ways, none exclusive of another.

[_jon]

i believe everyone has an equal opportunity to see God in the same and many other ways, none exclusive of another.

Interesting.
So I have exactly the same opportunity to see and hear from God as an Apostle? (I'm not trying to put words in your mouth)

[_Nightlion]

The Shroud of Torin is bogus. Nobody would lay Jesus to rest with his hands covering his stuff.
Think about it.

Think about it?
1. it was an attempt at humor....obviously unsuccessful.
2. The body posture matches that of skeletons at the first century Jewish community at Qumran, which is considered to affirm that it was indeed a Jewish burial, along with unwashed body, etc..

perhaps you should not only "think about it"...but, first, learn about it.
typical atheist speculation, founded more on the premise of "it figgers good in my head"

I have been called some crazy things on this board, but nobody ever called me an atheist before.
They had to go as far as Qumran to find body posture that matches, huh. And that's a learned conclusion? can't just ask someone if they would posture the body of God that way? With all the detailed laws that the Jews were so fond of there had to be the precisely correct posture for the dead. But Qumran's got the juice I suppose. Were the learned sip their sups.

[_subgenius]

I have been called some crazy things on this board, but nobody ever called me an atheist before.

interesting footnote i am sure. but i clearly use atheist as an adjective for "the conclusion" not "the poster". Nevertheless, no personal offense was intended, though being associated with atheist can easily be an affront to one's sensibilities.

They had to go as far as Qumran to find body posture that matches, huh. And that's a learned conclusion? can't just ask someone if they would posture the body of God that way? With all the detailed laws that the Jews were so fond of there had to be the precisely correct posture for the dead. But Qumran's got the juice I suppose. Were the learned sip their sups.

well, i guess one could also glean a few things from:
Mark 15:42-46 for example.
Lets see what conclusion can drawn...
Most people have learned that the body was initially prepared in haste, due to the Sabbath (Mark 16:1), which is why they were to return later to anoint the body...obviously the procedure was incomplete..... hmmm.....s s s s s s s sip.

[_Nightlion]

no personal offense was intended,

well, i guess one could also glean a few things from:
Mark 15:42-46 for example.
Lets see what conclusion can drawn...
Most people have learned that the body was initially prepared in haste, due to the Sabbath (Mark 16:1), which is why they were to return later to anoint the body...obviously the procedure was incomplete..... hmmm.....s s s s s s s sip.

No offense intended huh? Okay Wade. You have shown stealthiness once again.

[_subgenius]

no personal offense was intended,

well, i guess one could also glean a few things from:
Mark 15:42-46 for example.
Lets see what conclusion can drawn...
Most people have learned that the body was initially prepared in haste, due to the Sabbath (Mark 16:1), which is why they were to return later to anoint the body...obviously the procedure was incomplete..... hmmm.....s s s s s s s sip.

No offense intended huh? Okay Wade. You have shown stealthiness once again.

no personal offense intended, some intellectual offense may have been intended.
and i assure you that i do not know what you mean by "Wade".

[_Nightlion]

No offense intended huh? Okay Wade. You have shown stealthiness once again.

no personal offense intended, some intellectual offense may have been intended.
and i assure you that i do not know what you mean by "Wade".[/quote]

I dislike derailing threads to make them about us.
Wade would not know what I mean by Wade. Not while in stealth mode anywade. ay?

[_subgenius]

Wade would not know what I mean by Wade. Not while in stealth mode anywade. ay?

well, i can stand as witness that i do not know what you are talking about here.
it seems that you may be confusing me with someone else or something else.

[_Nightlion]

Okay, then here is a test.
Wade would never walk away having once derailed a thread and not derail it again to bury that which he feels is his obligation to bury.

From me earlier in this thread:

Reasons why no LDS apostle will ever see Christ or become a true apostle:
1. They have been partaking of the sacrament unworthily all their lives
2. They received priesthood callings unworthily all their lives.
3. They went to the temple unworthily before their missions.
4. They never repented of the natural man and forsook the world to become true saints. Rather they sought after the excellence of the world and earned the honors of men.
5. None were ever visited of God and wrought upon and cleansed by the baptism of fire and of the Holy Ghost. Neither do they know how to do this nor do they teach anyone the slightest wisdom in this regard.
6. Before you can be rightly called of Christ and sent in his name unto the nations you must have the gift and power of the Holy Ghost upon you for a while and prove your willingness and determination to hold valiantly to Christ in all hazards of the world and show that you will not be shaken nor removed from the love of God that was put into your inward parts.
7. Since no living LDS GA has qualified up to number six any callings received were presumptuously put upon them and will only bring greater condemnations.
8. It is silly to ask such hypocrisy IF they have seen the Lord. Wont happen. Worlds without end.

and from me later but still earlier in this thread:

Let me try this once again. No LDS apostle 'knows' what an apostolic witness is because none of them have ever received one. For all the reasons I have listed in a previous post. And because of pride keeping them from it still. Now, as for what counts as an apostolic witness is cannot be the seeing and witnessing of the risen Lord only. I mean if you do see him and he shows you the marks of the nails and the wound in his side and tells you to be faithful and believing that of itself is NOT an apostolic witness. It is a great witness and one that carries some weight, but it is of itself not what makes a man accountable for the name of Jesus Christ unto all nations. Priesthood powers respond to the degree of responsibility one takes up. Like the prophets of the Book of Mormon who had great views of prophecy because of their great anxiety for the welfare of their people.

After a man has been made a partaker of the name of Jesus Christ in the true gospel covenant and has been sanctified by the baptism of fire and of the Holy Ghost he must magnify the name of Christ that is upon him and prove that he is fully willing to take the name of Christ in all situations and under all circumstances that he made be found in. What I mean is that he speaks of Christ and rejoices in Christ in all his words and acts and conversation and does not hide or pretend otherwise. Such CAN qualify to become true apostles. Either the Lord alone can choose them and send them forth if such are found to be without brethren, or IF and when a true quorum of apostles meet and determine whom the Lord has chosen. In either case once sent of God or called of men/and God presumably, it is incumbent upon that man to continue until such time as the Lord will provide the apostolic revelation by the power of the Holy Ghost.
This is more than a testimony, it is the right and responsibility to carry the name of Jesus Christ under all circumstances unto all people at all times. And see that the name of Jesus Christ is not trampled upon or taken in vain or misunderstood as per doctrine and promise and the means to come unto Christ acceptably and receive all that the gospel of Jesus Christ affords.

The seeing of Christ only does not convey this Special Witness status. It does not put responsibility upon a soul. Only the revelation by the power of the Holy Ghost that manifests the apostolic witness of Jesus Christ so that the man knows by the power of God what the truth is concerning Jesus of Nazareth is how a true apostle is made.

The LDS standard is obscure because all they can do is guess and hope whatever they are is what they need to be. O my gosh! That is why they mimic one another to a tee. Nothing authentic between the lot of them. It is too late to turn back now. They will continue as the are.

[_subgenius]

Okay, then here is a test.
Wade would never walk away having once derailed a thread and not derail it again to bury that which he feels is his obligation to bury........

i assure you, not Wade.
not to discount the discourse you have posted about what an Apostle "surely must be", but consider this:
D&C 107:23 and 35 (and 124:128)

D&C 18:27-28

http://eom.BYU.edu/index.php/Apostle