How The Mormons Make Money - Bloomberg article

[_subgenius]

"A fixed pay, salary; retribution for work done; the income of an ecclesiastical living."
Those things you're splitting appear to be hairs...

no, just being literate
"It is often distinct from a wage or a salary because it does not necessarily represent payment for work performed; instead it represents a payment that enables somebody to be exempt partly or wholly from waged or salaried employment in order to undertake a role that is normally unpaid"

I think I allowed for ths by saying 'the proceeds of tithing'.

still unconfirmed

I think you will find I am correct and that the Church in several PR pieces has explained that no loans etc were used. I see you agree tat City Creek, paid for with liquid funds, is bad business.

only when it is "completely" paid by liquid funds.
and as for "financing" - it is not always synonymous to "loans" (as would be the case if it were debt financing (loans) instead of equity financing or debenture or bonds or a line of credit (not loans)) - again your lack of actual business and development knowledge is showing.

I'm all for urban renewal, but was Salt Lake City te most in need city in the world? Thought not.

i suppose they forgot to ask you for your list of cities in need and now you are offended.

I don't think I mentioned MTC...oh no, I didn't. So shw me where I misrepresented what MCMullin actually said.

Here is the excerpt...no capitalized Missionary and not even the word missionary is used...and as used below, obviously contrary to what you are proposing.
According to McMullin, DMC alone employs 1,400 “people who are volunteering their time and their services—some are part-time and some are volunteer.” Many of these members being asked to serve full- or part-time are retirees. “They’re making use of the Baby Boom generation, getting them to serve ‘missions’ doing data entry and all sorts of things,” says Mormon anthropologist Smith.

Good for you, Mr Cheap Labour.

not so good for you, eh? sand-bagger

So, by your logic, the poor impoverished Stakes don't get as much as the Hollywood stakes? Really? The programmes of the Church are only available if you've got the dosh? Really?

correct me if i am wrong, but are not Stake budgets considered by how much tithing is received and by attendance? I know fast offerings would remain at the ward for Bishop's discretion but that policy has since been revised (which according to you is nefarious) but my understanding is that many stakes are still being "buttressed" financially by others...theological socialism if you will.

Demonstrably untrue. Lots of people volunteer for things they get paid for. GA's for example...

perhaps you should volunteer then....

If you work harder for more blessings I can put my feet up.

what? and take it out of your mouth?

It's called being an adult.

you should try it sometime...but obviously people being "ganged", as you depict, is not occurring.

Monson has the chance to speak to the world, at a time when Holland is visiting the impoverished continent of Africa where children are starving, and he chooses to say to te world "Let's go shopping"...

Led by Christ? Not likely.

In America we take a bit of pride by being able to walk and chew gum at the same time. While you wish everyone was in Africa feeding kids, the Church is actually doing that and helping communities at home, and keeping the power on at your ward. You act as if the only thing the Church has done this year is open the mall.

[_Drifting]

In America we take a bit of pride by being able to walk and chew gum at the same time. While you wish everyone was in Africa feeding kids, the Church is actually doing that and helping communities at home, and keeping the power on at your ward. You act as if the only thing the Church has done this year is open the mall.

How much money is being spent in Africa to keep people alive in comparison the how much has been spent in Salt Lake City to keep people in jewellery and fashion?

Let's see if you can find $5 billion in total spend across the Church's humanitarian projects across the world in the last 25 years say...oh wait...the Church has published that number...$1.3 billion.

You may be able to walk and chew gum but it seems you can't feed the poor as well as you feed the fashion appetites of Salt Lake City...

[_Drifting]

"Funds for this have come and will come from those commercial entities owned by the Church. These resources, together with the earnings of invested reserve funds, will accommodate this program."

The above from GBH.
Sounds like liquid funds to me...

"earnings from invested reserve funds" is a euphemism for the interest earned from tithing deposits. If you don't believe me, write to the Presiding Bishopric.

[_jo1952]

How much money is being spent in Africa to keep people alive in comparison the how much has been spent in Salt Lake City to keep people in jewellery and fashion?

Let's see if you can find $5 billion in total spend across the Church's humanitarian projects across the world in the last 25 years say...oh wait...the Church has published that number...$1.3 billion.

You may be able to walk and chew gum but it seems you can't feed the poor as well as you feed the fashion appetites of Salt Lake City...

Hello Drifting,

Are you aware of what is politically happening in Africa and elsewhere? It's been that way for a long time; and the world's economy keeps getting worse and worse. Are you aware that financial aid and physical goods which are sent to most countries in need never make it to the people? There are corrupt governments all over the earth. So, how would YOU solve those problems to make sure the people who really need the money or the goods actually receive them? Should the Church create a Military? Should she overthrow corrupt governments? Should she combine Church and Government? If I remember correctly, that has never historically worked out very well.

There are billions of Christians on the earth. How do other denominations compare with the LDS Church? How about the RCC?

Is the LDS Church a bad steward of money because they have been able to increase what they have received? I think they are doing a better job than our Federal Government; and better than our State Governments. In fact, they are better prepared to assist not only their own members, but also others during times of disaster than our own Government is. The Church doesn't need to just keep printing money that has no real value. The Church doesn't pass on any debt to our children.

If, indeed, the Church is mis-managing money, then those responsible will be held accountable.

Mark 14:7 (KJV)

7 For ye have the poor with you always, and whensoever ye will ye may do them good: but me ye have not always.

I believe when Jesus said we will always have the poor among us, that He meant it. I don't believe He was trying to be harsh in saying this. I believe that being poor is one of the experiences all of us will go through because it is one of the things we need to learn in order for us to become compassionate toward those less fortunate than us. Also, being poor creates circumstances which can help us search for God. The poor being with us always helps to serve God's purposes. Jesus did not waste His words. In everything He said, there are lessons for us to learn.

Blessings,

jo

[_Drifting]

Hello Drifting,

Are you aware of what is politically happening in Africa and elsewhere? It's been that way for a long time; and the world's economy keeps getting worse and worse. Are you aware that financial aid and physical goods which are sent to most countries in need never make it to the people? There are corrupt governments all over the earth. So, how would YOU solve those problems to make sure the people who really need the money or the goods actually receive them? Should the Church create a Military? Should she overthrow corrupt governments? Should she combine Church and Government? If I remember correctly, that has never historically worked out very well.

When the disaster hit New Orleans how much money did the Church use to help rebuild that area? Your excusing the Church because of corrupt governments is an attempt at misdirection. Instead of focussing on what the Church can't do, why not consider what the Church could do.

There are billions of Christians on the earth. How do other denominations compare with the LDS Church? How about the RCC?

You are defending the Church on the basis that other organisations are equally as bad or worse? Really?

Is the LDS Church a bad steward of money because they have been able to increase what they have received? I think they are doing a better job than our Federal Government; and better than our State Governments. In fact, they are better prepared to assist not only their own members, but also others during times of disaster than our own Government is.

and yet, when New Orleans happened, they didn't.

The Church doesn't need to just keep printing money that has no real value.

well that didn't work out so well for the Church the last time they attempted printing money.

The Church doesn't pass on any debt to our children.

Who's children? Are you including those children that are starving to death?

If, indeed, the Church is mis-managing money, then those responsible will be held accountable.

Mark 14:7 (KJV)

7 For ye have the poor with you always, and whensoever ye will ye may do them good: but me ye have not always.

I believe when Jesus said we will always have the poor among us, that He meant it. I don't believe He was trying to be harsh in saying this. I believe that being poor is one of the experiences all of us will go through because it is one of the things we need to learn in order for us to become compassionate toward those less fortunate than us. Also, being poor creates circumstances which can help us search for God. The poor being with us always helps to serve God's purposes. Jesus did not waste His words. In everything He said, there are lessons for us to learn.

Blessings,

jo

So you are saying because there will always be poor amongst us that excuses the Church from helping as many as they could?

$5 billion dollars on providing fashion and jewellery for the residents and visitors of Salt Lake City. Led by Christ? Not likely...

[_subgenius]

How much money is being spent in Africa to keep people alive in comparison the how much has been spent in Salt Lake City to keep people in jewellery and fashion?

Let's see if you can find $5 billion in total spend across the Church's humanitarian projects across the world in the last 25 years say...oh wait...the Church has published that number...$1.3 billion.

You may be able to walk and chew gum but it seems you can't feed the poor as well as you feed the fashion appetites of Salt Lake City...

Says the guy who does not tithe nor help anyone in Africa....but by golly your internet account is paid in full!

[_Drifting]

How much money is being spent in Africa to keep people alive in comparison the how much has been spent in Salt Lake City to keep people in jewellery and fashion?

Let's see if you can find $5 billion in total spend across the Church's humanitarian projects across the world in the last 25 years say...oh wait...the Church has published that number...$1.3 billion.

You may be able to walk and chew gum but it seems you can't feed the poor as well as you feed the fashion appetites of Salt Lake City...

Says the guy who does not tithe nor help anyone in Africa....but by golly your internet account is paid in full!

You are correct that I do not pay tithing.
You are incorrect in saying that I don't help anyone in Africa. Because, and here is where I am different to the Church, I put my money where my mouth is.

I'm glad you continue to ignore that your tithing goes towards items other than helping poor people but hey, Bednar needs that new thousand dollar suit right?

[_subgenius]

You are correct that I do not pay tithing.
You are incorrect in saying that I don't help anyone in Africa. Because, and here is where I am different to the Church, I put my money where my mouth is.

So, as you are obviously critical that the church allegedly spends 5:1 in favor of shopping over humanitarian aide your ratio is obviously much better if not the polar opposite......put that stone down and be careful because your hypocrisy is showing.
I would wager, and win, that you spend well over that ratio in your own self-indulgences than you spend on charity.

But this is a lost discussion on you as you have no awareness of how tithing blesses yourself and others....but i understand, though the tithe barns in the UK are fascinating they surely have a different meaning to you than to me.

[_Drifting]

You are correct that I do not pay tithing.
You are incorrect in saying that I don't help anyone in Africa. Because, and here is where I am different to the Church, I put my money where my mouth is.

So, as you are obviously critical that the church allegedly spends 5:1 in favor of shopping over humanitarian aide your ratio is obviously much better if not the polar opposite......put that stone down and be careful because your hypocrisy is showing.
I would wager, and win, that you spend well over that ratio in your own self-indulgences than you spend on charity.

But this is a lost discussion on you as you have no awareness of how tithing blesses yourself and others....but i understand, though the tithe barns in the UK are fascinating they surely have a different meaning to you than to me.

Actually your ratio is flawed.
Humanitarian aid expenditure is 0.7% of the Church's income.
What does all the rest of the $8 billion a year get spent on (as well as shopping obviously)?

[_subgenius]

Actually your ratio is flawed.
Humanitarian aid expenditure is 0.7% of the Church's income.
What does all the rest of the $8 billion a year get spent on (as well as shopping obviously)?

i was giving both of yo the benefit of the doubt due to operating expenses....nevertheless, my conclusion is valid and your ego will never publicly admit that you do nothing for the children of Africa...but you do not have admit it...for it is already known here.