Adam, first man circa 4,000 bc....?

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_Themis
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Re: Adam, first man circa 4,000 bc....?

Post by _Themis »

subgenius wrote:
There is a worldwide tradition of a global flood having occurred. The historical record clearly records stories of a global flood across cultures, continents and regions, too prevalent to be considered a coincidence.


I have heard this one, but when one looks closer I never see good evidence of this, but common stories of floods which have been happening all over the world long before man and would be an important part of their lives. What I see is some interpreting these stories to fit the biblical flood story, but I am open to you providing specifics.
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_Themis
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Re: Adam, first man circa 4,000 bc....?

Post by _Themis »

subgenius wrote:According to current archaeological evidence, civilization appears to have originated in the Ararat/Babylon region.



I have no idea how this is supposed to be evidence of a global flood, since the sciences which bring you this information also bring you information of people living all over the world anciently and didn't disappear. Seth already brought up Aborigines in Australia.
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_LittleNipper
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Re: Adam, first man circa 4,000 bc....?

Post by _LittleNipper »

Themis wrote:
subgenius wrote:According to current archaeological evidence, civilization appears to have originated in the Ararat/Babylon region.



I have no idea how this is supposed to be evidence of a global flood, since the sciences which bring you this information also bring you information of people living all over the world anciently and didn't disappear. Seth already brought up Aborigines in Australia.
And the Aborigines have not been around any longer than the Egyptians, Greeks, Hebrews, Europeans, etc... Anyone who thinks otherwise has no real proof --- some are only accepting the oral traditions of a sedate group of nomads. If one cannot accept the Bible, one most certainly cannot accept undocumented oral hearsay.
_Themis
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Re: Adam, first man circa 4,000 bc....?

Post by _Themis »

LittleNipper wrote: And the Aborigines have not been around any longer than the Egyptians, Greeks, Hebrews, Europeans, etc... Anyone who thinks otherwise has no real proof --- some are only accepting the oral traditions of a sedate group of nomads. If one cannot accept the Bible, one most certainly cannot accept undocumented oral hearsay.


What do you even know about the evidence JB brought up? You dismiss anything that does not fit what you want to believe. I think the Bible can be useful for scholars in looking at the past, as they do with many ancient texts and writings. I have no idea why you think we should accept the Bible so literally but the other texts.
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_SteelHead
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Re: Adam, first man circa 4,000 bc....?

Post by _SteelHead »

Undocumented oral hearsay?

Are you saying there are no other dating methods employed to date the history of Australasian aborigines?

Back to the literal Bible.

Joshua 10:13

Did the sun actually stand still? Did the moon stop?
It is better to be a warrior in a garden, than a gardener at war.

Some of us, on the other hand, actually prefer a religion that includes some type of correlation with reality.
~Bill Hamblin
_LittleNipper
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Re: Adam, first man circa 4,000 bc....?

Post by _LittleNipper »

SteelHead wrote:For my literal Bible friends, what happened in the following situation?

Joshua 10:13
13 And the sun stood still, and the moon stayed, until the people had avenged themselves upon their enemies. Is not this written in the book of Jasher?So the sun stood still in the midst of heaven, and hasted not to go down about a whole day.


Did the sun actually stop its journey?

The sun may have appeared to stop or in fact it may have stopped. Either way, God was involved. I have heard that some ancient cultures recorded longer hours of darkness, etc. If you think there should be some scientific explanation for such an event, I have to feel sorry for you.
_LittleNipper
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Re: Adam, first man circa 4,000 bc....?

Post by _LittleNipper »

SteelHead wrote:Undocumented oral hearsay?

Are you saying there are no other dating methods employed to date the history of Australasian aborigines?

Back to the literal Bible.

Joshua 10:13

Did the sun actually stand still? Did the moon stop?

The Aborigines as a people can be no older than Noah. The sun stopped moving across the sky. There is nothing wrong with that statement. It reflects the perspective of the person viewing the sun on planet earth.
_SteelHead
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Re: Adam, first man circa 4,000 bc....?

Post by _SteelHead »

So the sun stopped (or might have).... Did the Earth also stop rotating? Because..... you know the Earth's rotation causes sunrise and sunset. Stopping the sun would have other consequences, but the sun does not orbit around the Earth. So stopping the sun's motion would not stop the sun in the sky.
It is better to be a warrior in a garden, than a gardener at war.

Some of us, on the other hand, actually prefer a religion that includes some type of correlation with reality.
~Bill Hamblin
_LittleNipper
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Re: Adam, first man circa 4,000 bc....?

Post by _LittleNipper »

Themis wrote:
LittleNipper wrote: And the Aborigines have not been around any longer than the Egyptians, Greeks, Hebrews, Europeans, etc... Anyone who thinks otherwise has no real proof --- some are only accepting the oral traditions of a sedate group of nomads. If one cannot accept the Bible, one most certainly cannot accept undocumented oral hearsay.


What do you even know about the evidence JB brought up? You dismiss anything that does not fit what you want to believe. I think the Bible can be useful for scholars in looking at the past, as they do with many ancient texts and writings. I have no idea why you think we should accept the Bible so literally but the other texts.

He has provided no evidence, only opinion. And his opinion is not more valuable than the Biblical text he refuses to accept.
_SteelHead
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Re: Adam, first man circa 4,000 bc....?

Post by _SteelHead »

Well which is it nipper, did the sun stop, or did the Earth?

The Bible literally says the sun stood still and moon stopped and mentions nothing about the perspective of the viewer.

Are you qualifying scripture?

New International Version (©1984)
So the sun stood still, and the moon stopped, till the nation avenged itself on its enemies, as it is written in the Book of Jashar. The sun stopped in the middle of the sky and delayed going down about a full day.

New Living Translation (©2007)
So the sun stood still and the moon stayed in place until the nation of Israel had defeated its enemies. Is this event not recorded in [The Book of Jashar]? The sun stayed in the middle of the sky, and it did not set as on a normal day.

English Standard Version (©2001)
And the sun stood still, and the moon stopped, until the nation took vengeance on their enemies. Is this not written in the Book of Jashar? The sun stopped in the midst of heaven and did not hurry to set for about a whole day.

New American Standard Bible (©1995)
So the sun stood still, and the moon stopped, Until the nation avenged themselves of their enemies. Is it not written in the book of Jashar? And the sun stopped in the middle of the sky and did not hasten to go down for about a whole day.

King James Bible (Cambridge Ed.)
And the sun stood still, and the moon stayed, until the people had avenged themselves upon their enemies. Is not this written in the book of Jasher? So the sun stood still in the midst of heaven, and hasted not to go down about a whole day.

GOD'S WORD® Translation (©1995)
The sun stood still, and the moon stopped until a nation got revenge on its enemies. Isn't this recorded in the Book of Jashar? The sun stopped in the middle of the sky, and for nearly a day the sun was in no hurry to set.

King James 2000 Bible (©2003)
And the sun stood still, and the moon stayed, until the people had avenged themselves upon their enemies. Is not this written in the book of Jasher? So the sun stood still in the midst of heaven, and hastened not to go down about a whole day.

American King James Version
And the sun stood still, and the moon stayed, until the people had avenged themselves on their enemies. Is not this written in the book of Jasher? So the sun stood still in the middle of heaven, and hurried not to go down about a whole day.

American Standard Version
And the sun stood still, and the moon stayed, Until the nation had avenged themselves of their enemies. Is not this written in the book of Jashar? And the sun stayed in the midst of heaven, and hasted not to go down about a whole day.

Douay-Rheims Bible
And the sun and the moon stood still, till the people revenged themselves of their enemies. Is not this written in the book of the just? So the sun stood still in the midst of heaven, and hasted not to go down the space of one day.

Darby Bible Translation
And the sun stood still, and the moon remained where it was, until the nation had avenged themselves upon their enemies. Is not this written in the book of Jasher? And the sun remained standing in the midst of heaven, and hasted not to go down about a full day.

English Revised Version
And the sun stood still, and the moon stayed, until the nation had avenged themselves of their enemies. Is not this written in the book of Jashar? And the sun stayed in the midst of heaven, and hasted not to go down about a whole day.

Webster's Bible Translation
And the sun stood still, and the moon stayed, until the people had avenged themselves upon their enemies. Is not this written in the book of Jasher? So the sun stood still in the midst of heaven, and hasted not to go down about a whole day.

World English Bible
The sun stood still, and the moon stayed, until the nation had avenged themselves of their enemies. Isn't this written in the book of Jashar? The sun stayed in the midst of the sky, and didn't hurry to go down about a whole day.

Young's Literal Translation
and the sun standeth still, and the moon hath stood -- till the nation taketh vengeance on its enemies; is it not written on the Book of the Upright, 'and the sun standeth in the midst of the heavens, and hath not hasted to go in -- as a perfect day?'
It is better to be a warrior in a garden, than a gardener at war.

Some of us, on the other hand, actually prefer a religion that includes some type of correlation with reality.
~Bill Hamblin
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