LittleNipper wrote:I believe you are looking at this backwards. A guy is walking down the street and is attacked by another man. However, the man being assaulted is able to subdue his attacker and get the better of him. But then the wife of the attacker grabs the would be victim by his secrets to free her husband (the attacker). Such is being shown as one not to pitty. She has brought her troubles on herself, and in the wide scheme of things is shown to be the cause of her own mistreatment.
What the serious ... ?
And what is your problem with tattoos? I mean, you're ... obsessed with them! Why you so angry at tattooed folks?
When I was coming of age, it was long hair. I eventually sported the "Beatle" look like most young men of my generation. The difference was, one day I finally cut my hair (though I did eventually grow a mullet). The fad was over and I didn't want to take care of the mop anymore ---I finally grew up (as it were). Tattoos are really expensive (at a time when people say they have very little). When the fad is over the tattoo remains (or a whitened blotch). My long hair said something about me for a time, but a tattoo says something about someone years after they wish they had never said it. My hair is now short and my son's hair is rather short. I feel I can presently set an example for him. The person with the tattoo will always be implying that getting one is okay (they have one), even if the person sporting one has changed his/her mind long since. I find the "tattooed circus man" look vulgar and the tattooed woman look as canival, in a garish sort of way. I mean the guy, at least, can throw on a long sleeved shirt, or a suit and look normal (or at least different) . The young "lady"; however, now must wear the very same tattoo every day with everything. She wears a red swimsuit--- one sees the purple unicorn on her shoulder. She goes to a formal wearing the gold strapless gown and there is the same dumb purple unicorn showing. Why spend so much to look so cheap? Why not give all that money to the poor? That would a least be useful and someone would be greatful and others impressed. No one is impressed by a tattoo (at least not after a month or so down the road---it becomes OLD HAT).
25:11 When men strive together one with another, and the wife of the one draweth near for to deliver her husband out of the hand of him that smiteth him, and putteth forth her hand, and taketh him by the secrets: 25:12 Then thou shalt cut off her hand, thine eye shall not pity her.
LittleNipper wrote:I believe you are looking at this backwards. A guy is walking down the street and is attacked by another man. However, the man being assaulted is able to subdue his attacker and get the better of him. But then the wife of the attacker grabs the would be victim by the secrets to free her husband (the attacker). Such is being shown as one not to pitty. She has brought her troubles on herself, and in the wide scheme of things is shown to be the cause of her own mistreatment.
Sorry, but you fail. The scripture is explicitly clear that it is the wife of the man being attacked who does the secret grabbing.
But feel free to have another try...
“We look to not only the spiritual but also the temporal, and we believe that a person who is impoverished temporally cannot blossom spiritually.” Keith McMullin - Counsellor in Presiding Bishopric
"One, two, three...let's go shopping!" Thomas S Monson - Prophet, Seer, Revelator
So to bring it back round... We are talking about over the top, inappropriate punishment handed out by brutish bullies claiming to be carrying out work on GODs behalf.
Like Brigham Young's Blood Atonement.
Unjustifiable violence.
PrickKicker: I used to be a Narrow minded, short sighted, Lying, Racist, Homophobic, Pious, Moron. But they were all behavioral traits that I had learnt through Mormonism.
PrickKicker wrote:So to bring it back round... We are talking about over the top, inappropriate punishment handed out by brutish bullies claiming to be carrying out work on GODs behalf.
American King James Version Then you shall cut off her hand, your eye shall not pity her.
American Standard Version then thou shalt cut off her hand, thine eye shall have no pity.
Douay-Rheims Bible Thou shalt cut off her hand, neither shalt thou be moved with any pity in her regard.
Darby Bible Translation thou shalt cut off her hand; thine eye shall not spare.
English Revised Version then thou shalt cut off her hand, thine eye shall have no pity.
Webster's Bible Translation Then thou shalt cut off her hand, thy eye shall not pity her.
World English Bible then you shall cut off her hand, your eye shall have no pity.
Young's Literal Translation then thou hast cut off her hand, thine eye doth not spare.
Barnes' Notes on the Bible This is the only mutilation prescribed by the Law of Moses, unless we except the retaliation prescribed as a punishment for the infliction on another of bodily injuries Leviticus 24:19-20. The act in question was probably not rare in the times and countries for which the Law of Moses was designed. It is of course to be understood that the act was willful, and that the prescribed punishment would be inflicted according to the sentence of the judges.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Gill's Exposition of the Entire Bible Then thou shall cut off her hand,.... Which was to be done not by the man that strove with her husband, or by any bystander, but by the civil magistrate or his order. This severity was used to deter women from such an immodest as well as injurious action, who on such an occasion are very passionate and inconsiderate. Our Lord is thought to refer to this law, Matthew 5:30; though the Jewish writers interpret this not of actual cutting off the hand, but of paying a valuable consideration, a price put upon it; so Jarchi; and Aben Ezra compares it with the law of retaliation, "eye for eye", Exodus 21:24; which they commonly understand of paying a price for the both, &c. lost; and who adds, if she does not redeem her hand (i.e. by a price) it must be cut off:
thine eye shall not pity her; on account of the tenderness of her sex, or because of the plausible excuse that might be made for her action, being done hastily and in a passion, and out of affection to her husband; but these considerations were to have no place with the magistrate, who was to order the punishment inflicted, either in the strict literal sense, or by paying a sum of money
Exodus 20:1-26 Then God said that He is the Lord their God, who brought them out of the land of Egypt, out of the place where they served. They are to worship no gods but the LORD. They are not to make for themselves an image of a god to look like anything that is in heaven above or on the earth below or in the waters under the earth. Do not worship them or work for them. GOD is jealous and will punish the Hebrews even to their great-grandchildren, for the sins of their fathers who hate God. God will show loving-kindness to thousands of those who love Him and continually try to keep God's Laws. They are not to use the name of the Lord God in a false way. For the Lord will punish the one who uses His name falsely. They are to remember the Day of Rest, to keep it holy ---Six days they will do all their work. The seventh day is a Day of Rest to the Lord God. No one is to work on that day, including children, servants, the cattle, or visiting travelers. For in six days the Lord made the heavens, the earth, the sea and all that is in them. And He rested on the seventh day. So the Lord gave honor to the Day of Rest and made it holy. They are to Honor both father and mother, so that their lives might be long in the land the Lord God gives yjem. They are not to murder other people. Thay are not to commit sensual sins. They are not to steal anything. They are not to tell a lie about one's neighbor. Do not have a desire for the neighbor’s house. Do not have a desire for his wife or his male servant, his female servant, or his bull or his donkey or anything that belongs to your neighbor. The people heard and saw the thunder and lightning, the sound of the horn, and the mountain smoking. And when the people saw it, they shook with fear and stood far away. They said to Moses that he should speak to them and they will listen. But do not let God speak or they will die. Moses said to the people to have no fear. God comse to test, so that they may have enough fear of Him to keep from acting out sin. The people stood far away, while Moses comes near to the cloud where God is.The Lord tells Moses to remind them that they have seen for themselves that God has spoken to them from heaven. Do not make any gods of silver or gold or anything --- for I am THE GOD. They are to make an altar of earth for God, and on it give burnt and peace gifts in worship, of their sheep and cattle. Everywhere where the true God is thought of, HE will come and bring good to you. If designing an altar of stone for God, do not use cut stones. For a cut object is unclean. Do not go up on steps to God's altar, so no part of the body may be seen without being covered.
Young's Literal Translation (YLT)
1 `And God speaketh all these words, saying,
2 I [am] Jehovah thy God, who hath brought thee out of the land of Egypt, out of a house of servants.
3 `Thou hast no other Gods before Me.
4 `Thou dost not make to thyself a graven image, or any likeness which [is] in the heavens above, or which [is] in the earth beneath, or which [is] in the waters under the earth.
5 Thou dost not bow thyself to them, nor serve them: for I, Jehovah thy God, [am] a zealous God, charging iniquity of fathers on sons, on the third [generation], and on the fourth, of those hating Me,
6 and doing kindness to thousands, of those loving Me and keeping My commands.
7 `Thou dost not take up the name of Jehovah thy God for a vain thing, for Jehovah acquitteth not him who taketh up His name for a vain thing.
8 `Remember the Sabbath-day to sanctify it;
9 six days thou dost labour, and hast done all thy work,
10 and the seventh day [is] a Sabbath to Jehovah thy God; thou dost not do any work, thou, and thy son, and thy daughter, thy man-servant, and thy handmaid, and thy cattle, and thy sojourner who is within thy gates, --
11 for six days hath Jehovah made the heavens and the earth, the sea, and all that [is] in them, and resteth in the seventh day; therefore hath Jehovah blessed the Sabbath-day, and doth sanctify it.
12 `Honour thy father and thy mother, so that thy days are prolonged on the ground which Jehovah thy God is giving to thee.
13 `Thou dost not murder.
14 `Thou dost not commit adultery.
15 `Thou dost not steal.
16 `Thou dost not answer against thy neighbour a false testimony.
17 `Thou dost not desire the house of thy neighbour, thou dost not desire the wife of thy neighbour, or his man-servant, or his handmaid, or his ox, or his ass, or anything which [is] thy neighbour's.'
18 And all the people are seeing the voices, and the flames, and the sound of the trumpet, and the mount smoking; and the people see, and move, and stand afar off,
19 and say unto Moses, `Speak thou with us, and we hear, and let not God speak with us, lest we die.'
20 And Moses saith unto the people, `Fear not, for to try you hath God come, and in order that His fear may be before your faces -- that ye sin not.'
21 And the people stand afar off, and Moses hath drawn nigh unto the thick darkness where God [is].
22 And Jehovah saith unto Moses, `Thus dost thou say unto the sons of Israel: Ye -- ye have seen that from the heavens I have spoken with you;
23 ye do not make with Me gods of silver, even gods of gold ye do not make to yourselves.
24 `An altar of earth thou dost make for Me, and thou hast sacrificed on it thy burnt-offerings and thy peace-offerings, thy flock and thy herd; in every place where I cause My name to be remembered I come in unto thee, and have blessed thee.
25 `And if an altar of stones thou dost make to Me, thou dost not build them of hewn work; when thy tool thou hast waved over it, then thou dost pollute it;
26 neither dost thou go up by steps on Mine altar, that thy nakedness be not revealed upon it.
Last edited by Guest on Wed Sep 19, 2012 3:15 pm, edited 2 times in total.
PrickKicker: I used to be a Narrow minded, short sighted, Lying, Racist, Homophobic, Pious, Moron. But they were all behavioral traits that I had learnt through Mormonism.
PrickKicker wrote:Why is the law of Moses called the law of Moses?
Who made them? Was it Moses?
It certainly wasn't a God of Love.
The Law of Moses is so named because God gave them to Moses and Moses brought them to the Israelites. The LAW is an illustration of God's perfection and what a perfect God demands from someone attempting to attain heaven by being good. Remember, if you break even one law, God says you broke them all. The God of love came and shed His own blood on the cross for the remission of our imperfections if we accept His gift.
Prickkicker, He is a God of love. If He deems it wise to take the life of someone He created, it's not the end of existance for that person! The person can keep progressing in the spirit world where he can't harm others as much!
Exodus 21:1-36 These are the Laws which God wishes Moses to give to the Israelites. If a Hebrew pays for a Hebrew indentured servant, that servant will work for six years only. In the seventh year he is free, at no cost. If he comes single, he will leave single. If he is married, then his wife will leave with him. If his owner gives him a wife and she gives birth to his sons or daughters, the wife and her children will belong to her owner, and he will leave by himself. But if the servant says that he loves his master, his wife and his children; He does not wish to go free, then his owner will bring him to the judges. And he will bring him to the door or the side of the door. There his owner will make a hole in his ear with a sharp object. And he will serve him all his life. If a man sells his daughter to be a female servant, she is not to go free as the male servants do. If she does not please her owner who has taken her for himself, he will take a fee for her to be set free. He does not have the right to sell her to a strange people, because he has not been fair to her. If he takes her for his son, he will act toward her as with a daughter. If he marries again, her food, clothing and marriage rights are to stay the same. And if he will not do these three things for her, then she may go free, without paying any fee. Whoever hits a man so that he dies will be put to death. But if he did not plan to hurt him, but God allowed it to happen, then there is a place where he may run to be safe. But if a man wants to hurt his neighbor and he plans to kill him, then he is to be taken away from God's altar and to death. Whoever hits his father or his mother will be put to death. Whoever steals a man and sells him, or keeps him for himself, will be put to death. Whoever curses his father or his mother will be put to death. When men argue and one hits the other with a stone or with his hand, and he does not die but has to stay in bed because of it, then if he gets up and walks around outside using his walking stick, the one who hit him will not be punished. He will only pay for the loss of his time. And he will take care of him until he is healed. When a man hits his male or female servant with a stick so that he or she dies, he will be punished. But if he or she lives a day or two, he will not be punished, for his servant belongs to him. If men fight with each other and hit a woman who is going to have a child so that she loses her baby but no other hurt comes to her, he must pay whatever the woman’s husband says he must, as agreed upon by the judges. But if there is other hurt also, then it is life for life, eye for eye, tooth for tooth, hand for hand, foot for foot, burn for burn, cut for cut, sore for sore. If a man hits the eye of his male or female servant and destroys it, he will let the person go free because of the eye. If he knocks out a tooth of his man or woman servant, he will let the person go free because of the tooth. When a bull kills a man or a woman with its horns, the bull will be executed by stoning. And its flesh will not be eaten. But the owner of the bull will not be punished. But if a bull has tried to kill with its horns before, and the owner has been told but does not keep him penned in, and the bull kills a man or a woman, the bull will be killed with stones and the owner will be put to death as well. But if he is allowed to pay for his life, then he will pay whatever is asked of him. If the bull kills any son or any daughter, it will be punished by the same law. If the bull kills a male or female servant, the bull’s owner will give the servant’s owner thirty pieces of silver. And the bull will be executed by stoning. When a man leaves a deep hole open, or digs a deep hole and does not cover it, and a bull or donkey falls into it, the owner of the hole will pay for the loss. He will give money to the animal’s owner. And the carcass will belong to the hole digger. If one man’s bull hurts another’s so that it dies, they will sell the live bull and both will share the value of the sold animal 50/50. And they will divide the carcass 50/50. Or if it is known that the bull has tried to kill with its horns in the past, but its owner has not kept it shut up, he will pay bull for bull. And the carcass will become his.
Young's Literal Translation (YLT)
1 `And these [are] the judgments which thou dost set before them:
2 `When thou buyest a Hebrew servant -- six years he doth serve, and in the seventh he goeth out as a freeman for nought;
3 if by himself he cometh in, by himself he goeth out; if he [is] owner of a wife, then his wife hath gone out with him;
4 if his lord give to him a wife, and she hath borne to him sons or daughters -- the wife and her children are her lord's, and he goeth out by himself.
5 `And if the servant really say: I have loved my lord, my wife, and my sons -- I do not go out free;
6 then hath his lord brought him nigh unto God, and hath brought him nigh unto the door, or unto the side-post, and his lord hath bored his ear with an awl, and he hath served him -- to the age.
7 `And when a man selleth his daughter for a handmaid, she doth not go out according to the going out of the men-servants;
8 if evil in the eyes of her lord, so that he hath not betrothed her, then he hath let her be ransomed; to a strange people he hath not power to sell her, in his dealing treacherously with her.
9 `And if to his son he betroth her, according to the right of daughters he doth to her.
10 `If another [woman] he take for him, her food, her covering, and her habitation, he doth not withdraw;
11 and if these three he do not to her, then she hath gone out for nought, without money.
12 `He who smiteth a man so that he hath died, is certainly put to death;
13 as to him who hath not laid wait, and God hath brought to his hand, I have even set for thee a place whither he doth flee.
14 `And when a man doth presume against his neighbour to slay him with subtilty, from Mine altar thou dost take him to die.
15 `And he who smiteth his father or his mother is certainly put to death.
16 `And he who stealeth a man, and hath sold him, and he hath been found in his hand, is certainly put to death.
17 `And he who is reviling his father or his mother is certainly put to death.
18 `And when men contend, and a man hath smitten his neighbour with a stone, or with the fist, and he die not, but hath fallen on the bed;
19 if he rise, and hath gone up and down without on his staff, then hath the smiter been acquitted; only his cessation he giveth, and he is thoroughly healed.
20 `And when a man smiteth his man-servant or his handmaid, with a rod, and he hath died under his hand -- he is certainly avenged;
21 only if he remain a day, or two days, he is not avenged, for he [is] his money.
22 `And when men strive, and have smitten a pregnant woman, and her children have come out, and there is no mischief, he is certainly fined, as the husband of the woman doth lay upon him, and he hath given through the judges;
23 and if there is mischief, then thou hast given life for life,
24 eye for eye, tooth for tooth, hand for hand, foot for foot,
25 burning for burning, wound for wound, stripe for stripe.
26 `And when a man smiteth the eye of his man-servant, or the eye of his handmaid, and hath destroyed it, as a freeman he doth send him away for his eye;
27 and if a tooth of his man-servant or a tooth of his handmaid he knock out, as a freeman he doth send him away for his tooth.
28 `And when an ox doth gore man or woman, and they have died, the ox is certainly stoned, and his flesh is not eaten, and the owner of the ox [is] acquitted;
29 and if the ox is [one] accustomed to gore heretofore, and it hath been testified to its owner, and he doth not watch it, and it hath put to death a man or woman, the ox is stoned, and its owner also is put to death.
30 `If atonement is laid upon him, then he hath given the ransom of his life, according to all that is laid upon him;
31 whether it gore a son or gore a daughter, according to this judgment it is done to him.
32 `If the ox gore a man-servant or a handmaid, thirty silver shekels he doth give to their lord, and the ox is stoned.
33 `And when a man doth open a pit, or when a man doth dig a pit, and doth not cover it, and an ox or ass hath fallen thither, --
34 the owner of the pit doth repay, money he doth give back to its owner, and the dead is his.
35 `And when a man's ox doth smite the ox of his neighbour, and it hath died, then they have sold the living ox, and halved its money, and also the dead one they do halve;
36 or, it hath been known that the ox is [one] accustomed to gore heretofore, and its owner doth not watch it, he certainly repayeth ox for ox, and the dead is his.
Several problems here in Moses-GOD's logic... I wonder if Moses inlaw /inlaws high priest Melchizedek was be hind this pattern of reasoning?
1. It is a vicious cycle, An eye for and eye and a tooth for a tooth, would make the whole world Blind and Toothless.
2. People in authority to over see such punishments tend to become desensitised to it and will often abuse it, because they cannot be subject to it in the execution of their duties, and so are above it.
ie: person 'A' strikes person 'B' with a stone and kills them, the one assuming authority person 'C', then stones person 'B', someone must now stone person 'C' and so on and so on to the end of persons.
GOD certainly does move in mysterious ways... Or He is a Psychopathic, Clueless imbecile.
Good luck in your quest to become LIKE him.
PrickKicker: I used to be a Narrow minded, short sighted, Lying, Racist, Homophobic, Pious, Moron. But they were all behavioral traits that I had learnt through Mormonism.
. The young "lady"; however, now must wear the very same tattoo every day with everything. She wears a red swimsuit--- one sees the purple unicorn on her shoulder. She goes to a formal wearing the gold strapless gown and there is the same dumb purple unicorn showing. Why spend so much to look so cheap? Why not give all that money to the poor? That would a least be useful and someone would be greatful and others impressed. No one is impressed by a tattoo (at least not after a month or so down the road---it becomes OLD HAT).