Epic Mormonism Live on Rosebud Accusations

[Kukulkan]

All documents reveal it was a very consensual relationship on both parts. I would agree it's a false accusation.

Yes, I understand this is your opinion. That's been made quite clear.

I am legitimately curious. Could you provide evidence from the documentation that shows there was an instance where JD engaged in sexual assault/harassment against Rosebud?

[master_dc]

Since you are here, honest question.

What does JD have to do with the franchise lawsuit?

I have no earthly idea. Haven't looked into all of that stuff.

Ok so we are all missing that piece. I am trying to hang on and give her the time and patience. But man, it is all over the place and hard to follow.

In your professional opinion, what evidence is the the most powerful, that clearly shows the severity of her accusations? From what I have looked at, I just see a relationship that fell apart, that never really had a chance from the start, and that ended far from perfect.

[Jersey Girl]

His posts here? He hasn't posted on this board.

Let's review.

I said John took his first public swing at Rosebud on the ML episode a week or two ago.

You said "Nuh-uh, he was posting about it on MD a long time before that."

I responded that posting on MD hardly constitutes taking a public swing at anyone because this place (or the old place, whatever) is a hole in the wall that only six people really give a crap about.

Is that more clear?

Oh I see. Maybe you should take that up with Rosebud since she's the one that brought it to MDB years ago. You know. For the historians.

[master_dc]

His posts here? He hasn't posted on this board.

Let's review.

I said John took his first public swing at Rosebud on the ML episode a week or two ago.

You said "Nuh-uh, he was posting about it on MD a long time before that."

I responded that posting on MD hardly constitutes taking a public swing at anyone because this place (or the old place, whatever) is a hole in the wall that only six people really give a Crap about.

Is that more clear?

This is our hole in the wall, also known as a sty in some other parts of the world (living rooms). Yet it is where Rosebud decided to post her expose. Go figure.

[Jersey Girl]

jpatterson the incident I vaguely referred to is one of the documents on the damn document drop. As you can see this isn't the first time in 10 years that he took a swing at her. She felt it important enough to include it in her drop.


https://drive.google.com/file/d/14Pq1DP ... n8xYG/view

[consiglieri]

Let's review.

I said John took his first public swing at Rosebud on the ML episode a week or two ago.

You said "Nuh-uh, he was posting about it on MD a long time before that."

I responded that posting on MD hardly constitutes taking a public swing at anyone because this place (or the old place, whatever) is a hole in the wall that only six people really give a Crap about.

Is that more clear?

This is our hole in the wall, also known as a sty in some other parts of the world (living rooms). Yet it is where Rosebud decided to post her expose. Go figure.

And where JP comes to convince us of the justness of his cause.

I mean Rosebud’s cause.

[jpatterson]

In your professional opinion, what evidence is the the most powerful, that clearly shows the severity of her accusations? From what I have looked at, I just see a relationship that fell apart, that never really had a chance from the start, and that ended far from perfect.

There's no smoking gun, if that's what you're asking.

If you do a cursory scan of the documents, you're going to be left with whatever opinion you already had that has been clouded by years of he-said/she-said drama.

But if you read all of it, in chronological order and without a predetermined outcome in mind, I absolutely see a pattern of predation by John towards Rosebud that, to me, lines up with the later cycles of physical predation (promising to not come to her room, then coming to her room; promising to not coming to her room, then getting in her bed; promising not to get in her bed, then groping her, etc etc) that she describes. So, for me, the Facebook messages add a lot of credibility to her forensic interview statements.

The early Facebook messages are chilling if you read them all the way through and know the well-documented patterns of predation (targeting, gaining trust, fulfilling a need, isolating, then physical contact).

It's textbook. I believe the evidence shows that John emotionally manipulated her into believing she was in a completely consensual relationship, when in reality he had tremendously more power and regularly exerted that power over her. He even admits to manipulating her in his Aug 10 email. Then he turns right around and gaslights her in the next sentence.

But Rosebud is scrappy (just sometimes not in the most productive ways). She figures out John's MO (he gets off on power) and turns the tables on him, suggesting that they just get it on. This is literally the only thing that gets him to back off. She throws herself at him, and all of a sudden he can't get it up. That's when he flips out and wants to get rid of her. When he realizes she's not going to play his game anymore.

Now Kish and Doc and some other folks are going to do like they've done several times in this thread and scoff and guffaw at all of this because because "she's an adult!" and all sorts of other misogynistic arguments that ignore established research on predation and assault and harassment. But that's just because they're uneducated.

There are no bright lines here. No white hats. There's human complexity, complicated motivations and a motherload of nuance.

[jpatterson]

This is our hole in the wall, also known as a sty in some other parts of the world (living rooms). Yet it is where Rosebud decided to post her expose. Go figure.

Again, I call attention to your lack of self-awareness in thinking she was ever posting here for your benefit.

[drumdude]

John and Anne were both testing each others limits and boundaries. It was a normal everyday affair, despite Anne wanting to call it predation. The message exchanges speak for themselves.

The only reason Anne wants to portray John is the one with power and she's the poor innocent victim is because she still holds resentment that John didn't leave his wife. And resentment that John retained control of Open Stories Foundation, and she was shut out of all the Facebook groups she created.

[consiglieri]

This is our hole in the wall, also known as a sty in some other parts of the world (living rooms). Yet it is where Rosebud decided to post her expose. Go figure.

Again, I call attention to your lack of self-awareness in thinking she was ever posting here for your benefit.

No one here felt it was for our benefit.