Epic Mormonism Live on Rosebud Accusations

[Tator]

Wow 110 pages of @&//&>>! Now 111.

When Rosebud the scorned goes sledding it all goes one direction, downhill and for over a decade. Thankfully for Rosebud she has useful idiots like jpbrosebud to pull the sled to the top of the $hit pile and give her a push so she continue to go further downhill.

[dastardly stem]

I'm not basing my conclusion of sexual harassment on how well or how badly the victim responded, or on her imaginations about how she was equal. I'm basing it on the acts of the superior and the Open Stories Foundation board. I agree the victim has problems in how she handled it, victims commonly do.

Bottom line is a superior had an improper relationship with a subordinate, and then he wanted it to end and he wanted her gone, and the Open Stories Foundation board facilitated that. The victim was removed from her job because of a sexual relationship with her superior. That's defined as sexual harassment.

My personal opinion is basically just as you state it. He wanted her out realizing the whole affair was a mistake, settled on it being over, and set it up so her job would be sacrificed for his personal satisfaction. Everything else is a distraction to the one issue that Rosebud could possibly take, it seems. Unfortunately she and her partners talked all around the one issue, failed to ever state it, claimed evidence for every nefarious sounding thing possible, only to fail miserably when they put it out there....10 years later. Its no wonder everyone's more annoyed by her antics then concerned about JD"s actions.

[Kukulkan]

It was clear from the documents and the podcast that the "equal" treatment was not equal. It is clear that Dehlin was considered more important. Earlier in this thread there was repeated insistence that an 8 month volunteer recently turned employee shouldn't be considered as the equal of the 6 year paid podcaster who started the foundation and was paid far more than anyone else. Their situations were not equal, and the superior wanted the subordinate "gone." I agree that the offering was a way to make a bad situation look better, but the intent and result was still the same. The subordinate lost her job as a result of an inappropriate sexual relationship with her superior.

I agree with this. I don't follow with JP and Rosebud accusations that JD is this malicious, predatory and evil deviant who needs to be locked away for the rest of his life.

[jpatterson]

That’s a dishonest recounting of events. It makes it seem like Rosebud was taken by surprise by them

I'd love to understand how you got that from what I wrote.

[jpatterson]

I agree with this. I don't follow with JP and Rosebud accusations that JD is this malicious, predatory and evil deviant who needs to be locked away for the rest of his life.

Again, putting words in my mouth.

His behavior towards Rosebud in the Facebook chats has similar patterns of predation. I never said he was "evil" or a "deviant" or that he needs to be "locked away." You're being overly dramatic.

That being said, I was on the phone last night with another woman who contacted me about her experiences with JD which, not sexual in nature, confirm that Rosebud is not the only woman he's had issues with. No, I will not tell you her name or give you her email address. You're just going to have to assume that I'm lying from the get-go.

Another endgame when it comes to standing up for survivors is to create space for other people who have had...let's just say run-ins...with JD. Sometimes all it takes is for one person to tell their story.

[Kishkumen]

I'd love to understand how you got that from what I wrote.

You can play dumb, but I am not obliged to play along.

[Moksha]

... and Kukulkan ...

Hey, I remember him, along with Fran and Ollie.

[drumdude]

Let's take a look at Apple's sexual harassment policy. You know, one of the largest corporations in the world.

https://www.apple.com/supplier-responsi ... ndards.pdf

Sexual Harassment
• Unwelcome sexual advances, requests for sexual favors, and all other verbal or physical conduct of a sexual nature, when

(a) submission to such conduct is made either explicitly or implicitly a term or a condition of an individual’s employment;
(b) an employment decision is based on an individual’s submission to or rejection of such conduct; or
(c) such conduct has the purpose or effect of unreasonably interfering with an individual’s work performance by creating an intimidating, hostile, or sexually offensive environment.

• Offensive sexual comments, jokes, innuendoes, and other sexually oriented statements.
• Display of pornographic materials or sexually explicit images.

The following shall not be construed as Sexual Harassment:
• Interaction based on mutual consent.
• Occasional compliments that are socially and culturally acceptable and appropriate unless they make an individual uncomfortable

If Open Stories Foundation had the same sexual harassment policy in place that Apple has today, would John have violated it? Note that nowhere in Apple's policy are relationships between subordinates and superiors prohibited.

[pistolero]

That being said, I was on the phone last night with another woman who contacted me about her experiences with JD which, not sexual in nature, confirm that Rosebud is not the only woman he's had issues with. No, I will not tell you her name or give you her email address. You're just going to have to assume that I'm lying from the get-go.

Another endgame when it comes to standing up for survivors is to create space for other people who have had...let's just say run-ins...with JD. Sometimes all it takes is for one person to tell their story.

Nobody is saying that people shouldn't be accountable for their actions. Clearly if JD has committed a crime, then there are protocols and established processes for dealing with it. If he's just an narcissistic ass, but within the realms of the law, then by all means smear him online that he is such if you want to. That's fun too.

I think the issue that many have with this situation is the claim that something illegal has happened and that it wasn't dealt with. It was an ugly situation that is for sure, but I still feel that you have been unable to convince that an actual crime was committed. In the end it's just turning into an online smear campaign, but with allegations that can't be completely supported nor substantiated.

If anything, you are damaging those very spaces you pretend to create for survivors with all this unsubstantiated innuendo that you splurge onto the internet. You are not helping survivors.

[Kukulkan]

... and Kukulkan ...

Hey, I remember him, along with Fran and Ollie.