problems with God

[_ludwigm]

Please read my comment above --- if you can read so good --- then quote me where did I wrote anything about marriage?

GOD does not want Believers to marry non-believers. It is obvious that such a match would cause contention and heartache. Moses did marry a Ethiopian, and Boaz's marriage to Ruth who was a Moabite ----- who became the great------------- grandmother of Jesus. It seems to me that you are failing to understand what you read.

The Moabites and Ammonites are simply different tribes (or nations, if one like this word better) whose unpardonable sin was that their ancestors hundreds of years before "met you not with bread and with water in the way, when ye came forth out of Egypt"...


by the way are believers so important fraction of humanity, that they must begin the word with capital letter ?

[_LittleNipper]

Status does not impress GOD.

GOD does not want Believers to marry non-believers. It is obvious that such a match would cause contention and heartache. Moses did marry a Ethiopian, and Boaz's marriage to Ruth who was a Moabite ----- who became the great------------- grandmother of Jesus. It seems to me that you are failing to understand what you read.

I just love how religionists of all flavors can speak so blithely and confidently about what god "wants", apparently without regard for what other religionists have decided that god "wants".

And I'd be fine with it, to a certain extent, except that they all want to impose their beliefs about what god wants on others.

A pox on them!

I do not wish to impose my beliefs on you. HOWEVER, I do feel that I have the right as an American and a Christian to be able to openly expose you to my beliefs. The Founding Fathers created a nation where freedom of religion was possible ----- and not freedom from it. That simply mean that you don't have to believe what I believe; however, you have no right to publically exclude what I believe. Privately, you have every right to exclude whatever you are afraid of or annoys you from your own home.

I hold up the Bible as my standard. I do not make up what I believe nor base my beliefs on what makes me "feel" good. I have lived shoulder to shoulder with people of many different faiths. And I find that as long as I stick to the Bible others (who share that book) are forced to examine if their beliefs truly follows that script or skips around, picks and chooses, adds to it, or leaves out what they find "offensive."
I might add that I do not wish a pox on anyone, anymore than I'd wish someone eternal damnation. I hold the light up high and let the shadows flee where they will. My prayer is that you and others would note differences in beliefs that are Biblically accurate from those that are not.

[_DrW]

The Founding Fathers created a nation where freedom of religion was possible ----- and not freedom from it....

Little Nipper,

What does this nonsense even mean?

Are you saying that the founding fathers intended that there be no freedom from religion (in that every citizen must adhere to some religion) in the United States of America?

Do you even read this stuff before you click Submit?

[_Zadok]

I do not wish to impose my beliefs on you. HOWEVER, I do feel that I have the right as an American and a Christian to be able to openly expose you to my beliefs.

To what end? Isn't your interest in 'exposing' someone to your beliefs a veiled attempt to convince them that your beliefs are superior to their beliefs and that they should conform and convert to what you think is right?

The Founding Fathers created a nation where freedom of religion was possible ----- and not freedom from it.

The 'Founding Fathers' recognized that the population, including themselves, had an assortment of religious beliefs. And sought to protect the Government from being ruled by, or infected by, any particular version of 'the one and only true church'. They were aware of the evils that had occurred between Catholics and Protestants in England, and sought to protect the new American Government from a similar fate.

At NO time was it the intent of the 'Founding Fathers' to provide a state sponsored pulpit where people could aggressively or passively 'expose' others to a particular way of religious thinking.

I hold up the Bible as my standard. I do not make up what I believe nor base my beliefs on what makes me "feel" good. I have lived shoulder to shoulder with people of many different faiths. And I find that as long as I stick to the Bible others (who share that book) are forced to examine if their beliefs truly follows that script or skips around, picks and chooses, adds to it, or leaves out what they find "offensive."

Your Bible is a hodge-podge of stories, some true and others not so much, and instructions for right living that confuse any thinking mind. (Have you spent any time in the first five books?) And frankly it is this same 'Bible' which has spawned all of the different sects of Christianity as their leaders have focused on one particular conflicting teaching which they say is more correct than any other.

I think what I find disturbing, and perhaps DrW also, is that you would come to a gathering of mostly refugees from Mormonism and try to re-indoctrinate us to something that we have just discovered is likely a hoax. That is a waste of your time, and it annoys the unbelievers.

[_The Erotic Apologist]

I do not wish to impose my beliefs on you. HOWEVER, I do feel that I have the right as an American and a Christian to be able to openly expose you to my beliefs.

No, that's precisely what you're trying to do. That's why you so often find it necessary to engage in what Mormons describe as "lying for the lord."

We've been over this before, Nipper.

[_Amore]

I'm all for debate - expressing and even trying to persuade each other of different points of view.
That's a faster way of exposing any problematic interpretations of "God" etc., than keeping a lid on it.

And as a popular guy around here said, "the truth will carve itself."

OTOH, I've noticed the tendency to believe that by repetition, truth is increased (atheist or theist).

[_ludwigm]

I do not wish to impose my beliefs on you.

No, that's precisely what you're trying to do.

+1

HOWEVER, I do feel that I have the right as an American and a Christian to be able to openly expose you to my beliefs.

What about nonamericans and/or nonchristians?

[_ludwigm]

I hold up the Bible as my standard.

Your Bible is a hodge-podge of stories, some true and others not so much, and instructions for right living that confuse any thinking mind. (Have you spent any time in the first five books?)

Even he wants us to spent a lot of our time; see viewtopic.php?f=3&t=24331 ...

[_LittleNipper]

I do not wish to impose my beliefs on you. HOWEVER, I do feel that I have the right as an American and a Christian to be able to openly expose you to my beliefs.

To what end? Isn't your interest in 'exposing' someone to your beliefs a veiled attempt to convince them that your beliefs are superior to their beliefs and that they should conform and convert to what you think is right?

The Founding Fathers created a nation where freedom of religion was possible ----- and not freedom from it.

The 'Founding Fathers' recognized that the population, including themselves, had an assortment of religious beliefs. And sought to protect the Government from being ruled by, or infected by, any particular version of 'the one and only true church'. They were aware of the evils that had occurred between Catholics and Protestants in England, and sought to protect the new American Government from a similar fate.

At NO time was it the intent of the 'Founding Fathers' to provide a state sponsored pulpit where people could aggressively or passively 'expose' others to a particular way of religious thinking.

I hold up the Bible as my standard. I do not make up what I believe nor base my beliefs on what makes me "feel" good. I have lived shoulder to shoulder with people of many different faiths. And I find that as long as I stick to the Bible others (who share that book) are forced to examine if their beliefs truly follows that script or skips around, picks and chooses, adds to it, or leaves out what they find "offensive."

Your Bible is a hodge-podge of stories, some true and others not so much, and instructions for right living that confuse any thinking mind. (Have you spent any time in the first five books?) And frankly it is this same 'Bible' which has spawned all of the different sects of Christianity as their leaders have focused on one particular conflicting teaching which they say is more correct than any other.

I think what I find disturbing, and perhaps DrW also, is that you would come to a gathering of mostly refugees from Mormonism and try to re-indoctrinate us to something that we have just discovered is likely a hoax. That is a waste of your time, and it annoys the unbelievers.

What I do is offer a relationship with God through Christ that is superior to any religious affiliation. The world is full of religions. But the only thing that counts is the personal relationship with a loving Father, and not a mess of go-betweens. Even "refugees" need to know that there is life away from the hive. Atheism (not atheists) annoys me, but I'm not for their exclusion. I'm a firm believer that an open forum allows everyone to express what is in their soul. How they express it, often reveals the true nature of their logic.

[_SteelHead]

What I do is offer a relationship with God through Christ that is superior to any religious affiliation.

I am still surprised you and Thorwald didn't get along.....