Obedience vs. Love as an LDS turning point

[_moksha]

Obedience is the first law of Heaven.
- Teacher's Manual: Preparing For Exaltation

Did you know that some LDS people propose that obedience is the first law of Heaven?

Perhaps we need to recognize another division that has arisen between Christian values and some Mormon Values, regarding the first heavenly law.

For Christians, I would propose that Jesus' own pronouncement that first loving God then loving one another still is the prime rule. I suspect many Mormons, such as myself, buy into this Christian concept of what is truly important.

However, there is a substantial number in the Church who are trying to hasten the entry into full cult status by insisting that "Obedience" is the first law of heaven. "Obedience in all things" is actually the first rule of slavery. Can you even imagine Joseph Smith suggesting that "obedience" was the be all end all? He thought the purpose of man was to have joy, and I love him for that. Can't say the same if he had asked me to put on chains.

Wasn't there some character in the past LDS cosmology who argued in favor of man's subjugation and forced obedience?

This also seems so contradictory, since those who are touting this heavenly slavery are also those who cry freedom or die when it comes to owning their hand guns and paying their taxes.

[_subgenius]

The "prime rule" is actually 2 rules??

You have it correct in that the first rule is to Love God...so, how is it that loving God is exclusive from Obedience to God? (as noted in your reference of the Teachers manual - of course)

[_LittleNipper]

What Jesus answered as recorded in the Bible: Matthew 22:36-40 New International Version (NIV)

36 “Teacher, which is the greatest commandment in the Law?”
37 Jesus replied: “‘Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind.’
38 This is the first and greatest commandment.
39 And the second is like it: ‘Love your neighbor as yourself.’
40 All the Law and the Prophets hang on these two commandments.”

[_moksha]

You have it correct in that the first rule is to Love God...so, how is it that loving God is exclusive from Obedience to God? (as noted in your reference of the Teachers manual - of course)

Because loving God does not chain us to the will of men who may at times lack inspiration, such as insisting we are beyond being humble and penitant via a lack of apologies or insisting upon a religiously based right to discriminate against others. Love is extending to the other that which you would have extended to yourself. Love is having to say you are sorry for transgressions, injuries, blunders and hurt feelings.

A call to obedience is one of those slippery slope things we frequently hear about.

[_subgenius]

Murders, rapists, and narcissists..all victims of discrimination. ....got it!

And

Isn't love actually when you don't "have" to say you are sorry, but you do anyway?

[_moksha]

"Whether a man really loves God can be determined by the love he bears toward his fellow men."
- Levi Yitzhok, quoted in Buber, "Tales of the Hasidim"


Subgenius, you cite the unlovable, but out of curiosity do you think Jesus would turn his back on them?

[_huckelberry]

"Whether a man really loves God can be determined by the love he bears toward his fellow men."
- Levi Yitzhok, quoted in Buber, "Tales of the Hasidim"

Make me glad just to hear that book mentioned.

[_malkie]

The "prime rule" is actually 2 rules??

You have it correct in that the first rule is to Love God...so, how is it that loving God is exclusive from Obedience to God? (as noted in your reference of the Teachers manual - of course)

Is there a difference between obedience to God and obedience to church leaders?

[_subgenius]

Is there a difference between obedience to God and obedience to church leaders?

Yes, of course.
https://www.LDS.org/topics/revelation?lang=eng
https://www.LDS.org/topics/obedience?la ... =obedience

Every person is capable of discerning that difference.

[_Amore]

I do believe that obedience is the first law of spirituality and science too.
If you don't obey certain laws, there are consequences...
Ie: If you pretend that you aren't subject to laws of physiological digestion and drink toxic chemicals, you will experience the consequence of not obeying that law.

I don't believe following imperfect people is in any way equal to following laws based on genuine truth.
And having other gods before God is basically disobeying what one's soul genuinely wants. This is the greatest challenge - to not contradict what it is we really want most in the big eternal picture.