5 reasons to suspect Jesus never existed...

[_Ceeboo]

RJ

Thanks Ceeboo

You're welcome!

I think that's one thing that we can all relate to regardless of our beliefs is that the sun rises and sets on the just and the unjust.

I'm starting to think that your thinking brings you/me/us some mutually valuable thought. I think?

Life is a complicated business but it's also a lot of fun.

Indeed!

Is there any particular denomination you subscribe to or just Christianity in general?

No particular denomination here. in my opinion - Christian denominations has played - and continues to play - huge roles in - and in many cases has directly caused - much division, significant pain, loads of angst and potential loss of the things that are often most precious/valuable in our lives (family/friends/spouses/relationships/etc.

Thanks Ceeboo. I didn't mean to make my situation seem worse than it was, just the growing pains of life.

I didn't assume anything about your situation.

I read what you wrote about your life being quite complicated recently - I understand how that happens to us all at times - I believe these life complications come in many flavors and many sizes - and I simply wanted to extend my best wishes to you and yours as your ship continues to sail..........so I did!

It doesn't matter how deep the water is, or how rough the waves might be - I recognize and appreciate that it is you and yours who are on board that moving ship. And that, in my opinion, is what does matter most.

I'm looking forward to discussing more with you and I wish you and yours the best too.

Thanks RJ!

Peace,
Ceeboo

[_RedJacket]

A failed political leader who would have tried to take down the Romans by telling people to obey the Roman government?

I'm not seeing it, RJ.

Whether Jesus said it or not "Render to Caesar the things that are Caesar's, and to God the things that are God's" was a VERY clever answer and points to someone with a very astute political acumen. He wasn't telling people to obey the Romans as much as avoiding a statement that would have condemned him.

From what we have of the gospels, I don't think Jesus was a friend of the Romans and even less a friend of the Pharisees. I do think his political views eventually lead to his execution.

I've addressed why I feel that the claim Jesus was telling people to obey the Romans is something that we have little to no evidence for. The thing that we have to remember is that the New Testament Gospels and Paul's later teachings are the equivalent of the screenplay for Braveheart, it's most likely based on a real person, but the events and sayings are embellished for the sake of the story.

An interesting book "When Prophecy Fails: A Social and Psychological Study of a Modern Group That Predicted the Destruction of the World" shows how failed prophecies are reinterpreted by followers to mean anything but the original meaning.

Personally I think the most logical explanation for Jesus is that he was a failed political leader whose followers reinterpreted his message and words in light of what happened to him and them. You are of course entitled to believe differently

[_Jersey Girl]

I've addressed why I feel that the claim Jesus was telling people to obey the Romans is something that we have little to no evidence for. The thing that we have to remember is that the New Testament Gospels and Paul's later teachings are the equivalent of the screenplay for Braveheart, it's most likely based on a real person, but the events and sayings are embellished for the sake of the story.

What does that mean? The New Testament Gospels and Paul's later teachings. What do you mean by that?

I've never seen Braveheart. Go figure.

:-)

[_RedJacket]

I've addressed why I feel that the claim Jesus was telling people to obey the Romans is something that we have little to no evidence for. The thing that we have to remember is that the New Testament Gospels and Paul's later teachings are the equivalent of the screenplay for Braveheart, it's most likely based on a real person, but the events and sayings are embellished for the sake of the story.

What does that mean? The New Testament Gospels and Paul's later teachings. What do you mean by that?

I've never seen Braveheart. Go figure.

:-)

It's a fun film, but if you've seen Gladiator then you've already seen it

Paul as a late convert to Christianity no doubt played a massive role in the formation of the Christian religion, but he never met Jesus. Who had the most influence on the Christian religion? Without knowing who wrote the gospels and the relationship that Paul had within the early Church in the creation of the Jesus narrative it's difficult to say. I think Paul's letters are the earliest Christian writings, but he doesn't mention Jesus' life stories which were written later.

So the Paul and his writings stand between the historical Jesus and the the later gospels describing the embellished account of a historical person. I personally think that there were a number of Jesus sayings that had been passed down, but that the gospel stories came later and created an embellished narrative using those sayings and embellishing them for dialogue.

[_Jersey Girl]

Okay, I gotcha now RJ. And I haven't seen that movie either!

Seriously, I know nothing!

[_Ceeboo]

Haven't seen Braveheart or Gladiator!


Do they have electricity in Jersey?

Peace,
Ceeboo

[_Jersey Girl]

Haven't seen Braveheart or Gladiator!


Do they have electricity in Jersey?

Peace,
Ceeboo

Sometimes! You'd be surprised what kind of movies I watch.

:-)

[_Jersey Girl]

I don't watch anything with violence or killing in it unless someone has a wand in their hand! ;-) I definitely used to, but I choose not to these days.

[_Ceeboo]

You'd be surprised what kind of movies I watch.

:-)

(Lol)

Peace,
Ceeboo

[_Jersey Girl]

Get. your. mind. out. of. the. gutter. man.

I already said, nothing with violence and killing.