Only one female speaker at General Conference this weekend

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_Lemmie
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Re: Only one female speaker at General Conference this weeke

Post by _Lemmie »

Chap wrote:Go and do something else for a while, zerinus, and come back when you've calmed down. You are becoming so worked up that you are starting to look silly.

.... or whatever it is you are trying to suggest, it is your credibility that suffers...

rino needs this advice as well.
_Tator
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Re: Only one female speaker at General Conference this weeke

Post by _Tator »

Lemmie wrote:
Chap wrote:Go and do something else for a while, zerinus, and come back when you've calmed down. You are becoming so worked up that you are starting to look silly.

.... or whatever it is you are trying to suggest, it is your credibility that suffers...

rino needs this advice as well.

And he needs to take a break and do laundry, his garmies are full, too!
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_sock puppet
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Re: Only one female speaker at General Conference this weeke

Post by _sock puppet »

zerinus wrote:Romans 11:

13 For I speak to you Gentiles, inasmuch as I am the apostle of the Gentiles, I magnify mine office:

1 Corinthians 1:

1 Paul, called to be an apostle of Jesus Christ through the will of God, and Sosthenes our brother,

1 Corinthians 9:

1 Am I not an apostle? am I not free? have I not seen Jesus Christ our Lord? are not ye my work in the Lord?
2 If I be not an apostle unto others, yet doubtless I am to you: for the seal of mine apostleship are ye in the Lord.

1 Corinthians 12:

28 And God hath set some in the church, first apostles, secondarily prophets, thirdly teachers, after that miracles, then gifts of healings, helps, governments, diversities of tongues.
29 Are all apostles? are all prophets? are all teachers? are all workers of miracles?


Is being an apostle of the Gentiles the same thing as being an apostle of Jesus? Is one an "apostle of the Gentiles" when speaking to them, and only an apostle of Jesus when speaking him?

And what differentiates an apostle from, say, a prophet or other title? Does it just mean you sit on the board of directors?
_zerinus
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Re: Only one female speaker at General Conference this weeke

Post by _zerinus »

sock puppet wrote:Is being an apostle of the Gentiles the same thing as being an apostle of Jesus? Is one an "apostle of the Gentiles" when speaking to them, and only an apostle of Jesus when speaking him?
All of them were Apostles of Jesus Christ. There was no difference between their office and calling. Paul liked to call himself the “apostle of the Gentiles” because he was more specially commissioned to preach to the Gentiles; whereas Peter was more commissioned to minister to the Jews:

Acts 22:

21 And he [God] said unto me, Depart: for I will send thee far hence unto the Gentiles.

Galatians 2:

8 (For he [God] that wrought effectually in Peter to the apostleship of the circumcision [i.e. the Jews], the same was mighty in me toward the Gentiles:)


Apart from that there was no difference between them, or between their respective ministerial offices.

And what differentiates an apostle from, say, a prophet or other title? Does it just mean you sit on the board of directors?
An Apostle has the highest office in the church, as Paul has explained in a couple of places already quoted, followed by the lesser offices that he mentions. An Apostle is a seer and revelator as well as a prophet, and his primary calling is to be an especial witness of Jesus Christ in all the world. As far as administrative duties are concerned, they have the administrative responsibility of governing the affairs of the Church as well. But their primary responsibility is to bear witness of Jesus Christ.
_huckelberry
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Re: Only one female speaker at General Conference this weeke

Post by _huckelberry »

A little reminder for MsJack from a year ago,
MsJack wrote:Rino ~ My "ex-marital situation" along with my present mental health are none of your business. I'll thank you to seek out other interests to occupy your time.
.

an appropriate comment then and now.
_grindael
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Re: Only one female speaker at General Conference this weeke

Post by _grindael »

An Apostle has the highest office in the church, as Paul has explained in a couple of places already quoted, followed by the lesser offices that he mentions. An Apostle is a seer and revelator as well as a prophet, and his primary calling is to be an especial witness of Jesus Christ in all the world.


This is simply Mormon jargon that has nothing in common with what the New Testament says. Notice that Zero will never back up any of this with the Bible. "Apostle" is not an office, it is a "gift" of the Spirit, an Appointment or designation. There were lots of "apostles" running around in the early church, but only 12 who were special witnesses of Jesus and his mission and death and resurrection. They were never replaced when they died, they simply gave authority to others who were called Apostles as Jesus called them Apostles. The Mormon Church has made up the "restoration" of the Apostleship of Peter and James and John, because none of them qualify to be an Apostle like they were. Even Paul did not qualify to be one of them. This is backed up by what the Book of Acts expressly says. Where is the word "seer" used in relation to an "apostle" in the New Testament? Nowhere. Paul calls a group of apostates "false apostles":

13 For such people are false apostles, deceitful workers, masquerading as apostles of Christ.


Were they all ordained to the OFFICE of an "Apostle" and then they just apostatized? Nope. He was applying this as a general description of ones who claimed authority they did not have. Apostles were just men and women who had authority over the church, traveling ministers as was Paul, Junia, (the woman) and others. Paul explains what his apostleship is in Ephesians:
4 In reading this, then, you will be able to understand my insight into the mystery of Christ, 5 which was not made known to people in other generations as it has now been revealed by the Spirit to God’s holy apostles and prophets. 6 This mystery is that through the gospel the Gentiles are heirs together with Israel, members together of one body, and sharers together in the promise in Christ Jesus.

7 I became a servant of this gospel by the gift of God’s grace given me through the working of his power.


He can't get any more clear here. His call to apostleship was a GIFT of the "Spirit".

1 Timothy:

For there is one God and one mediator between God and mankind, the man Christ Jesus, 6 who gave himself as a ransom for all people. This has now been witnessed to at the proper time. 7 And for this purpose I was appointed a herald and an apostle—I am telling the truth, I am not lying—and a true and faithful teacher of the Gentiles.


Denying what the Bible actually says is just an apologetic ploy.
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_Chap
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Re: Only one female speaker at General Conference this weeke

Post by _Chap »

grindael wrote:Mormon jargon that has nothing in common with what the New Testament says.


There's a lot of it about on this thread. Weird.
Zadok:
I did not have a faith crisis. I discovered that the Church was having a truth crisis.
Maksutov:
That's the problem with this supernatural stuff, it doesn't really solve anything. It's a placeholder for ignorance.
_Chap
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Re: Only one female speaker at General Conference this weeke

Post by _Chap »

Lemmie wrote:
Chap wrote:
Go and do something else for a while, zerinus, and come back when you've calmed down. You are becoming so worked up that you are starting to look silly.

.... or whatever it is you are trying to suggest, it is your credibility that suffers...

rino needs this advice as well.


Rino appears not to be a nice person.

Strangely comforting thought: who is it that has to spend every second of their waking life close to Rino, even sharing his every thought? Why, Rino.

Image
Zadok:
I did not have a faith crisis. I discovered that the Church was having a truth crisis.
Maksutov:
That's the problem with this supernatural stuff, it doesn't really solve anything. It's a placeholder for ignorance.
_huckelberry
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Re: Only one female speaker at General Conference this weeke

Post by _huckelberry »

Chap wrote:
grindael wrote:Mormon jargon that has nothing in common with what the New Testament says.


There's a lot of it about on this thread. Weird.


I think there is a possiblity that some are so immeshed in Mormon jargon that they simply do not hear what MsJack is saying.

Perhaps further it could be noted that Mormon ideas about authority in the early church are fundamental to Mormon understanding of Christianity. Without these ideas as foundation very little Mormonism remains.
_Choyo Chagas
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Re: Only one female speaker at General Conference this weeke

Post by _Choyo Chagas »

i don't like renaming - or i may clepe it name calling - other members of this site

but...
calling zerinus as zero seems to be proper

ok nothing to do with genconf sorry
Choyo Chagas is Chairman of the Big Four, the ruler of the planet from "The Bull's Hour" ( Russian: Час Быка), a social science fiction novel written by Soviet author and paleontologist Ivan Yefremov in 1968.
Six months after its publication Soviet authorities banned the book and attempted to remove it from libraries and bookshops.
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