Science proves life after death

[_Res Ipsa]

Actually, memory is a funny thing. Science has shown that, especially over time, the brain will "remember" things that simply did not happen. What you remember today is not evidence of what actually happened. That's true for all of us. It sucks, but that's how brains work.

I completely agree that the brain is temperamental, but "science" is quick to put this out when it comes to Life After Death (LAD). How do we know anything if the brain is so untrustworthy? And I agree, I don't know anything. But Science is about observation, looking for patterns. If a medical study implies that a drug is 50% effective on 10% of the population, I'm taking that baby to the bank. I think almost 50% of people that have a Near Death Experience (NDE) mention some type of awareness out of body. That is very significant.

I have read the/some research on brain activity as a person dies. I have my theories about what is happening. Information, in it's pure form is spiritual. Conveying ideas and identities isn't done so much through physical contact, but through conscious connection.

While the brain is dying, there is one part of brain that goes super active. This is why people see their life flash before their eyes, etc. But what if the brain is actually downloading life experiences and identity into another format or dimension? The subconscious of humans is a big mysterious place. How do we know life didn't work out a swarm consciousness (human internet) a long time ago, but merely keeps us conscious humans out, (as implied in the Bible by the deep sleep.) We are connected on the inside, we are one, like leaves on a tree, separate, yet part of the same thing.

I think it's fair to say that the brain isn't just temperamental -- when it comes to memory it is unreliable. The brain will make stuff up, delete stuff, distort time, and even change the order of events. And none of this is abnormal for the brain -- it's the way that brains work.

Here's an example. One night, I woke up at 1:00 a.m. I specifically recall looking at the clock. I went back to sleep and woke up at 12:00 a.m. I specifically recall looking at the clock and thinking how weird it was to wake up earlier in the night than the first time. I then went back to sleep and woke up at 3:00. I was still a little weirded out by the earlier events, so I got up and had a glass of milk. I went back to bed and woke up at 2:00.

Now, what happened? Did I somehow travel in time? Or, by the morning, was my brain simply misremembering the sequence of events? In fact, it's entirely plausible that the whole sequence of events was a dream. The least likely explanation is that something supernatural actually happened to me.

Ironically, the more we recall a memory, the more likely it is to be inaccurate. The memories that we clearly remember because we've thought about them over the years are very unlikely to be accurate. That's simply a function of the way memory works. I have a vivid memory of two friends I have in high school that did a very stylized dance in a talent show. It made an impression because I had no idea that they had taken any dance lessons. I can see the dance in my mind, including the facial expressions. Except one thing: I remember the wrong friend in the dance. I can see him clearly in my mind. But several people who were also there all recall it being a different friend.

We also know that it is incredibly easy to implant false memories in others. The work of Elizabeth Loftus shows this pretty clearly, as does the saga of the recovered memory movement.

So, knowing all this about the brain and memory, we should be highly skeptical of any claim that is based solely on the recollection of people in uncontrolled circumstances.

Keeping in mind that the double blind experiment is the gold standard of scientific research, how could we design a study that would get as close as possible to that standard without violating ethical codes? (Obviously, we can't do a study where we intentionally stop people's hearts.) What do you think that kind of study would look like?

[_Quasimodo]

After many years of interest in this subject, I am still very skeptical of life after death. I am, however, quite certain of death after life. Halfway there.

[_SPG]

So, knowing all this about the brain and memory, we should be highly skeptical of any claim that is based solely on the recollection of people in uncontrolled circumstances.

I am highly skeptical. I don't believe any of it. I would believe in LAD before I would believe that what we are living is real. And as you mentioned, it's to easy manipulate memory.

Imagine, if you will, that you have a human with average intelligence and what portion of that is their "consciousness mind." Then consider that about 97% of that mind is subconscious, beyond his ability to see and understand. Think of all of the abilities our "conscious mind" has and consider what abilities the subconscious has. We communicate with each other, why would we assume that the subconscious cannot communicate with others, in fact, probably all things. We are the product of 2.5+ billion years of evolution, with mind blowing features such as DNA.

If one person can be conscious, why not a race, a species, or all life for that matter? Just within the recesses of my own subconscious, I could store information and experiences of several life times, and maybe I do. People, as you mentioned, have strange memories. With DNA technology, if we could better master it, we could store world's accumulated data in about the palm of my hand.

We are "part" of something bigger, something that is hiding its self from us, on purpose.

[_Maksutov]

So, knowing all this about the brain and memory, we should be highly skeptical of any claim that is based solely on the recollection of people in uncontrolled circumstances.

I am highly skeptical. I don't believe any of it. I would believe in LAD before I would believe that what we are living is real. And as you mentioned, it's to easy manipulate memory.

Imagine, if you will, that you have a human with average intelligence and what portion of that is their "consciousness mind." Then consider that about 97% of that mind is subconscious, beyond his ability to see and understand. Think of all of the abilities our "conscious mind" has and consider what abilities the subconscious has. We communicate with each other, why would we assume that the subconscious cannot communicate with others, in fact, probably all things. We are the product of 2.5+ billion years of evolution, with mind blowing features such as DNA.

If one person can be conscious, why not a race, a species, or all life for that matter? Just within the recesses of my own subconscious, I could store information and experiences of several life times, and maybe I do. People, as you mentioned, have strange memories. With DNA technology, if we could better master it, we could store world's accumulated data in about the palm of my hand.

We are "part" of something bigger, something that is hiding its self from us, on purpose.

You might enjoy reading Carl Jung, SPG.

[_SPG]

You might enjoy reading Carl Jung, SPG.

I am listening to his Psychology of the Subconscious. Interesting.
While I honor and respect the work of these early pioneers of the subconscious, I take the stand that the subconscious is something more than individuals. I believe in structure and infrastructure. If there is life after death, where we go? Some stories detail trips to other planets and such. Science implies that there are alternate realities, that can spin off as fast a choice of ice cream.

What sort of universe could support such things? And it dawns on me, that in the imagination, we can spin off alternate realities by magnitudes of fractals. What if our universe, our physical universe is actually a projection of a inner universe? And that when we die, we merely sink back into the inner universe?

The Government released a report a few years back that our universe is a 2 dimensional hologram. Almost every quantum mechanic or astrophysics show starts with "what if it is all a big illusion?"

But I don't believe in the Christian God so much because I think it is true, but rather I think it is a fairly functional illusion. Mother, Father, marriage, honor, respect, traditions, etc. But. . . . . I think, sort of like so many fairy tales imply, you have to believe. Zeus is dead, because people stopped believing in him. This is part of why I get discouraged when I see so many people dumping the church. If you don't have a religion, you or your children will be provided with one.

I have "worked" with the dead before, souls that get lost and don't cross over. What is you believe, is absolutely your reality. Souls become stuck because they cannot be contacted by loved ones, yet those same souls slowly realize they are awake and in the dark. The "beliefs" are like bridges and connectors of consciousness. Your abilities to connect to other souls is almost strictly through belief. What you believe isn't the issue, just that you do.

[_Res Ipsa]

So, knowing all this about the brain and memory, we should be highly skeptical of any claim that is based solely on the recollection of people in uncontrolled circumstances.

I am highly skeptical. I don't believe any of it. I would believe in LAD before I would believe that what we are living is real. And as you mentioned, it's to easy manipulate memory.

Imagine, if you will, that you have a human with average intelligence and what portion of that is their "consciousness mind." Then consider that about 97% of that mind is subconscious, beyond his ability to see and understand. Think of all of the abilities our "conscious mind" has and consider what abilities the subconscious has. We communicate with each other, why would we assume that the subconscious cannot communicate with others, in fact, probably all things. We are the product of 2.5+ billion years of evolution, with mind blowing features such as DNA.

If one person can be conscious, why not a race, a species, or all life for that matter? Just within the recesses of my own subconscious, I could store information and experiences of several life times, and maybe I do. People, as you mentioned, have strange memories. With DNA technology, if we could better master it, we could store world's accumulated data in about the palm of my hand.

We are "part" of something bigger, something that is hiding its self from us, on purpose.

That's a big chunk to process. Here's what I'm having a hard time grasping: if you can't believe any of it, why do you believe there is something bigger hiding itself from us. If you don't believe any of it, then I guess anything you are capable of imagining could be true. You could imagine that there is no "something bigger" just as easily as imagining that there is "something bigger." On what basis do you reject the former and accept the latter?

I think a big problem is the use of the same term "mind" to describe brain processes that happen consciously and those that don't. For example, we associate the conscious mind with an ability to reason and plan. I'm not aware of any evidence that my subconscious mind is any sort of entity that can reason and plan. Rather, it seems to be just a collection of processes in the brain that don't involve consciousness. I see no good reason to believe that those processes are organized in any way that would be equivalent to what we think of as the conscious mind.

Being skeptical doesn't mean disbelieving everything -- it means being dedicated to following the evidence. In the case of consciousness, the evidence we have is that it is the result of activity in the brain. No brain, no consciousness. Given the absence of a shared racial brain or a shared life brain, following the evidence gives me no reason to conclude there is a shared consciousness.

Likewise, the amount of energy devoted to brain processes that are not conscious is not evidence that the subconscious is some kind of powerful mind. It's simply evidence that there is lots of energy devoted to brain processes that I'm not aware of. Some function in my brain makes sure that my heart beats. Another makes sure that I breathe often enough to keep my blood supplied with oxygen. Others process sensory input. I don't think there's anything surprising about the fact that the energy to support all the systems that make consciousness possible use more energy than consciousness itself. That doesn't mean that those systems are organized in a way that allows, say, rational thinking.

I can understand an approach to thinking about life, the universe and everything that starts from: Everything I can imagine is possible and I'm justified in believing in any of it unless someone can disprove it. To me, that's the opposite of skepticism. I start from: I don't believe in anything unless given evidence -- some good reason -- to believe in it. I believe my coffee table is real because it hurts every time I bang my shins on it. When I put something on it, the something never falls to the floor through the table. And I build up from there. Give me some good reason to believe my subconscious brain activity is part of some entity hiding itself from me, and I think it would be worth considering. But I just don't see any.

[_SPG]

I'm not aware of any evidence that my subconscious mind is any sort of entity that can reason and plan.

When I say "I don't believe any of it" I mean the accepted illusion that we the human race enjoy. Within that context, I believe a lot of things. But, I don't buy the idea that we are separate and unique as we seem to be.

Saying that there no evidence that the subconscious makes plans or uses reason is like saying that just because your computer isn't running the calculator app, that it isn't calculating.

I was just thinking of it day. The subconscious takes infinite possibilities and breaks them down into . . . . us. Like, why do stem cells know they need to be a heart, or a lung, or brain? A stem cell could almost any living thing, but it makes choices and because something very limited. And how does billions, maybe trillions of cells coordinate that process into forming a human, a elephant.

Sure, a DNA strand is sort of like a flash drive of information, but what processes that information? If a body can form out of one sperm and one egg, how does that process work without some form of consciousness?

[_Res Ipsa]

I'm not aware of any evidence that my subconscious mind is any sort of entity that can reason and plan.

When I say "I don't believe any of it" I mean the accepted illusion that we the human race enjoy. Within that context, I believe a lot of things. But, I don't buy the idea that we are separate and unique as we seem to be.

Saying that there no evidence that the subconscious makes plans or uses reason is like saying that just because your computer isn't running the calculator app, that it isn't calculating.

I was just thinking of it day. The subconscious takes infinite possibilities and breaks them down into . . . . us. Like, why do stem cells know they need to be a heart, or a lung, or brain? A stem cell could almost any living thing, but it makes choices and because something very limited. And how does billions, maybe trillions of cells coordinate that process into forming a human, a elephant.

Sure, a DNA strand is sort of like a flash drive of information, but what processes that information? If a body can form out of one sperm and one egg, how does that process work without some form of consciousness?

To figure out that last question, pick up a book on genetics. It's fallacious thinking to say "I don't understand how this could work without consciousness, so it must involve consciousness."

I don't buy the idea that we are as separate or unique as we seem to be either. I don't buy it based on the priming and masking studies that have been done. If my opinions about a job applicant can be significantly affected by whether I hold a warm or a cold beverage just before reading a resume, then I think it's very likely that we all have a significant effect on the people we come in contact with and vice versa. Given those effects, I don't think it makes sense to think of ourselves as completely independent from each other. But that belief doesn't require me to invent an additional consciousness.

I don't think there is any evidence that stem cells "make choices." The instructions for making a human are found in the DNA.

[_Quasimodo]

Every cell in our bodies contains mitochondria (except blood cells and male sperm cells). Some organ cells contain a few and some contain thousands. Each mitochondria has its very own DNA separate from the cells in our bodies. They are not us.

Most biologists believe that mitochondria started out as bacteria in the primordial soup that invaded our single celled ancestors. It worked out well for everybody. Mitochondria got a safe place to hang out and we got a pal that produced energy for all of our individual cells and allowed us to become the wonderful multiple cell organisms that we now are. Symbiosis.

Of course, this means that we all have millions of aliens living in each one of us (kinda like Scientology ).

So, the question is, who is in charge? Us or the aliens? Every brain cell we have has mitochondria. Who is doing the thinking? When we die, do our souls go to an afterlife or the mitochondria souls?

[_SPG]

Listening to Carl Jung at someone's recommendation. And while I believe and see things different, he also supports a lot of my ideas.

Science is cool, but it isn't everything.

For example. There is a paradox that something "is what it is" until you look at it. Experiments on photon particles revealed that by trying to observe the predicted path of a photon changed where it went.

The universe is literally a conscious creature. A rock could just be a rock, but if I pick the rock up and look at it, the rock changes. If I label this "rock" a diamond and declare it the most precious, I have changed how the rock influences the universe.

Humanity created the "gods" not out of fear but rather from observing the effect of "believing in God." There are the "archetypes" of subconscious that affect us all. The subconscious is alive in its own right. It motivates us and controls us far more than the conscious mind does.

To become "one with God" is more about our relationship with our subconscious. We were created from the inside out. In other words, the creator, the kingdom of God, is within, in the depths of the subconscious.

When the heavens support us, it come from within.
When we heal, that healing comes from within.
When we truly connect with people, that connection comes from within.

And when we die, that is where we return.
The "translation" mentioned in the Book of Mormon is literally a copying from one conscious platform to another. It is a type of transference of information and soul energy to another platform of consciousness. That platform might be less biological and more light oriented. But the memories and life experience stay intact.