SPG wrote:Science is like Kung Fu. Some people have strong Kung Fu, some don't.
Science is the art of observation and application. Some do it better than others.
Religion in general is trying to achieve something quite separate then academic science, but their science is still quite strong.
Maksutov wrote:DrW wrote:Okay. That does it.
Celestial Forum notwithstanding, the above have to be three of the most ridiculous sentences to ever appear in one post in the history of the board. The fact that it's a three sentence post qualifies it as pure nonsense.
Who is this guy?
Franktalk's soul brother. The woo industry caters to these guys, DrW, and it's more exciting and has more celebrities than those creepy mean ole empiricists. Science is a mere cult and con jobs while dudes who have profound feelings rule. Ergo, SPG.
Seriously, we regularly see these kind of Eloi parasitical types nowadays. But they're stimulating the economy, because pseudoscience above all things is a commercial enterprise. I find it more pernicious even than religion lately.
What I have noticed, other then I get compared to FrankTalk a lot, is that many people think they can "own a term" such as science, marriage, religion, truth, salvation, God, etc. These are universal terms that anyone can use to express an idea.
But lets take the science of religion, for example, even looking at cults. You usually have a very common and consistent element called a cult leader. He plays people's guilt, fear, desire for forgiveness, etc. It's very scientific. You can make a recipe of a cult leader, and recipe for a cult member.
But it goes beyond that. Why does the human psyche need salvation, forgiveness, purpose, etc? In answering this question, academic science pretty much drops the ball, calling it all nonsense. Yet, the most important element of any human is their identity. A mother cannot love her child unless she is a mother, and "mother" is part of identity. A woman can love any child, but there must still be a reason coded into her identity. A good woman might love many children, but then we must define what a good woman is, and what is a bad woman, etc. A bad woman might hate children in general.
Identity is king of motivation in human. Who we are, is everything to us. And yes, mock me if you want, but there is a science to how identity works. Over thousands of years, in trying to define ourselves, we have involved Gods and other worldly realms. We admit those realms are not physical, but rather are spiritual. They are more idealistic. Plato called first named these realms, The Realm of Forms. Such as, there is no such thing as a "True Triangle" in our physical world, but we make things that "look like triangles." Triangles are very scientific, but they are an ideal that will probably never be perfected in our universe. But, we can express them in math form to give people that general idea, and we use the ideas in our projects.
While what we deem as "academic science" is teaching ideas like triangles and curves, religion teaches other ideas that are also truth. Religion teaches ideas like marriage, honor, honesty, patience, steadfastness, motherhood, fatherhood, etc. These ideas are more important to enter heaven.
I was just watching a TED talk yesterday about a EMT Medic He talked about how he had watched many people die. Many would've course ask him, "Am I going to die?" At first he tried to lie to them because he didn't want to upset them, but eventually started telling them the truth. He said, that a pattern became very clear as people realized that they were going to die.
1. Wanted forgiveness.
2. Wished they had done more good to be remembered by.
3. Wanted loved ones to know they were loved.
Note that I didn't say they wished they had taken more science classes, or earned more money.
When the final curtain falls, what people wish they had, is more religion. They wish they had been more kind, been more loved, had more friends, more confidence that they would be remembered.
Granted, this is at the end of a person's life. You might argue, that doesn't have anything to do with how they live. But to me, this says that in our heart of hearts, what we really want from life, is what we wish we had when we die.
This is actually very scientific, and I think it makes good sense. For how many thousands of years have priests watched people die, hearing their desires, and tried to prepare people for that moment?
I will say, that the doctor that told this story, made a point to say "everyone" acted like this. So it wasn't just the Christians falling back on their religious fear. When we check out of this game, we want to be good people.
