Mcabe admits plan to oust Trump

[_moksha]

How dare McCabe devise a master plan to oust Trump! I think McCabe should be reported directly to the Kremlin for that and perhaps be sentenced to one of the Siberian gulags based on the recommendations of Trump's Moscow handlers.

[_Markk]

Markk: you have to look at marginal cost rather than average cost when analyzing the cost of education. Also, whether directly through home ownership or indirectly through rents, folks here illegally pay the property tax that funds schools, just like citizens do.

As for benefit use, here is some information: https://immigrationforum.org/article/fa ... -benefits/

Hey,

In the end, do you believe that they pay more than they receive? There is just no way in my view.

Your link just adds more that they get for free...?

I am very close to this issue living where I do and managing scores of illegal workers daily...and believe me when I tell you they know how to milk the system. They know if they claim 7 vs 1 or 2 they have less taken out of their checks. They know if their wives tell the gov there husband left them, they get child benfits like WICA and free food programs. and they know what to say in a emergency room to get free care.

Schools cost money, I am not sure how a marginal vs average costs make their contribution to the system higher than what they receive? I am open to you showing me how that would work?

15 dollars an hour works out to 31k a year...how much does a person with 2 children making 31K a year contribute to the system? Remember they don't receive benefits, but again they know that so they claim the max the can get away with less coming out of their check.

SS tax is hardly anything....6.2% of 31k is what...2kish?

I did a quick worksheet at 31K (15 dollars and hour), 5 dependents, single head of household and the tax is zero, but they have to pay a grand or so as a penalty for no insurance...

Check my math out, maybe I missed something... https://www.esmarttax.com/taxestimator/ ... imator.asp

I guess we can add sales tax of 10% on 31K if they spend it all legally and on taxable items, so we are at say what 5k or so?

What am I missing?

[_Markk]

Markk, I believe most places pay for schools through property taxes. If you think only property owners pay property tax you could think again. People who rent give money to property owners who then use that money to cover property tax.

I have to agree with Doc, who pays the tax then? In CA they pay more for it with lotto tickets than property taxes.

But beyond that if they make 15 dollars and hour, and make 31k a year...how much of that 31k applies against what they receive? I just don't see the math working, but I am open for anyone to show me.

[_Res Ipsa]

Markk, I believe most places pay for schools through property taxes. If you think only property owners pay property tax you could think again. People who rent give money to property owners who then use that money to cover property tax.

I have to agree with Doc, who pays the tax then? In CA they pay more for it with lotto tickets than property taxes.

But beyond that if they make 15 dollars and hour, and make 31k a year...how much of that 31k applies against what they receive? I just don't see the math working, but I am open for anyone to show me.

Markk, you haven’t shown what they are “taking.” We know they are paying FICA, which they will never see. Medicare, which they will never see. They pay for schools the same way citizens of the state pay. They are not eligible for TANF, not eligible for SNAP. Did you even look at the link I posted.

What’s really weird is thinking that if property taxes doubled, landlords wouldn’t raise rent.

[_Doctor CamNC4Me]

Markk, I believe most places pay for schools through property taxes. If you think only property owners pay property tax you could think again. People who rent give money to property owners who then use that money to cover property tax.

So, uh, property owners then?

- Doc

I should clarify. Public and charter schools receive funds from multiple sources. You have local, state, and federal revenue streams. I'm fairly certain most of a school district's funding comes from property taxes, though.

To the point, I'm not sure how one quantifies illegal immigrants' net gain/loss to an economy. I think this is one of those issues where a solid argument can be made either way, and then the nitpicking starts. Either that or you're resigned to an esoteric take on the economy.

One point I'll certainly agree upon is that the more people you have in a country that are doing things then your economy will most likely grow unless it's mismanaged by gross incompetence. I think we also have a bit of a 'false economy' because we're massively deb-fueled, so I have no idea what we'd look like if we ran a balanced federal budget.

- Doc

[_aussieguy55]

Wouldn't the evangelicals be happy with that? Pence would be President

[_Kevin Graham]

Markk, I believe most places pay for schools through property taxes. If you think only property owners pay property tax you could think again. People who rent give money to property owners who then use that money to cover property tax.

So, uh, property owners then?

- Doc

Sure, in the same sense that a mortgage company pays for your property taxes, HOA fees and home insurance via an escrow account. But at the end of the day, who really pays for it is the home owner.

[_Kevin Graham]

Hey,

In the end, do you believe that they pay more than they receive? There is just no way in my view.

Your "view" is based on a misguided sense of expertise which you have tried to sell to us in the past. Aren't you the same "expert" on California homelessness which you supported with your YouTube videos of driving around and filming them?

Your link just adds more that they get for free...?

No it doesn't. Try reading it.

I am very close to this issue living where I do and managing scores of illegal workers daily...and believe me when I tell you they know how to milk the system. They know if they claim 7 vs 1 or 2 they have less taken out of their checks. They know if their wives tell the gov there husband left them, they get child benfits like WICA and free food programs. and they know what to say in a emergency room to get free care.

Stop pretending you know the intricacies of so many people's financials. You're full of crap and you know it. The numbers are already provided which shows how much they pay into payroll taxes, and you want us to believe this is all negated because you know some who claim more dependents? You do realize that you have to provide valid social security numbers in order to successfully file for a tax return, right?

Schools cost money, I am not sure how a marginal vs average costs make their contribution to the system higher than what they receive? I am open to you showing me how that would work?

Schools are primarily funded by property taxes, which they obviously pay if they're renting. A point you just keep ignoring because....? Why? Because you like to keep your preferred talking point?

SS tax is hardly anything....6.2% of 31k is what...2kish?

2kish over 50 years is 100kish which they will never get back.

I did a quick worksheet at 31K (15 dollars and hour), 5 dependents, single head of household and the tax is zero, but they have to pay a grand or so as a penalty for no insurance...

If they're claiming valid dependents then they are American born citizens. So what's your problem?

I guess we can add sales tax of 10% on 31K if they spend it all legally and on taxable items, so we are at say what 5k or so?

What am I missing?

You're missing the fact that the math has already been done by experts and you're trying to undermining it with google and a calculator while asking complete strangers to check your math.

[_EAllusion]

[Poor] legal immigrants tend to cost more in tax payer services than they pay in in gen 1, but this is by far offset by the net benefit of their progeny's add to the economy. That's why analyses by anti-immigrant think tanks tend to present this variable in isolation rather than looking at lifecycle costs as you see in academic research. Illegal immigration is a different beast because they have a more difficult time accessing some expensive government services they pay into with various taxes.

I don't know why this is so counter-intuitive for people, but it is. We're a nation of immigrants. I don't know how they imagine we got wealthy.

[_Bach]

Kevin,

Hope things are going well at home.