Rittenhouse Trial: Calling Res Ipsa

[Doctor CamNC4Me]

At the end of the day the thing to take away from this situation is not a tool for solving ideological squabbles but some ideas about how to do better in the future. Of course, this kind of thing simply will happen on occasion. We have a gun-friendly culture, and that horse left the barn a long time ago. At this point in time, it would be incredibly risky to try to turn the gun situation around, so I think it is a better idea to try to find different solutions to our cultural and societal sickness.

It is madness to keep provoking the gun issue. It is clear that as liberals have become more anxious about guns, conservatives have become more aggressive about guns. Honestly, I grew up with guns, so I am not all that worried about the guns themselves. If we are going to be surrounded by lunatics, we might as well be armed and proficient ourselves, unless we are too emotional about the whole thing. A gun is a tool. Its misuse is an evil. I am not exactly a pacifist, so I would have no problem squeezing the trigger if my life were at risk.

One thing that would be nice to see is for us all to accommodate ourselves to risk, or individually find less risky places if we cannot do so. If it is that important for me to be in a place that has no guns, maybe it is time to move to such a place. I live in the American South, so there are guns all around, and yet I don't really feel all that anxious about it. Of course, I was always the kid who liked military stuff and I liked to shoot guns, so there you have it. Maybe I am just the kind of person who is not all that upset about them.

What I have seen over time is that certain people seek out extra risk. I look at everyone involved in this situation, and I see a bunch of people who probably didn't think carefully before they put themselves in harm's way. I am not happy that this came back to bite them in the ass, including Kyle himself, but this is the way of things. You go out and look for trouble, and don't be surprised, please, if you find it. People who have already been convicted of crimes are probably, statistically speaking, more likely to find themselves in new trouble. A seventeen-year-old kid who owns an AR15? LOL! I mean, I owned regular rifles, but I never owned a handgun or an AR15, especially at the age of 17. Kyle was the kind of kid who was looking to jump into the mix. Really, there are no surprises here. He just turned out to be a lot more effective with his weapon than his attackers were wise.

When I briefly worked in the Utah state prison at Draper, I got a pretty good sense of how it is that people end up in prison. The factors are complicated, but risk seeking behavior and poor impulse control are often among those factors.

Michael Moore, love him or hate him, called it a long, long time ago. The media finds it very profitable to stir up crap. This thing with Kyle and the people he shot is a story, sure, but it is not all that everyone has made it out to be. In some ways it is a lot more boring than the media would have it. Put together a lot of people with poor judgment who want to be in the thick of excitement and play hero or something, and this is what you get. I think we can be happy that there were no truly innocent victims here. There were a lot of dummies doing dumb crap.

This post actually summarizes my views as well. Overall we have a pretty dicey cultural divide that doesn’t lend itself toward resolution.

- Doc

[canpakes]

I’m not convinced that running at someone requires the runner to be fired on, given that jumpkick man doesn’t appear to have accosted Rittenhouse prior to that, . . .

But he accosted Rittenhouse during that. During is all it took for him to become an assailant.

Rittenhouse had already pointed his weapon at Jump Kick Man before Jump Kick Man jumped.

. . . and given that directly responding defensively was not the only option.

What option would you have taken in that second?

Roll, weapon down, hands up.

There were folks filming, and Rittenhouse was within sight of the police line. That was worth the chance.

If I say that I was in fear for my life, even if I was not, regardless of the ‘threat’ - how does anyone prove otherwise?

By the LACK OF people trying to grab your gun from you, kicking you in the face, bashing your head with a skateboard, and trying to shoot you.

Aside from someone who had knocked his cap off, no one had done any of those things to Rittenhouse at the point of time where Rittenhouse ended up tripping, righted himself and aimed at folks around him.

Does this become a license to kill without consequence?

Being put on trial for intentional homicide sounds like a consequence to me.

That’s a pretty mild consequence for the shooter, as opposed to the victim. If I was someone with a criminal intent, it’s a ‘consequence’ of little consequence, considering the potential payoff.

[Doctor CamNC4Me]

But he accosted Rittenhouse during that. During is all it took for him to become an assailant.

Rittenhouse had already pointed his weapon at Jump Kick Man before Jump Kick Man jumped.

Are you sure about that?

https://mobile.Twitter.com/KristenBarba ... r-criminal

- Doc

[Dr. Shades]

Rittenhouse was a coward for killing Rosenbaum and Huber. Rosenbaum was a weak homeless man who was discharged from the hospital. Rittenhouse knew Rosenbaum didn't have a weapon. Huber was a very skinny dude capable of hurting no one. Rittenhouse was a complete idiot who obviously overreacted. Rittenhouse didn't have a good reason for fear for him life, he is a big guy.

In that case, what should Rittenhouse have done?

[Marcus]

Rittenhouse was a coward for killing Rosenbaum and Huber. Rosenbaum was a weak homeless man who was discharged from the hospital. Rittenhouse knew Rosenbaum didn't have a weapon. Huber was a very skinny dude capable of hurting no one. Rittenhouse was a complete idiot who obviously overreacted. Rittenhouse didn't have a good reason for fear for him life, he is a big guy.

In that case, what should Rittenhouse have done?

Not picked up an assault rifle and walk down the middle of the street toward a riot? I know other people have offered that point and it's been derided, but seriously, is there anyone here who would do that? Seriously? I really hope not.

[Dr. Shades]

The only other decisions I see are allowing himself to be beaten within an inch of his life, at best, or killed.

What about not taking vigilante justice to the streets with an assault rifle?

Up until the point he was attacked by the mob, he did nothing other than possess an assault rifle. He didn't administer "vigilante justice" (or any other kind of justice).

In that case, what should Rittenhouse have done?

Not picked up an assault rifle and walk down the middle of the street toward a riot? I know other people have offered that point and it's been derided, but seriously, is there anyone here who would do that? Seriously? I really hope not.

Wrong timeframe. Let me reword: What should Rittenhouse have done at the exact moments when he was under attack by assailants 1, 2, and 3?

[Marcus]

Not picked up an assault rifle and walk down the middle of the street toward a riot? I know other people have offered that point and it's been derided, but seriously, is there anyone here who would do that? Seriously? I really hope not.

Wrong timeframe. Let me reword: What should Rittenhouse have done at the exact moments when he was under attack by assailants 1, 2, and 3?

Sorry, no, I'm not playing that game. Whatever convoluted legal decision made is irrelevant to me. Bottom line, the thing to do is to NOT pick up an assault rifle and walk down the middle of the street toward a riot. Come on, seriously? Would you ever do that? SERIOUSLY?

[Dr. Shades]

I'm talking during the exact split second that miscreant #1 tried to grab his weapon, followed by the split second after miscreant #2 bashed him in the head with a skateboard, then lastly the split second that miscreant #3 tried to shoot him.

Of course. I’m only allowed to speak to the exact split second that someone would have tried to grab his weapon that he was sort of holding after he decided to separate from friends, shoot someone else, then jog down the street, then as he couldn’t stay upright and found himself was on the ground. No one is allowed to speak to any other point in the timeline.

You can speak to any other point in the timeline. I'm simply asking you about THOSE particular points in the timeline.

Same answer. Sit on arse, place AR on ground. Hands up. All in full view of the police line a hundred yards down the street.

So, the mob shouting "Cranium him!" and "Get him!" (or perhaps it was "kill him?") inspires full confidence in you that their motives were pure and they would've calmly disarmed you and politely escorted you to where the police were located?

Bottom line, the thing to do is to NOT pick up an assault rifle and walk down the middle of the street toward a riot. Come on, seriously? Would you ever do that? SERIOUSLY?

No, I wouldn't. Neither did Kyle Rittenhouse. He ran away from a riot. It wasn't his fault the rioters caught up to him.

[canpakes]

Rittenhouse had already pointed his weapon at Jump Kick Man before Jump Kick Man jumped.

Are you sure about that?

https://mobile.Twitter.com/KristenBarba ... r-criminal

- Doc

Looks to me like he has it up and pointing at someone behind him with Jump Kick Man still running. Jump Kick Man takes two more steps, at which point Rittenhouse completes turning the AR towards Jump Kick Man, with Jump Kick Man beginning his launch at that point.

If Rittenhouse had time to assess and switch targets, Jump Kick Man may also have had time to change up his response.

[Marcus]

Bottom line, the thing to do is to NOT pick up an assault rifle and walk down the middle of the street toward a riot. Come on, seriously? Would you ever do that? SERIOUSLY?

No, I wouldn't. Neither did Kyle Rittenhouse. He ran away from a riot. It wasn't his fault the rioters caught up to him.

let me guess, you think he just re-spawned there with an assault rifle, and then thought to himself, "oh jeez I better run away?"

Come on shades. You're not that stupid.