Shulem Cracked the Book of Mormon Code, the Land of Nephi is now revealed! See for yourself! The Golden Key!

[Doctor CamNC4Me]

*snip temper tantrum

*snip lying through his teeth, not reading his own google searches, lying about reading, ad infinitum

- Doc

[Shulem]

Here is an interesting comparison in which the physical location of Joseph Smith is absolutely crucial in order to bring to pass remarkable claims of the restoration of ancient scripture. In both cases, Smith must be exactly at the right place and the timing for one of them must be spot on lest the opportunity is forever lost.

Two things come to mind:

1. Gold Plates: Book of Mormon @ Cumorah
2. Chandler's Papyrus: Book of Abraham @ Kirtland July 1835

There are two possible choices to conclude when evaluating Smith's claims. Either it's the miraculous handling of God who is perfectly timing Joseph's journey and setting him down exactly at the right place *OR* it's Smith just making up stories and taking advantage of his surroundings and opportunities in order to provide background necessary to invent new scripture.

1. Gold Plates: Conveniently located just a few miles from the Smith family farm. It couldn't be more convenient other than the plates being buried on the farm itself. If Smith's claims of gold plates atop Cumorah are true then it follows that God led the Smith family to Palmyra. The move would have been divinely orchestrated in order to get young Joseph near the plates.

2: Papyrus: It just so happened that Chandler rolled in to Kirtland Ohio possessing Egyptian curiosities that already had been reported as having possible connections with biblical patriarchs. That was a selling point! Rumors were already established and going around before Smith ever met Chandler! But as it was, Chandler rode into Kirtland at the right time and hand delivered scrolls written by Abraham & Joseph and plopped them down on the prophet's lap. Can it get any more convenient than that? That is an astronomical hole-in-one!

Two observations immediately disprove Smith's fantastic claims on both accounts:

1. Anachronistic nature and material of Book of Mormon content
2. Mistranslations and false interpretations of Egyptian papyri

If the Book of Mormon was devoid of anachronisms and the translations and interpretations of the papyrus were shown to have scientific merit, then we could further examine the original claims with greater consideration. But the results prove that the claims can be safely dismissed as Smith-hoopla designed to capture the attention of his intended victims.

[Shulem]

1. Gold Plates: Book of Mormon @ Cumorah

In some respects, the spot of ground in which the gold plates were allegedly buried is GROUND ZERO of the Book of Mormon saga. It all started at Cumorah in the mind of Joseph Smith. The plates, the box, and the contents therein were all an illusion and tricks in which the magician himself would perform his wonderous work of telling stories.

Consider the box that was supposedly buried near the top on the west side of the hill. The plates were said to be contained in a cement box formed by stones cemented together in some unusual fashion. Wandering Moroni on the run found time to fabricate a box and transport it up the hill to bury. The final touch was to seal it with a thick rounded stone lid. There the plates would remain in the dark for 1,400 years!

Many years after the alleged discovery of the plates, Smith narrated an account of how he found the plates. Interestingly enough he described using a lever by fixing it under the edge of the stone cover and by exerting a little effort he popped the stone off and away from the box. And in that instant, Smith said,"I looked in, and there indeed did I behold the plates, the Urim and Thummim, and the breastplate. In the bottom of the box were laid two stones crossways of the box, and on these stones lay the plates and the other things with them."

What's wrong with this story?

[Doctor CamNC4Me]

Is this a STONE BOX THREAD now? Sweet. Blast from the past and a shout out to our dead homie Grindael:

I remember when reading posts by Grindael just how little I knew about the ‘unspoken’ parts of Mormonism the “church” isn’t interested in teaching and doesn’t find “useful.” For example, Grindael posted this bit about Joseph Smith that exposed what kind of character we were dealing with, in terms of the spiritual tradition we inherited:

“In the month of June, 1827, Joseph Smith, Sen. related to me the following story:

‘That some years ago, a spirit had appeared to Joseph his son, in a vision, and informed him that in a certain place there was a record on plates of gold, and that he was the person that must obtain them, and this he must do in the following manner:

On the 22nd of September, he must repair to the place where was deposited this manuscript, dressed in black clothes, and riding a black horse with a switch tail, and demand the book in a certain name, and after obtaining it, he must go directly away, and neither lay it down nor look behind him. Wut.

They accordingly fitted out Joseph with the suit of black clothes, and borrowed a black horse. He repaired to the place of deposit and demanded the book, Wut. which was in a stone box, unsealed, and so near the top of the ground that he could see one end of it, and raising it up, Wut. took out the book of gold; but fearing some one might discover where he got it, he laid it down to place back the top stone, as he found it; and turning around, to his surprise there was no book in sight. Wut. He again opened the box, and in it saw the book, and attempted to take it out, but was hindered. Wut. He saw in the box something like toad, Wut. which soon assumed the appearance of a man, Wut. and struck him on the side of his head. Wut.– Not being discouraged at trifles, he again stooped down and strove to take the book, when the spirit struck him again, and knocked him three or four rods, Wut. and hurt him prodigiously. After recovering from his fright, he inquired why he could not obtain the plates; to which the spirit made reply, because you have not obeyed your orders. Sigh.

“… In the fore part of September, (I believe,) 1827, the Prophet [Joseph Smith] requested me to make him a chest, informing me that he designed to move back to Pennsylvania, and expecting soon to get his gold book, he wanted a chest to lock it up, giving me to understand at the same time, that if I would make the chest he would give me a share in the book. Wut.

“A few weeks after this conversation, he came to my house and related the following story:

That on the 22nd of September, he arose early in the morning, and took a one horse wagon, of someone that had stayed over night at their house, without leave or license; and, together with his wife, repaired to the hill which contained the book. He left his wife in the wagon, by the road, and went alone to the hill, a distance of thirty or forty rods from the road; he said he took the book out of the ground and hid it in a tree top, Wut. and returned home. …

He then observed that if it had not been for that stone [Joseph's money-digging seer stone], (which he acknowledged belonged to me,) he would not have obtained the book. A few days afterwards, he told one of my neighbors that he had not got any such book, nor never had such an one; but that he had told the story to deceive the d—d fool, (meaning me,) to get him to make a chest. His neighbors having become disgusted with his foolish stories, he determined to go back to Pennsylvania, to avoid what he called persecution.

His wits were now put to the task to contrive how he should get money to bear his expenses. He met one day in the streets of Palmyra, a rich man, whose name was Martin Harris, and addressed him thus; ‘I have a commandment from God to ask the first man I meet in the street to give me fifty dollars, to assist me in doing the work of the Lord by translating the Golden Bible.’ Martin being naturally a credulous man, hands Joseph the money.” – WIllard Chase, 1833

It was posts like the above that opened my eyes to the lengths the “church” has gone to whitewash its history. Virtually every time Grindael posted something it became a learning opportunity for me. And for that, I’m forever grateful to him - an autodidact and Mormon scholar.

- Doc

[Shulem]

Is this a STONE BOX THREAD now? Sweet. Blast from the past and a shout out to our dead homie Grindael:

I wish he was here, may he RIP.

He would be enjoying this thread!

[Shulem]

What's wrong with this story?

No matter how well Moroni (a one-man-band) crafted a box that was fabricated with stone and cement and topped with a stone cover, it would be IMPOSSIBLE to maintain a positive seal for 1,400 years due to weathering and agitation from the elements. Even if the lip of the lid was finely grounded in perfectly flat fashion in which to mate with flat upper edges of a box to form a tight seal -- failure over a millennia would have been the natural result.

But we have dirty-bearded wandering Moroni using what crude tools he can manage fashioning a stone box to safeguard precious items to be set in a shallow hole at the top of a hill? And Joseph is going to uncover these precious goods 1,400 years later and look inside the box and see them? Give me a break!

Natural deterioration of the stone from weathering, water erosion, water submersion, and swings in temperature would have resulted in a broken seal. Moisture and organic elements would naturally penetrate the interior of the box. In time, the box would have filled with natural dirt and organic matter. Therefore, when Joseph pried the cover off with a makeshift lever and exposed the box to the open atmosphere, there was nothing to see other than a dirty composition of matter -- an unrecognizable mass of filth.

But oh no, the shiny gold plates! Joseph finally got his treasure he had been digging for all those years! This one did not slip away...

[Shulem]

Is this a STONE BOX THREAD now? Sweet.

Was there ever an unbiased witness who was not oath-bound to Joseph to have reported seeing and handling the remnants of the sacred stone box in which Moroni fabricated or the gold plates? It seems to me that the box itself is an ancient relic and should have been preserved! Church historians today would love to have that box even if it was in pieces. It would be put on display by the Church and heralded as sacred artifact fashioned by the last prophet of the Book of Mormon.

But no, there is no box. There were no gold plates. It was all a story told by Joseph Smith in order to tell his tale about the white and delightsome Nephites establishing their Zion and Jesus appearing in Bountiful at Delmarva.

DELMARVA!

[Shulem]

And if you would like I will exit stage left. I think I may have steered things away from where you want things to continue. I’ve said my piece so I’m willing to let things go where they may at this point.

Thanks for letting me exercise my right of free speech.

You are most welcome and your contributions are appreciated, MG.

Special THANKS to Dr. Shades for providing this board where we can assemble and express ourselves in good faith.

Thank you, Shades.

[Shulem]

This thread contains several posts about the importance of the cardinal directions in the Book of Mormon with regard to land, sea, and navigation. Directions were paramount in understanding how to get around and travel from place to place. North was always north and the sun sets in the west and rises in the east. It has always been that way and always will. South in the land of promise was never any further south than where Lehi landed on the tip of Delmarva. The text of the book makes that abundantly and absolutely clear. Every place described in the text was north of Lehi's landing!

I hereby add more reinforcing material to this thread to aid in understanding that it was Smith who played the character of Nephi and told the story and provided the cardinal directions given in the text. It was all Joseph Smith who tendered the cardinal directions as he understood them.

For I command all men, both in the east and in the west, and in the north, and in the south, and in the islands of the sea,

But where is NORTH?

For thou hast said in thy heart: I will ascend into heaven, I will exalt my throne above the stars of God; I will sit also upon the mount of the congregation, in the sides of the north;

Let's assume that Joseph Smith did not understand the full connotation in what Isaiah meant when he referred to the "north". No problem. But let's assume that Nephi most certainly did because he was a native of Jerusalem and most familiar with Isaiah's teachings. He would have known that north meant NORTH.

You said in your heart, “I will ascend to the heavens; I will raise my throne above the stars of God; I will sit enthroned on the mount of assembly, on the utmost heights of Mount Zaphon.

Where is Mount Zaphon in relation to Jerusalem?

What is Mount zaphon in the Bible?

Jebel Aqra has a long history as a sacred mountain. ... It appears in the Hebrew Scriptures as Mount Zaphon (Hebrew: צפון Tsāfōn). In ancient Canaanite religion, Mount Sapan was sometimes accounted as the home of all the gods, not only Baʿal and his sister.

Thus a road from Jerusalem will lead due north through Lebanon -- straight to the northern mountain on the coast of the Mediterranean.

North is north, always. Unless of course, you're a Book of Mormon apologist who is forced to twist and contort north to fit your silly model!

[Shulem]

South in the land of promise was never any further south than where Lehi landed on the tip of Delmarva. The text of the book makes that abundantly and absolutely clear. Every place described in the text was north of Lehi's landing!

Peninsula vs Isthmus

An isthmus is a land connection between two bigger landmasses, while a peninsula is rather a land protrusion which is connected to a bigger landmass on one side only and surrounded by water on all other sides.

Nobody ever went south of Nephi's landing. Nobody ever said anything about a land south of Lehi's landing. All roads and all destinations leading away from Lehi's landing were NORTH. The text in the story makes that absolutely clear.

Book of Mormon wars described on the peninsula reveal that there is only one escape or one place to retreat: Traverse the narrow neck and through narrow land passages in the neck leading into the land northward. There was never any retreat or journey south of Lehi's landing in the Land of Nephi. There was nothing south other than Sea South.