[ ] The Holy Ghost bore testimony to Cowdery that the last battles occurred at Cumorah
[ ] It was only Cowdery’s personal opinion that the last battles occurred at Cumorah
He believed the final battles took place around the vicinity of Cumorah. That much we know.
Regards,
MG
So what box are you checking? If you are unwilling to check a box, for whatever reason, then how about you check the box that you think Oliver Cowdery would check?
Check the box, please. Either there is a Holy Ghost in this circumstance or there is NOT. I'm leaving it to you to decide that. So, what say ye, MG? Spirit or NO Spirit?
Obviously it depends on where the events of the Book of Mormon took place.
For years I’ve subscribed to the FARMS crowd and their Mesoamerican theories. Now, I’m not so sure. I’m looking at Jonathan Neville’s stuff nowadays and doing some additional research/thinking on Book of Mormon geography with the realization that corrective measures may need to be taken.
I believe the Book of Mormon to be an actual artifact from ancient times but I’m not completely settled on where the Book of Mormon lands may have been.
Have you read or researched Jonathan Neville’s writings/books? Moroni’s America, etc.?
Truthfully…I’m looking at geography that fits in the Book of Mormon narrative as a whole. Not a geography that begins with the assumption that the Book of Mormon is fiction.
I suppose that’s mainly where we differ.
It does not "obviously" depend on where the events took place from a historical nonfiction perspective. The world doesn't see it that way. Only Mormons.
So, for years you thought one way but now you're not sure. We can conclude that the Holy Ghost has never confirmed to you the location of the Book of Mormon and you remain in the dark and it's nothing more or less than a mystery for you even to this day. I don't mean to infer that you are lacking because you don't have testimony from the Holy Ghost about geography or that you are required to have one -- I only point out that you do NOT have one. You are in the dark.
I have not researched Jonathan Neville. I doubt very much that he has anything to say that would interest me or cause me to change my mind about Delmarva. As for you, whether you look at the Book of Mormon as fiction or nonfiction makes no difference in knowing where the narrow neck was based on Joseph Smith's telling.
Where was the narrow neck? What is your first choice if you were a betting man?
The Joseph Smith-Captain Kidd-buried golden treasure-Susquehanna River is one of those "Aha!" connections. Meeting the geographical specifications, and not having an impossible distance to Hill Cumorah are all good signs that Joseph was making his story location within realistic bounds.
Yes, it is an "Aha!" for me and a significant historical connection to Joe's novel. Joe had every resource he needed in his present day to let his imagination run with his story. Delmarva is a perfect fit.
I appreciate the comments from both of you. I wish more people would chime in and express their interest in seeing things in a new light. Again, I thank everyone who has contributed or spoken up. The Delmarva revelation is an amazing discovery on my part. It's glorious news for the critics and the unbelievers but horrible news for the faithful and a bombshell on the apologists.
[ ] The Holy Ghost bore testimony to Cowdery that the last battles occurred at Cumorah
[ ] It was only Cowdery’s personal opinion that the last battles occurred at Cumorah
He believed the final battles took place around the vicinity of Cumorah. That much we know.
Can we reasonable also say that the second elder of the Church believed the same thing as the first elder of the Church? Doesn't that sound perfectly reasonable, MG?
Thus, it could be said that Joseph Smith ALSO believed the final battles occurred at Cumorah.
Hey, what's good for the goose is good for the gander! Joseph & Oliver did believe the same thing, right?
The main Book of Mormon chronology covers the span of a thousand years wherein the Nephites and the Lamanites maintained a constant discourse whether at peace or in war. A constant back and forth in a civilization that was fluid and always on the go. Interestingly enough at no time in the stories of this novel did the Nephites or the Lamanites ever hint of a land south of Lehi’s original landing. There is nothing to suggest that there was ever an expedition south of that point. No description of anything was ever said to exist and no claim of any territory south of the southernmost border of the Book of Mormon saga. This in and of itself speaks volumes against Mesoamerican models. It’s unspoken evidence that there is no evidence south of Lehi’s landing. Central America and South America do not exist south of the Book of Mormon peninsula. Only the ocean.
We can agree on something! I think I spent more time, during my younger days, paying homage at Led Zeppelin’s Houses of the Holy than I did worshipping the One True God at my local ward in Southern Cal.
He believed the final battles took place around the vicinity of Cumorah. That much we know.
Regards,
MG
So what box are you checking? If you are unwilling to check a box, for whatever reason, then how about you check the box that you think Oliver Cowdery would check?
Check the box, please. Either there is a Holy Ghost in this circumstance or there is NOT. I'm leaving it to you to decide that. So, what say ye, MG? Spirit or NO Spirit?
Check the box!
I think Oliver felt that he had a witness of the Holy Ghost that the NY Cumorah was the scene of the final battles described in the Book of Mormon.
We can agree on something! I think I spent more time, during my younger days, paying homage at Led Zeppelin’s Houses of the Holy than I did worshipping the One True God at my local ward in Southern Cal.
Here is how I believe Smith & Cowdery would have declared their faith if asked:
[X] The Holy Ghost bore testimony to me, Joseph Smith, that the last battles occurred at Cumorah
[X] The Holy Ghost bore testimony to me, Oliver Cowdery, that the last battles occurred at Cumorah
Hence their beliefs were founded on the testimony and witness given them of the Holy Ghost
I have not researched Jonathan Neville. I doubt very much that he has anything to say that would interest me or cause me to change my mind about Delmarva. As for you, whether you look at the Book of Mormon as fiction or nonfiction makes no difference in knowing where the narrow neck was based on Joseph Smith's telling.
Where was the narrow neck? What is your first choice if you were a betting man?
I don’t know for sure. As I said, I’m going to spend some time looking at some of the stuff Jonathan Neville has put out there. Here is a good place to start for others that might be interested:
