“Peter Pan” is Unmasked as Mike Parker

[Res Ipsa]

Drumdude, I read Peterson's talk. It's, uh, kind of hard to describe. It certainly doesn't give a flattering impression of the man or his worldview. But the reason he described DNA evidence as a Galileo moment may not be what you are thinking. It certainly doesn't contradict his claim that it wasn't fear of DNA evidence that led Sorenson to adopt the LGT. I'd recommend reading just the DNA evidence section to understand his comment.

My TL/DR on Peterson's comment about Galileo moment: Just as the Catholic church didn't need to reject the science presented by Galileo, Mormons don't need to reject the DNA evidence. Something like that.

[drumdude]

Drumdude, I read Peterson's talk. It's, uh, kind of hard to describe. It certainly doesn't give a flattering impression of the man or his worldview. But the reason he described DNA evidence as a Galileo moment may not be what you are thinking. It certainly doesn't contradict his claim that it wasn't fear of DNA evidence that led Sorenson to adopt the LGT. I'd recommend reading just the DNA evidence section to understand his comment.

My TL/DR on Peterson's comment about Galileo moment: Just as the Catholic church didn't need to reject the science presented by Galileo, Mormons don't need to reject the DNA evidence. Something like that.

I’m aware DCP glosses over the Galileo story where the church imprisons him for believing something the church didn’t need to reject.

I’m sure DCP is aware that when people use the term Galileo event with respect to DNA, he knows what they mean. He also mentions that if you accept DNA, you (evangelical critics) have to throw away the belief in a 6000 year old earth. He calls this letting the other shoe drop.

The first shoe drop is therefore discarding the belief that American Indians have Jewish ancestors like Mormons had always believed.

If a shoe is dropping, it is because the shoe was once in the air. DCP can’t have it both ways and say DNA changes their belief that they never believed in.

[Res Ipsa]

Drumdude, I read Peterson's talk. It's, uh, kind of hard to describe. It certainly doesn't give a flattering impression of the man or his worldview. But the reason he described DNA evidence as a Galileo moment may not be what you are thinking. It certainly doesn't contradict his claim that it wasn't fear of DNA evidence that led Sorenson to adopt the LGT. I'd recommend reading just the DNA evidence section to understand his comment.

My TL/DR on Peterson's comment about Galileo moment: Just as the Catholic church didn't need to reject the science presented by Galileo, Mormons don't need to reject the DNA evidence. Something like that.

I’m aware DCP glosses over the Galileo story where the church imprisons him for believing something the church didn’t need to reject.

I’m sure DCP is aware that when people use the term Galileo event with respect to DNA, he knows what they mean. He also mentions that if you accept DNA, you (evangelical critics) have to throw away the belief in a 6000 year old earth. He calls this letting the other shoe drop.

The first shoe drop is therefore discarding the belief that American Indians do not have Jewish ancestors like Mormons had always believed.

So? You presented the Galileo moment comment as if it contradicted his claim that Sorenson's adoption of the LGT theory was not in response to DNA evidence. It doesn't.

[drumdude]

Another striking similarity to Galileo:

ON DECEMBER 8, 2002, A RALLY was staged on Main Street Plaza in downtown Salt Lake City in support of LDS researcher Thomas Murphy, who faced the possibility of Church discipline for publicly stating that genetic studies of Native Americans challenged claims regarding the ancient historicity of the Book of Mormon. By an unanticipated coincidence, the protest occurred on the same evening as the Church’s first ever Spanish-language devotional. Consequently, thousands of Hispanic Saints pouring out of the LDS Conference Center and across the plaza to the southeast were confronted—to the surprise of both parties—by Murphy’s supporters, who held signs reading, for example, “And it came to pass that no Lamanite DNA was found throughout all of the land.” As she passed the sign-carriers, one Latina Saint was overheard to say to her Anglo companion, “Pero yo soy lamanita!” (“But I am a Lamanite!”)

https://www.jstor.org/stable/23290719


In DCP's redefinition of the history of LDS beliefs, this Latina Saint couldn't have thought she was a Lamanite. No one in the church thought the modern American Indians were related to Lamanites. Because what DCP believes now is what all Latter-Day Saints have always believed.

It's such a stupid, almost Orwellian lie that DCP is using to support his friend Mike Parker.

[drumdude]

Res,

You should really follow the whole context of the conversation by reading Neville Neville Land blog and SeN. I quoted one particular sentence because I can't dump the entire conversation over the last weeks here on the thread.

I'm not debating that one particular sentence. How Sorrenson came up with his model doesn't matter to me. DCP trying to say that LDS have always believed certain things does.

[Res Ipsa]

Res,

You should really follow the whole context of the conversation by reading Neville Neville Land blog and SeN. I quoted one particular sentence because I can't dump the entire conversation over the last weeks here on the thread.

I'm not debating that one particular sentence. How Sorrenson came up with his model doesn't matter to me. DCP trying to say that LDS have always believed certain things does.

What makes you think I haven't?

ETA: The quote you posted from Peterson doesn't say that LDS have always believed certain things. It rejects a claim that LGT was created in response to worries over DNA evidence.

[Dr Exiled]

For what it's worth, I've always thought that having the LGT is pretty convenient in that there is plausible deniability when evidence isn't found to support the theory. It's a jungle down there and so evidence gets destroyed pretty easily. Hope can then still survive in the face of the ever growing scientific consensus of native american origins.

[Doctor CamNC4Me]

It’s clear the Mopologists are simply employing the Hill Cumorah strategy with regard to DNA. They don’t have to deny the DNA evidence (Well. Some argue DNA eViDeNcE iS uNrELiAbLe), they just have to tuck it away so it ‘can’t be found’. Just as the Hill Cumorah is both present and ‘unfindable’, so is the genetic and archaeological evidence of Book of Mormon peoples.

eta: In a bit of synchronicity Mike Parker, a.k.a. Peter Pan, the proprietor of the Neville-Neville Land hate blog, posted this utterly retarded apologetic yesterday:

https://www.nevillenevilleland.com/2023 ... rtant.html

- Doc

[Res Ipsa]

It’s clear the Mopologists are simply employing the Hill Cumorah strategy with regard to DNA. They don’t have to deny the DNA evidence (Well. Some argue DNA eViDeNcE iS uNrELiAbLe), they just have to tuck it away so it ‘can’t be found’. Just as the Hill Cumorah is both present and ‘unfindable’, so is the genetic and archaeological evidence of Book of Mormon peoples.

eta: In a bit of synchronicity Mike Parker, a.k.a. Peter Pan, the proprietor of the Neville-Neville Land hate blog, posted this utterly retarded apologetic yesterday:

https://www.nevillenevilleland.com/2023 ... rtant.html

- Doc

Link didn't work for me.

[Doctor CamNC4Me]

It’s clear the Mopologists are simply employing the Hill Cumorah strategy with regard to DNA. They don’t have to deny the DNA evidence (Well. Some argue DNA eViDeNcE iS uNrELiAbLe), they just have to tuck it away so it ‘can’t be found’. Just as the Hill Cumorah is both present and ‘unfindable’, so is the genetic and archaeological evidence of Book of Mormon peoples.

eta: In a bit of synchronicity Mike Parker, a.k.a. Peter Pan, the proprietor of the Neville-Neville Land hate blog, posted this utterly retarded apologetic yesterday:

https://www.nevillenevilleland.com/2023 ... rtant.html

- Doc

Link didn't work for me.

https://www.nevillenevilleland.com/

It’s the March 15th post which is queued at the top right now.

- Doc