If plates then God

[MG 2.0]

What is demanding that its poverty stricken members pay tithing instead of feeding their children and accepting their gold fillings as payment if not evil incarnate?

Wow. You are not only playing lawyer, you are acting as judge and jury.

Apparently I’ve really gotten under your skin.

Take a deep breath, Res Ipsa.

Regards,
MG

[MG 2.0]

Under MG 2.0's assertions about the plan of salvation, the LDS church cannot be a clear, unambiguous good. Otherwise, the plan of salvation is bankrupt. It would be so hard to reject the church that we would be robbed of free agency. So, the church must cause enough harm to make it a fair test, not of evidence, but of faith. And that makes it entirely rational to raise the possibility that Smith and his church was a clever move to persuade us poor mortals into believing that his church is God's one and only "true" church on the face of the earth. After all, doesn't Mormon satan win if he deceives us and keeps us from exaltation?

This is your stuff, not mine. Built off of the strawman caracature you’ve attempted to build.

You clearly have some issues.

Regards,
MG

[MG 2.0]

MG 2.0's 100% ad hominem attack is his standard MO when faced with an argument to which he cannot respond with reason or evidence.

Again, take a breath, Res Ipsa. You are taking something as being personal that is a figment of your ‘church induced’ frenzied mind.

I have not attacked you. Slow down…breathe deeply…and pull yourself together.

In fact, if you go back and read my posts on this thread I’ve been trying to show understanding and acceptance for your views and those of others.

You’ve again crossed the line by making false allegations.

Time for an apology?

Regards,
MG

[MG 2.0]

He can talk about Monet all he wants, but that does not make a Monet painting an appropriate metaphor.

I think it is quite appropriate and applicable.

I realize there may be reasons that YOU don’t like it.

Regards,
MG

[Gadianton]

He's been laser focussed on the plates and on an interview of one person for pages and pages, yet complains that everyone else is taking too narrow a focus.

Right. Earlier in the discussion:

The plates and the angel, by association, demonstrate/prove the fact that God exists and Jesus is the Christ. The controversies of the ages are nullified.

And now:

If the plates were available and were used/proven as evidence for the Book of Mormon being the work of God we would no longer have the kind of faith that matters. We would have direct knowledge

[Res Ipsa]

Wasn't it MG 2.0 who argued that sexually abused children are an unfortunate but necessary consequence of giving the abusers the free agency to abuse?

Abusers do have agency to to choose, yes. “Unfortunate but necessary”? No, I wouldn’t put it like that at all.

Please don’t put words in my mouth.

The crime/insanity associated with sexually abused children is reprehensible and should be punished. As one of the Republican candidates for President expressed last night in the debate…the death penalty should be on the table for those monsters that commit these atrocities.

You have crossed the line, Res Ipsa.

Regards,
MG

Why is God not a monster for permitting children to be physically and sexually abused? Is the freedom to abuse children necessary to the plan of salvation or not? If it's not, why permit the torture of little children? Is this going to be another example of your God who is so powerful that he can twiddle the knobs of the fundamental forces of the universe but too weak to protect innocent children from pedophiles?

Your pivot to politics is a red herring. My statement had nothing to do with what society should do with those convicted of abusing children. It had to do with child abuse as being a necessary part of your God's plan of salvation.

[Res Ipsa]

What is demanding that its poverty stricken members pay tithing instead of feeding their children and accepting their gold fillings as payment if not evil incarnate?

Wow. You are not only playing lawyer, you are acting as judge and jury.

Apparently I’ve really gotten under your skin.

Take a deep breath, Res Ipsa.

Regards,
MG

There's no court here other than the court of opinion, where we all get to have and express them. Your avoidance of the question and pivot to yet more ad hominem attack is noted. Try taking your own advice and addressing my argument.

[Res Ipsa]

Under MG 2.0's assertions about the plan of salvation, the LDS church cannot be a clear, unambiguous good. Otherwise, the plan of salvation is bankrupt. It would be so hard to reject the church that we would be robbed of free agency. So, the church must cause enough harm to make it a fair test, not of evidence, but of faith. And that makes it entirely rational to raise the possibility that Smith and his church was a clever move to persuade us poor mortals into believing that his church is God's one and only "true" church on the face of the earth. After all, doesn't Mormon satan win if he deceives us and keeps us from exaltation?

This is your stuff, not mine. Built off of the strawman caracature you’ve attempted to build.

You clearly have some issues.

Regards,
MG

Nope. It's straightforward inferences from your own words and those of your prophets. If, as you contend, the plan of salvation requires that the plates be unavailable for an evidence based investigation, why doesn't it follow that the COJCOLDS cannot be unambiguously good for exactly the same reason. Please try to avoid ad hoc special pleading.

[MG 2.0]

He's been laser focussed on the plates and on an interview of one person for pages and pages, yet complains that everyone else is taking too narrow a focus.

Right. Earlier in the discussion:

The plates and the angel, by association, demonstrate/prove the fact that God exists and Jesus is the Christ. The controversies of the ages are nullified.

And now:

If the plates were available and were used/proven as evidence for the Book of Mormon being the work of God we would no longer have the kind of faith that matters. We would have direct knowledge

No contradiction.

Regards,
MG

[MG 2.0]

Wow. You are not only playing lawyer, you are acting as judge and jury.

Apparently I’ve really gotten under your skin.

Take a deep breath, Res Ipsa.

Regards,
MG

There's no court here other than the court of opinion, where we all get to have and express them. Your avoidance of the question and pivot to yet more ad hominem attack is noted. Try taking your own advice and addressing my argument.

This is your issue. You are the one that needs to work it out. Not me.

Regards,
MG