Question for Don Bradley

[Kishkumen]

I disagree with your reading. Nephi is not simply “Joseph Smith.” There may be a lot of Smith’s story in Nephi, but that does not make the two figures identical by any means. Try to push that too hard, and it crumbles pretty quickly.

I see the Book of Mormon undermining racist assumptions over time, not supporting them. If the book were simplistically racist, then Lamanites would be bad guys throughout and white skin would always map perfectly onto righteousness. No, Lamanites convert. Lamanites survive whereas Nephite civilization is wiped out. Nephites are more wicked than Lamanites in the end.

[Moksha]

Nephites are more wicked than Lamanites in the end.

Is that an allegory for the Latter-day Church?

[Kishkumen]

Nephites are more wicked than Lamanites in the end.

Is that an allegory for the Latter-day Church?

I think it was intended as a warning for everyone, so, yes, the LDS Church is in there, too.

[Shulem]

I disagree with your reading. Nephi is not simply “Joseph Smith.” There may be a lot of Smith’s story in Nephi, but that does not make the two figures identical by any means. Try to push that too hard, and it crumbles pretty quickly.

Allow me to clarify. When I said that Nephi was Joseph Smith it wasn't in reference to my 11-15-24 thread but was a simple matter of fact that Joseph Smith dictated every word Nephi was alleged to say while his face was in a hat. So, Nephi and Joseph Smith are one in the same. Smith was the author of the Book of Mormon. It's his baby from start to finish!

I see the Book of Mormon undermining racist assumptions over time, not supporting them. If the book were simplistically racist, then Lamanites would be bad guys throughout and white skin would always map perfectly onto righteousness. No, Lamanites convert. Lamanites survive whereas Nephite civilization is wiped out. Nephites are more wicked than Lamanites in the end.

Fair enough.

[Shulem]

Is that an allegory for the Latter-day Church?

I think it was intended as a warning for everyone, so, yes, the LDS Church is in there, too.

Joseph Smith never in his wildest imagination thought WE would be having this discussion in the year 2025. Christ was supposed to have appeared and Zion was to have been established under the direction of the choice seer in the 1800's. The prophecies failed.

Just ask Vogel.

[Kishkumen]

Joseph Smith never in his wildest imagination thought WE would be having this discussion in the year 2025. Christ was supposed to have appeared and Zion was to have been established under the direction of the choice seer in the 1800's. The prophecies failed.

Just ask Vogel.

That’s one way to approach the question. Another way is to hypothesize about what Joseph Smith might have said about today’s LDS Church if he were approaching it through his views in the Book of Mormon.

[Marcus]

I see Kish and Marcus both make these kinds of posts about “you’re not smart” a lot. They have very different ideologies. But the common factor seems to be that they were both in academia. There may be something about that background that doesn’t fit well with discussion on forums like this. Obviously the majority of the posters here aren’t from academia, and maybe it’s just difficult for the two to mix.

Not a criticism, just an observation.

What?????

You are confusing me with Kishkumen. Yes, I am in academia, but no, I don't post "you're not smart." That's Kishkumen's territory. He's also tried it on me a number of times and he gets nowhere.

Please, keep your insults straight, drumdude.

[Marcus]

.. in academia. There may be something about that background that doesn’t fit well with discussion on forums like this. Obviously the majority of the posters here aren’t from academia, and maybe it’s just difficult for the two to mix.

Not a criticism, just an observation.

And a very sad and inaccurate one. Many people here are very well educated and very experienced, in a wide variety of specialties. There is a significant amount of brain power reading and commenting here, and your comment is exceptionally shortsighted. As you are relatively new here, may I suggest reading back a bit more and learning about the backgrounds of posters.

[drumdude]

I am probably incorrect, I don’t know the full history. I wasn’t trying to criticize every post you two have made, just the style of dealing with disagreements here that you two sometimes share, from my limited perspective.

[Kishkumen]

I am probably incorrect, I don’t know the full history. I wasn’t trying to criticize every post you two have made, just the style of dealing with disagreements here that you two sometimes share, from my limited perspective.

Am I giving off this vibe because I complimented Shulem for being smart and a good writer?