The Fentanyl Crisis thread

[Gadianton]

Indeed, Canpakes. It looks like Markk responded again, failing to explain the rationale for mass deportations or how mass deportations would happen. If the local sheriff started calling ICE, that wouldn't lead to mass deportations, nor did he suggest that as such. This is what he said:

My point, and in context with the OP, is that with Gaston being voted out and hopefully a rea[l] commitment to a strong border and immigration policy they will start deporting and/or locking these folks up first. And get those that are known criminals and gang members out of here.

Markk seemed to think that focusing on criminals and gangs would lead to mass deportations? No, he's trying to justify mass deportations of working and innocent people by focusing on criminals. And we know now, obviously, Trump didn't do this. He started with worksite raids.

And now he's tried yet another justification for mass deporations: "Are you saying Gad, that after Jews had their citizenship stripped, that it was wrong for Hitler to send the ones to concentration camps who were murderers and child abusers? Surely, some of the 6 million Jews had to be guilty of some terrible things."

..cash take. The agencies get 80% for O-T and equipment to self fund the operation.

indeed. As the war on drugs has taught us from China to Reagan to Markk's relative, while no solution will be provided, there's plenty of money to be made prolonging the problem. In China, one tactic was to heavily tax farmers growing poppies as punishment, that made local officials a lot of money. An ICE guy lived in my old neighborhood. He had 4 houses and big luxury SUVs. I'm sure he's one of those Latino guys stoked about the new presidency.

[Markk]

Markk brings up a good point, Jersey actually asked about the logistics of performing a mass deportation and Markk's relative anecdote doesn't answer that either. The emphasis of Markk's post changed the context to the justification rather than the logistics -- the urgency because fentanyl.

As often as these ‘fentanyl crisis’ conversations always seem to end up with Markk harping on a supposed need for ‘mass deportations’, I’m left thinking that neither MAGA ‘leadership’ nor its base understand - or care - about how to tackle the fentanyl crisis.

Looks like we’re in for another Trump dog and pony show, instead of real solutions. It does seem to easily distract some folks, I guess.

Lol, so Gad and others, even you want me to discuss deportation. Gad refuses to talk to me in the first person until I discuss it in detail mass immigration. He wrote recently..."All the fentanyl crisis stuff came as a response to Jersey Girl's mass deportation thread. But nothing he said then or since then is even remotely a motivation to mass deport people. ..."

What is ironic is that you brought illegal immigration (border crossers) into my discussions about fentanyl....remember?

I am quite willing to continue to juggle both these topics, field questions on both topics.

[Markk]

Gad: Indeed, Canpakes. It looks like Markk responded again, failing to explain the rationale for mass deportations or how mass deportations would happen. If the local sheriff started calling ICE, that wouldn't lead to mass deportations, nor did he suggest that as such. This is what he said:

It is not just a local sheriff, has I gave in my example, it is the largest populated county in the US, with a projected population of 800 thousand plus illegal immigrants. They refuse, by state law, to contact ICE and place a hold, when if a illegal immigrant is arrested , detained , or questioned.

Now take that further and add that to the whole state of California, which has who knows how many illegal immigrants, well over 2 million.

Then take all the sanctuary cities that have similar laws or policies that restrict law enforcement contacting ICE and placing holds, on illegal immigrants.

You simply have no idea what you are talking about. See California State Law SB-54.

The quote below is from ACLU, that tells illegal immigrants how to keep from being deported, and navigate laws like SB-54.

The California Values Act (SB 54) prohibits local law enforcement from using its resources for immigration enforcement, with limited exceptions. This page explains your rights under the law. You can find additional information here about your rights if ICE confronts you at home, on the street, or at work.Feb 7, 2025

https://www.aclunc.org/our-work/know-yo ... 0at%20work.

If from the local sheriff or city cop, and all the departments withing were allowed to put on holds and contact Ice across our nation....that alone would lead to a mass of deportations.

[Markk]

Gad: Markk seemed to think that focusing on criminals and gangs would lead to mass deportations? No, he's trying to justify mass deportations of working and innocent people by focusing on criminals. And we know now, obviously, Trump didn't do this. He started with worksite raids.

See my last post to you. How are people here innocent if the are breaking our immigration laws?, which again because of your faulty begs* the question of "do you believe our immigration laws should be enforced."

* Historically, begging the question refers to a fault in a dialectical argument in which the speaker assumes some premise that has not been demonstrated to be true. Wiki

[canpakes]

As often as these ‘fentanyl crisis’ conversations always seem to end up with Markk harping on a supposed need for ‘mass deportations’, I’m left thinking that neither MAGA ‘leadership’ nor its base understand - or care - about how to tackle the fentanyl crisis.

Looks like we’re in for another Trump dog and pony show, instead of real solutions. It does seem to easily distract some folks, I guess.

Lol, so Gad and others, even you want me to discuss deportation. Gad refuses to talk to me in the first person until I discuss it in detail mass immigration. He wrote recently..."All the fentanyl crisis stuff came as a response to Jersey Girl's mass deportation thread. But nothing he said then or since then is even remotely a motivation to mass deport people. ..."

What is ironic is that you brought illegal immigration (border crossers) into my discussions about fentanyl....remember?

You may need to provide a link. I mentioned illegal immigration in a thread where you had already broached the topic, as well as mentioned fentanyl, in the ‘Death of Democracy’ thread:

viewtopic.php?p=2881824#p2881824

Then you were the first to bring up ‘fentanyl’ in the ‘Mass Deportations’ thread:

viewtopic.php?p=2881114#p2881114

You’re all over the map in this thread, including now bringing up the bogus claim about an ‘untraceable’ $4.7 trillion dollars, which was already debunked in the ‘Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez Unleashes’ thread.

When I asked you if Trump has any other plans than tariffs or mass deportations to tackle the fentanyl crisis, I had no idea that you’d just spend the next two dozen posts dodging the question. It seems obvious by now that the answer to the question is, ‘no’.

Like I said before, that might change down the road, but Trump’s focus is clearly not on this problem, nor any of the others that directly affect the health or economic stability of Americans.

[Doctor Steuss]

[...]
The point here is that Trump is being vilified for the same thing that every other president has done; enforcing the immigrations laws of their presidency.
[...]

I think there's a pretty big gulf between "enforcing the immigration laws," and lavishly spending on dog-and-pony shows while simultaneously violating human rights so egregiously that a tiny country with a GDP that's half of New Jersey's would stand up against an un-hinged American President and risk an all-out trade war. I guess transporting people on military planes, in shackles, leaving them to sit in their own defecation is a small step up from forcibly medicating children into compliance, and sterilizing women without consent.

Remind me, how many American citizens were hauled off to detention centers under Obama for the crime of speaking Spanish while shopping? How many phone calls did the Navajo nation's tribal headquarters receive because federal agents were constantly harassing Native Americans to prove they are here legally?

Enforcing immigration laws is awesome. Being an unmitigated asshat that targets people primarily because of the color of their skin, violating human rights along the way... not so much.

[Markk]

Lol, so Gad and others, even you want me to discuss deportation. Gad refuses to talk to me in the first person until I discuss it in detail mass immigration. He wrote recently..."All the fentanyl crisis stuff came as a response to Jersey Girl's mass deportation thread. But nothing he said then or since then is even remotely a motivation to mass deport people. ..."

What is ironic is that you brought illegal immigration (border crossers) into my discussions about fentanyl....remember?

You may need to provide a link. I mentioned illegal immigration in a thread where you had already broached the topic, as well as mentioned fentanyl, in the ‘Death of Democracy’ thread:

viewtopic.php?p=2881824#p2881824

Then you were the first to bring up ‘fentanyl’ in the ‘Mass Deportations’ thread:

viewtopic.php?p=2881114#p2881114

You’re all over the map in this thread, including now bringing up the bogus claim about an ‘untraceable’ $4.7 trillion dollars, which was already debunked in the ‘Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez Unleashes’ thread.

When I asked you if Trump has any other plans than tariffs or mass deportations to tackle the fentanyl crisis, I had no idea that you’d just spend the next two dozen posts dodging the question. It seems obvious by now that the answer to the question is, ‘no’.

Like I said before, that might change down the road, but Trump’s focus is clearly not on this problem, nor any of the others that directly affect the health or economic stability of Americans.

Come on Cakes, PG brought up immigration vs fentanyl, and you chimed in when I answered there where many problems with all kinds of trafficking because of a Lax border. I said nothing about Mass Immigration, until you and others brought it into the 14th amendment thread, and always in answering your questions and assertions.

Pakes: Then you were the first to bring up ‘fentanyl’ in the ‘Mass Deportations’ thread:

For what reason? LoL you mean as an example that California Government does not allow ICE holds for illegal immigration, my example could have been a illegal immigrant being busted with stolen TV's, but the fact in my example was fentanyl. Read my post that you linked.

I wrote in summation:

My point, and in context with the OP, is that with Gaston being voted out and hopefully a rea commitment to a strong border and immigration policy they will start deporting and/or locking these folks up first. And get those that are known criminals and gang members out of here.

A new policy will also, and maybe more importantly off the bat, stop it at the border, and enforce the laws we have for a legal path to citizenship and stop the drugs and extortion business' by the cartels.

This where I believe they will start and I believe it is a good thing.

[canpakes]

things

OK. There doesn’t appear to be much more than (1) tariffs!! and (2) mass deportations!! on Trump’s list of tools to tackle ‘the fentanyl crisis’, then.

[Markk]

things

OK. There doesn’t appear to be much more than (1) tariffs!! and (2) mass deportations!! on Trump’s list of tools to tackle ‘the fentanyl crisis’, then.

Like the different departments being very active enforcing the existing immigration laws, as I said, and you ignored here. If you want add the building the Wall, and designating the cartels as terrorists, which allows US military enforcement directed at the cartels, and things like their labs. Add he terminated catch and release. Operation Lone Star which Trump supports is key there in Texas, and certainly limits the flow.

Tariffs put 20k Mexican and Canadian troops on the ground, combating the flow of fentanyl and other drugs and illegal things.

Also, border crossing are down dramatically, which helps for sure, partly because of these different actions.

[canpakes]

Also, border crossing are down dramatically, which helps for sure, partly because of these different actions.

I’d say to watch for actual fentanyl seizures. That will be a better indication of any trend.

Cartels aren’t going to just stand down by not sending folks to a border that won’t allow passage. Like I asked before … what happens if you were to completely seal off all border traffic? Does that solve the fentanyl crisis?