Yes, good point. in my opinion, his desire for personal gratification and his need for power over others was foremost, and then he had to scramble fast and hard to convince people it was what god wanted for him. A very common story, most recently played out with Warren Jeff and the FLDS.
Yes, that would be a point of view supported by many critics.
Regards,
MG
The Church's point of view was that Joseph married pubescent girls and other men's wives only because God threatened to kill him if he didn't.
"Joseph told associates that an angel appeared to him three times between 1834 and 1842 and commanded him to proceed with plural marriage when he hesitated to move forward. During the third and final appearance, the angel came with a drawn sword, threatening Joseph with destruction unless he went forward and obeyed the commandment fully."
Polygamy was important enough to God that he was willing to take away Joseph's so-called free agency to be monogamously married to the one woman he truly loved.
Yes, that would be a point of view supported by many critics.
Regards,
MG
The Church's point of view was that Joseph married pubescent girls and other men's wives only because God threatened to kill him if he didn't.
"Joseph told associates that an angel appeared to him three times between 1834 and 1842 and commanded him to proceed with plural marriage when he hesitated to move forward. During the third and final appearance, the angel came with a drawn sword, threatening Joseph with destruction unless he went forward and obeyed the commandment fully."
Polygamy was important enough to God that he was willing to take away Joseph's so-called free agency to be monogamously married to the one woman he truly loved.
edit: Was the affair with Fanny Alger before or after the angel?
I think you may already know the answer to that question. And you may also know that some folks say "affair" and others say "marriage". Be that as it may, there were a number of years separating the two events.
And Emma wasn't happy, at all. It's quite a thing to consider that Joseph, after going for a long time without a polygamous marriage, would even consider doing it again.
One might look at the possibility that there may have been something that happened along the way that helped push him back in that direction. Quite a gap of time.
The Church's point of view was that Joseph married pubescent girls and other men's wives only because God threatened to kill him if he didn't.
"Joseph told associates that an angel appeared to him three times between 1834 and 1842 and commanded him to proceed with plural marriage when he hesitated to move forward. During the third and final appearance, the angel came with a drawn sword, threatening Joseph with destruction unless he went forward and obeyed the commandment fully."
Polygamy was important enough to God that he was willing to take away Joseph's so-called free agency to be monogamously married to the one woman he truly loved.
edit: Was the affair with Fanny Alger before or after the angel?
I think you may already know the answer to that question. And you may also know that some folks say "affair" and others say "marriage". Be that as it may, there were a number of years separating the two events.
And Emma wasn't happy, at all. It's quite a thing to consider that Joseph, after going for a long time without a polygamous marriage, would even consider doing it again.
One might look at the possibility that there may have been something that happened along the way that helped push him back in that direction. Quite a gap of time.
Regards,
MG
If I recall correctly, the "marriage" was not legal in that jurisdiction at that time. Either "affair" or "adulterous relationship" would, I believe, be appropriate.
You can help Ukraine by talking for an hour a week!! PM me, or check www.enginprogram.org for details. Слава Україні!, 𝑺𝒍𝒂𝒗𝒂 𝑼𝒌𝒓𝒂𝒊𝒏𝒊!
I think you may already know the answer to that question. And you may also know that some folks say "affair" and others say "marriage". Be that as it may, there were a number of years separating the two events.
And Emma wasn't happy, at all. It's quite a thing to consider that Joseph, after going for a long time without a polygamous marriage, would even consider doing it again.
One might look at the possibility that there may have been something that happened along the way that helped push him back in that direction. Quite a gap of time.
Regards,
MG
If I recall correctly, the "marriage" was not legal in that jurisdiction at that time. Either "affair" or "adulterous relationship" would, I believe, be appropriate.
Secret ceremony performed by Levi Hancock. No marriage certificate.
The Church's point of view was that Joseph married pubescent girls and other men's wives only because God threatened to kill him if he didn't.
"Joseph told associates that an angel appeared to him three times between 1834 and 1842 and commanded him to proceed with plural marriage when he hesitated to move forward. During the third and final appearance, the angel came with a drawn sword, threatening Joseph with destruction unless he went forward and obeyed the commandment fully."
Polygamy was important enough to God that he was willing to take away Joseph's so-called free agency to be monogamously married to the one woman he truly loved.
edit: Was the affair with Fanny Alger before or after the angel?
I think you may already know the answer to that question. And you may also know that some folks say "affair" and others say "marriage". Be that as it may, there were a number of years separating the two events.
And Emma wasn't happy, at all. It's quite a thing to consider that Joseph, after going for a long time without a polygamous marriage, would even consider doing it again.
One might look at the possibility that there may have been something that happened along the way that helped push him back in that direction. Quite a gap of time.
Regards,
MG
So, he was forced into polygamy by God, but that was only after he’d tried it (polygamy) on with the babysitter?
The Church's point of view was that Joseph married pubescent girls and other men's wives only because God threatened to kill him if he didn't.
"Joseph told associates that an angel appeared to him three times between 1834 and 1842 and commanded him to proceed with plural marriage when he hesitated to move forward. During the third and final appearance, the angel came with a drawn sword, threatening Joseph with destruction unless he went forward and obeyed the commandment fully."
Polygamy was important enough to God that he was willing to take away Joseph's so-called free agency to be monogamously married to the one woman he truly loved.
I think it was our former poster Beastie who made an observation that bears repeating:
God could've had the angel with a drawn sword threaten Joseph with destruction unless he told his followers to boil their water before drinking it. Or he could've had the angel threaten to kill Joseph unless he instructed his followers to wash their hands before delivering babies or performing surgical operations. He also could've had the angel force Joseph to teach his followers that slavery was wrong. Or that men and women are equal. Or to not, under any circumstances, destroy any printing presses. Or even all of those things, plus any number of others.
But NO. . . more important than any or all of those, the one issue more important to God than anything else on earth was for Joseph to have sex with multiple women other than his wife.
Boy, talk about convenient!! How much luckier can a heterosexual man be??
.
"Clarity from Mormon God only comes in very critical instances like convincing Emma that Joseph needed to sleep with other women."
--drumdude, 02-28-2026
What if we are all old fuddy-duddies without the free-spirited swinging desires of Joseph Smith. MG should encourage us to adapt to the times and adopt the ways of the 22nd century.
The Church's point of view was that Joseph married pubescent girls and other men's wives only because God threatened to kill him if he didn't.
"Joseph told associates that an angel appeared to him three times between 1834 and 1842 and commanded him to proceed with plural marriage when he hesitated to move forward. During the third and final appearance, the angel came with a drawn sword, threatening Joseph with destruction unless he went forward and obeyed the commandment fully."
Polygamy was important enough to God that he was willing to take away Joseph's so-called free agency to be monogamously married to the one woman he truly loved.
I think it was our former poster Beastie who made an observation that bears repeating:
God could've had the angel with a drawn sword threaten Joseph with destruction unless he told his followers to boil their water before drinking it. Or he could've had the angel threaten to kill Joseph unless he instructed his followers to wash their hands before delivering babies or performing surgical operations. He also could've had the angel force Joseph to teach his followers that slavery was wrong. Or that men and women are equal. Or to not, under any circumstances, destroy any printing presses. Or even all of those things, plus any number of others.
But NO. . . more important than any or all of those, the one issue more important to God than anything else on earth was for Joseph to have sex with multiple women other than his wife.
Boy, talk about convenient!! How much luckier can a heterosexual man be??
If I recall correctly, the "marriage" was not legal in that jurisdiction at that time. Either "affair" or "adulterous relationship" would, I believe, be appropriate.
Secret ceremony performed by Levi Hancock. No marriage certificate.
Regards,
MG
References please. And keep in mind that they need to be first hand contemporary references of the event, because you have previously pooh poohed any and all references to Joseph’s bad behaviour that weren’t contemporary and first hand. So let’s see your intellectual honesty and consistency on full display and provide those references.
In 100 years time there’ll be an MG 3.0 making the assertion that Donald Trump was married to Stormy Daniels, although it was in a secret ceremony and there’s no certificate.
Premise 1. Eyewitness testimony is notoriously unreliable.
Premise 2. The best evidence for the Book of Mormon is eyewitness testimony.
Conclusion. Therefore, the best evidence for the Book of Mormon is notoriously unreliable.
If I recall correctly, the "marriage" was not legal in that jurisdiction at that time. Either "affair" or "adulterous relationship" would, I believe, be appropriate.
Secret ceremony performed by Levi Hancock. No marriage certificate.
Regards,
MG
Did that secret ceremony make the "marriage" legal? Would Hancock legitimately have been able to issue a legal marriage certificate for a second "marriage"?? If not, my point stands: affair, adultery - take your choice.
A few years ago I met a man in Ohio who believed that god wanted him to take a second wife. His first wife apparently was OK with that. If I had held a "secret ceremony" for him and his new bride, would that have made his second marriage legal, whether I made a certificate or not?
You can help Ukraine by talking for an hour a week!! PM me, or check www.enginprogram.org for details. Слава Україні!, 𝑺𝒍𝒂𝒗𝒂 𝑼𝒌𝒓𝒂𝒊𝒏𝒊!
