Election Litigation Status

The Off-Topic forum for anything non-LDS related, such as sports or politics. Rated PG through PG-13.
Post Reply
User avatar
Jersey Girl
God
Posts: 8262
Joined: Mon Oct 26, 2020 3:51 am
Location: In my head

Re: Election Litigation Scorecard

Post by Jersey Girl »

Some Schmo wrote:
Fri Nov 20, 2020 8:09 pm
Just so I'm clear, Giuliani likely dyed his hair before the press conference because he wanted to look better for it, right?

Golly, I can't think of anything he's done in the last few years that's completely backfired. Ah yup.
Listen I really don't like to criticize the appearance of others. In this case, I think there's room to call out a stupid move when I see it. Giuliani is reportedly a millionaire. He can afford a professional color process or his hair people or his girlfriend or even a secretary could steer him towards a semi-permanent or permanent hair color product to do at home. But no, he puts one of those temporary leave in/rinse out products in his hair knowing full well he's going to be under hot lights and perspiring.

And he's representing the President of the United States while he's melting. :roll:

I'm really surprised it didn't melt off his eyebrows as well because he def color matched them to his hair. I hate that he did that. It's just so entirely foolish particularly when you consider the fact that he is a high profile figure. It just punctuates how incompetent he has become.

I sort of feel bad for him. He was once highly respected and powerful attorney and I believe he gained national attention for his response to 9/11 as Mayor of NYC. It is SAD to see him decline like this. Trump is a parasite sucking this guy dry. That's what he does to people and what he's doing to this country. Giuliani, I am sure, has been his friend for decades and he's using him up like he's nothing. Of course, Giuliani is complicit in his own declining public self image but I can understand this old guy giving it a shot for his buddy, relevancy, and national attention.

You know like Pacino says in Scent of a Woman, one last tour of the battlefield.

But Trump is running him into the ground. Trump makes me sick to my stomach. I hope this country chews him up and spits HIM out. The man is a damned leech.
LIGHT HAS A NAME

We only get stronger when we are lifting something that is heavier than what we are used to. ~ KF

Slava Ukraini!
User avatar
Moksha
God
Posts: 7815
Joined: Wed Oct 28, 2020 3:13 am
Location: Koloburbia

Re: Election Litigation Scorecard

Post by Moksha »

subgenius wrote:
Fri Nov 20, 2020 3:25 pm
Yup, who needs facts when you got feelings, amiright.
You can toss out those encyclopedias and science journals that are vexations to the alternate reality Presidency by having a burning in your bosom!

I'm thinking that actions taken to encourage Michigan, Georgia, etc... to ignore the will of their voters constitute treason. Of course, Trump is treasonous, his narcissism only permits him to care about himself. Senator Lindsey Graham should be held to a higher standard and prosecuted.

It was foolish for Rudy to put shoe polish in his hair. Lev and Igor do not use shoe polish. Rudy should have stuck to using herring oil like his pals.
Cry Heaven and let loose the Penguins of Peace
User avatar
Some Schmo
God
Posts: 3222
Joined: Wed Oct 28, 2020 3:21 am

Re: Election Litigation Scorecard

Post by Some Schmo »

Jersey Girl wrote:
Fri Nov 20, 2020 9:37 pm
Some Schmo wrote:
Fri Nov 20, 2020 8:09 pm
Just so I'm clear, Giuliani likely dyed his hair before the press conference because he wanted to look better for it, right?

Golly, I can't think of anything he's done in the last few years that's completely backfired. Ah yup.
Listen I really don't like to criticize the appearance of others. In this case, I think there's room to call out a stupid move when I see it.
I wasn't really thinking about his appearance when I posted this. I was thinking more about how everything he's doing right now is an embarrassing, obvious smoke and mirrors show. His running fake hair color is the perfect metaphor for this idiot act. He thinks he's presenting something strong, yet people can't help laughing and/or being disgusted at it.
Religion is for people whose existential fear is greater than their common sense.

The god idea is popular with desperate people.
User avatar
Jersey Girl
God
Posts: 8262
Joined: Mon Oct 26, 2020 3:51 am
Location: In my head

Re: Election Litigation Scorecard

Post by Jersey Girl »

Some Schmo wrote:
Fri Nov 20, 2020 10:03 pm
Jersey Girl wrote:
Fri Nov 20, 2020 9:37 pm

Listen I really don't like to criticize the appearance of others. In this case, I think there's room to call out a stupid move when I see it.
I wasn't really thinking about his appearance when I posted this. I was thinking more about how everything he's doing right now is an embarrassing, obvious smoke and mirrors show. His running fake hair color is the perfect metaphor for this idiot act. He thinks he's presenting something strong, yet people can't help laughing and/or being disgusted at it.
Oh yeah, I get it.
LIGHT HAS A NAME

We only get stronger when we are lifting something that is heavier than what we are used to. ~ KF

Slava Ukraini!
subgenius
Stake President
Posts: 580
Joined: Fri Oct 30, 2020 2:31 pm
Location: your mother's purse

Re: Election Litigation Scorecard

Post by subgenius »

This might be relevant in the near future:
Image
Seek freedom and become captive of your desires...seek discipline and find your liberty
I can tell if a person is judgmental just by looking at them
what is chaos to the fly is normal to the spider - morticia addams
Icarus
Bishop
Posts: 492
Joined: Wed Oct 28, 2020 12:15 pm

Re: Election Litigation Scorecard

Post by Icarus »

subgenius wrote:
Fri Nov 20, 2020 3:25 pm
Moksha wrote:
Thu Nov 19, 2020 11:48 pm
Trump would have been spinning this fake election crap back in 2016 if he had lost.
YOU ARE SO CORRECT! WOW...but instead, back in 2016 Hillary Clinton lost and, without a shred of evidence, we got Russia!Russia!Russia!...good thing nobody was spinnin.....oh, wait.
Image
Yup, who needs facts when you got feelings, amiright.
Actually there is a ton of evidence for Russia!Russia!Russia! but idiots like you live in a bubble of your own making.

And that's the difference between the Right and Left. The left operates from evidence, the Right begins with baseless conclusions and they creates a fantasy world where they assert all kinds of evidence that doesn't exist. It is why they have a long history of hysteria and fear mongering with fake scandals that end up going nowhere once the issues are investigated.
User avatar
Some Schmo
God
Posts: 3222
Joined: Wed Oct 28, 2020 3:21 am

Re: Election Litigation Scorecard

Post by Some Schmo »

Icarus wrote:
Sat Nov 21, 2020 11:03 am
Actually there is a ton of evidence for Russia!Russia!Russia! but idiots like you live in a bubble of your own making.
So true. For the idiots that denied everything we saw in public that would indicate Trump's subservience to Putin, the timing of wiki leaks, and so on, you had to willfully position your head straight up your ass to ignore it all.

There's no doubt that part of Clinton's loss was her lack of popularity combined with the Comey letter, but to deny Russia helped Trump is to be chronically sniffing your rectum. If you think the Russia thing was a "hoax," you're a damned rube (or rubles to Putin).
Religion is for people whose existential fear is greater than their common sense.

The god idea is popular with desperate people.
subgenius
Stake President
Posts: 580
Joined: Fri Oct 30, 2020 2:31 pm
Location: your mother's purse

Re: Election Litigation Scorecard

Post by subgenius »

#journalism
#factsbutyouarenitusingthatwordcorrectly
Image
Seek freedom and become captive of your desires...seek discipline and find your liberty
I can tell if a person is judgmental just by looking at them
what is chaos to the fly is normal to the spider - morticia addams
User avatar
canpakes
God
Posts: 8372
Joined: Wed Oct 28, 2020 1:25 am

Re: Election Litigation Scorecard

Post by canpakes »

Oh noes! George Soros! Promoting democracy for decades! No wonder folks like subs are afraid of him. ; )


https://www.opensocietyfoundations.org/ ... ur-history
Chap
God
Posts: 2619
Joined: Wed Oct 28, 2020 8:42 am
Location: On the imaginary axis

Re: Election Litigation Scorecard

Post by Chap »

So yeah,

Despite the fact that
[Sydney] Powell claimed that widely used voting machines from the election technology company Dominion Voting Systems featured software created "at the direction" of former Venezuelan President Hugo Chavez to swing his own election results, and that the company has ties to the Clinton Foundation and Soros.
it is indeed the case that
Dominion has no corporate ties with Venezuela, the Clinton Foundation or Soros.
Though all those names do occur in the same document. I'll grant you that.

That's a great CNN fact-checking page, by the way! Thanks for pointing to it. Here it is in its entirety!

Fact-checking Giuliani and the Trump legal team's wild, fact-free press conference

(CNN)In a wild, tangent-filled and often contentious press briefing led by President Donald Trump's personal attorney Rudy Giuliani, the Trump campaign's legal team laid out its case for widespread voter fraud in the election. The roughly 90-minute briefing was overflowing with falsehoods and conspiracy theories.

At no point did Trump's legal team offer any proof for their allegations of widespread fraud. Jenna Ellis, a legal adviser for the campaign, said the group was laying out an "introductory statement" with more to come, and called the team an "elite strike force." Also working for the campaign, attorney Sidney Powell made extreme, baseless claims about communist Venezuela and George Soros supposedly interfering in the US election. Giuliani on multiple occasions made allegations citing individuals he said couldn't be revealed for their own safety and wellbeing.
Many of their specific claims have already been refuted by federal election security experts and a wide, bipartisan array of election administrators across the country.
Here's a look at some of the top claims made during the briefing and the facts around them.


Certification in Wayne County
Giuliani said the Trump campaign withdrew one case in Michigan because its goal was to get the Wayne County board to decertify and they did.

Facts First: This is false. The county's results were certified on Tuesday night.
Two Republican members of the Board initially deadlocked the vote but then reversed their decision and voted to certify Tuesday night. They have since sent in affidavits to rescind their vote but have not filed any lawsuits to try to force the county to call a new meeting. Since the deadline has passed, the certification still stands.
Democratic Vice Chair Jonathan Kinloch said Thursday that board members' votes cannot be changed after the fact.
-- Tara Subramaniam and Annie Grayer

'Overvotes' in Michigan
"One of the reasons why the Republicans did not certify in Wayne County, Michigan, was because the over-vote was so high," Giuliani claimed. He added, "what I'm describing to you is a massive fraud."

Facts First: This is false.
What Giuliani called an over-vote is often referred to as an imbalance where the number of ballots tabulated does not equal the number of people signed in to vote at a specific polling location.
Past elections in Michigan with larger imbalances have been certified without issue, including in 2016 when Trump won the state, according the Michigan Secretary of State.
"They certified the vote in 2016 with 80% of Detroit precincts out of balance. And yet today, 42% were out of balance and yet it didn't get certified, so clearly there is no valid point here," Michigan Secretary of State Jocelyn Benson said.
Benson told CNN it's "quite common" for precincts to be out of balance but "it doesn't indicate there's any malfeasance," adding "it's more of a bookkeeping, clerical issue."
There are many reasons a precinct could be out of balance and have a discrepancy between the number of ballots cast and the number of people registered into the poll book, according to Chris Thomas who served as a senior adviser to the Detroit City Clerk. Thomas, who has built a decades-long career serving both Republican and Democratic Secretaries of State, told CNN that in general, through his many years of experience, an imbalance should be viewed as clerical mistakes and not fraud.
-- Tara Subramaniam and Annie Grayer

Poll watchers
Giuliani claimed that more than 600,000 ballots in Pennsylvania "weren't inspected which renders them ballots that are null and void."

Facts First: This is false. Nothing is illegitimate about those ballots.
A Pennsylvania Supreme Court justice decided that the Philadelphia County board of elections complied with the law in how it allowed observers access to the canvassing process.
The law allows the observers to be present, the judge wrote, but they do not have the right to inspect or look over the shoulders of the workers counting the ballots. The judge ruled canvas watchers in Philadelphia cannot challenge ballots and don't need to inspect each individual signature.
-- Tara Subramaniam

Mail-in ballots
Giuliani falsely claimed that mail-in ballots are "prone to fraud."

Facts First: Election experts have told CNN time and time again that mail-in ballots are a safe form of voting and not subject to widespread fraud.
-- Holmes Lybrand

Justice Alito and Pennsylvania
At one point Giuliani suggested that US Supreme Court Justice Samuel Alito intervened in Pennsylvania and told the state that, "any ballot that comes in after 8 o'clock on November 3, 2020 had to be put aside and not opened."

Facts First: It's false for Giuliani to claim Alito ordered counties not to open ballots received after 8 p.m. on Election Day. Instead, Alito directed the county boards of election to follow the guidance issued by Pennsylvania's Secretary of State, which called for segregating ballots arriving November 4-6, and to keep them separate even if they were counted.
On November 6, the Republican Party of Pennsylvania asked the US Supreme Court to order Secretary of State Kathy Boockvar to "log, to segregate, and otherwise not to take any action related to any ballots that arrive" after Election Day.
Alito said he would refer the application to the court. The justices have yet to rule on the Republicans' petition that "no action" be taken on the ballots.
Alito, who has jurisdiction over the Pennsylvania region, issued an order November 6 that directed that "all county boards of election" are ordered to "comply with" the guidelines put forward by the Secretary of the Commonwealth, essentially maintaining the status quo.
-- Ariane deVogue and Tara Subramaniam

71% inconsistent data
Ellis, a senior legal adviser for the Trump campaign, claimed that Wayne County, Michigan, was not going to certify its results "because 71% of counties have inconsistent data."

Facts First: This is misleading.
While Ellis did not specify what she meant by inconsistent data, it's likely she was referring to precincts that are out of balance, where the number of voters recorded in the poll book doesn't match the number of ballots cast.
According to the Michigan Secretary of State's office, 71% of the absentee ballot-counting locations in Detroit, which is part of Wayne County, didn't balance. However, the total number of precincts that did not balance in the city overall was much lower. Including in-person ballots, 42% of the total precincts in Detroit did not balance.
Inside Rudy Giuliani's attempt to sow chaos on behalf of Trump and steal the election
Inside Rudy Giuliani's attempt to sow chaos on behalf of Trump and steal the election
Imbalances were part of the reason two Republican members of the Wayne County Board of Canvassers temporarily blocked certification of the county's results. The results were ultimately certified after an agreement which stipulated in part that Michigan's Secretary of State would be called on to do a comprehensive audit on the specific precincts in Detroit that did not balance.
Clerical errors resulting in these imbalances have not stopped past certifications in the county. In the August primary, Wayne County certified its results when 72% of absentee counting boards in Detroit and 46% of the total precincts in the county did not reconcile.
For this election the Wayne County Board of Canvassers has not officially released their final report that will include which precincts in the county did not balance.
-- Tara Subramaniam and Annie Grayer

Dominion Voting Systems and Venezuela
Powell claimed that widely used voting machines from the election technology company Dominion Voting Systems featured software created "at the direction" of former Venezuelan President Hugo Chavez to swing his own election results, and that the company has ties to the Clinton Foundation and Soros.

Facts first: None of this is true. Dominion has no corporate ties with Venezuela, the Clinton Foundation or Soros.
Powell and other Trump allies have tried to tie Dominion, which sells election technology that was used in more than two dozen states, to another voting company called Smartmatic. During the 2020 election, Smartmatic's technology was used only in Los Angeles County, and not in any swing states, a spokesperson for the company told CNN.
Smartmatic was founded in Florida by two Venezuelans, and did provide election technology to the Venezuelan government. Powell has posted on social media a purported affidavit from an unnamed Venezuelan official claiming Smartmatic software was used to change votes in the country. But those claims have no evidence, and there's no reason to believe the company's software was created to make sure Chavez "never lost an election," as Powell claimed. The company actually spoke out to accuse the Venezuelan government of voter fraud in 2017.
The bigger issue with this claim is that there is no evidence that Dominion machines used Smartmatic software, as Powell suggested -- and thus zero connection between Venezuela and the company whose voting machines were actually used in the swing states Trump is focusing on. Both Dominion and Smartmatic have said that they are competitors with no corporate links.
The origin of the claim linking the companies seems to be a convoluted corporate transfer: In 2005, Smartmatic acquired a company called Sequoia Voting Systems, but sold it in 2007 after questions from members of Congress over the acquisition by a company linked to Venezuela. Three years later, Dominion, which was founded as a Canadian company but is now majority owned by Americans, acquired Sequoia. In addition, Smartmatic licensed Dominion machines for use in the Philippines in 2009, but the contract ended in a lawsuit, Dominion said in its statement.
Neither Dominion nor Smartmatic have corporate ties to the Clintons or Soros, a major Democratic donor. While Dominion did agree to donate its technology to "emerging democracies" as part of a program run by the Clinton Foundation in 2014, according to the foundation's website, Dominion said in its statement that it has "no company ownership relationships" with the foundation. And while the chairman of the board of Smartmatic's parent company is also on the board of a foundation run by Soros, Open Society Foundations, Soros himself is not involved in either company.
-Casey Tolan

Dominion and algorithms
In one of the most outlandish claims of the press conference, Powell also said that the software used by Dominion "can set and run an algorithm that probably ran all over the country to take a certain percentage of votes from President Trump and flip them to President Biden."

Facts first: There is absolutely no evidence of this happening. Federal officials have said there was no widespread fraud or irregularities during the election, and most states use paper ballots that can be audited to double-check the vote totals.
Experts have said that those ideas are devoid of factual backing. Notably, states are able to review and recount paper ballots, which can validate vote totals. And a joint group of federal, state, local and private election officials called the 2020 election the most secure in American history last week.
While there were a few isolated issues reported with Dominion technology on Election Day and Election Night, there have been no credible reports that any problems with the company's machines affected vote counts.
To allege the possibility of hacking, Powell appeared to cite research by Princeton University professor Andrew Appel, who has warned about potential vulnerabilities in voting machines from Dominion and other companies and has demonstrated the potential that exists to hack those machines. But Appel argued this month that the election results can be trusted due to the paper trail supporting the vote counts.
"Vulnerabilities are not the same as rigged elections, especially when we have paper ballots in almost all the states," Appel wrote on his blog last week. "The U.S. mostly uses paper ballots now, and that's how we can trust the election results even though there are some computer vulnerabilities."
Maksutov:
That's the problem with this supernatural stuff, it doesn't really solve anything. It's a placeholder for ignorance.
Mayan Elephant:
Not only have I denounced the Big Lie, I have denounced the Big lie big lie.
Post Reply