?????divine investiture????? another man made belief

[_maklelan]

The Bible is very clear Jesus is God also. That's why the Book of Mormon agrees with the Creeds of the 4th and 5th century , it was written by a professor of these creeds

1. “To those who through the righteousness of Our God and Savior Jesus Christ,” 2 Peter 1:1
Emphatic Diaglott

2. “The glorious appearing of our Great God and Savior, Jesus Christ,” Titus 2:13 Emphatic Diaglott

Ah, yes, a naïve appeal to Granville Sharps. Get a better translation.

3.”Keep watch over yourself and all the flock of which the Holy Spirit has you overseer. Be shepherds of the Church of God, which he bought with his own blood.” Acts 20:23 New International V

I think you mean Acts 20:28, and that's only one way to read the Greek. Also, there are many very early variants that read "the church of the Lord," "blood of his son," etc. Nowhere in the entire New Testament is the notion found that God's own blood purchased the Church.

4.”Theirs are the patriarchs, and from them is traced the human ancestry of Christ, who is God over all forever praised amen” Romans 9:5 King James

That's not the KJV, it's the NIV. A better translation is "who is blessed of God over all."

5.”The life appeared, we have seen it and testified to it, and we proclaim to you the Eternal Life, which was with the Father and has appeared to us.” 1 John 1:2 King James and we are in him who is the true even in his son Jesus, He is the True God and Eternal Life,” 1 John 5:20 King James

Again, that's the NIV, which is an utterly atrocious translation. Compare to John 17:3. It's that we might know "him who is true," namely God, through Jesus.

6.”In the beginning, was the WORD, and the WORD was with GOD and the WORD was GOD Himself.” John 1:1 Amplified Version

Another atrocious translation, but even Daniel Wallace acknowledges here that it is not equating Jesus and God. Rather, it's a qualitative equation.

7.”And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness; GOD was manifested in the flesh.” 1 Timothy 3:16 King James

The word "God" does not appear in the Greek, and there's more than one way to translate this.

8.”and Thomas answered and said to him “ My LORD and my God,” Jesus said to him :Thomas because you have seen me you have believed,” John 20:28 King James

This is about the closest you can actually come in the New Testament to promoting the Trinity, but even here it's not identifying Jesus as God, it's just identifying him as a god (specifically the Thomas'). The rhetoric of this passage appears to have escaped you.

9.”for in him dwells all the fullness of the GODHEAD BODILY,” Colossians 2:9 King James “GODHEAD” {Greek-Theotetos}. In Thayers Greek page 288; The state of being God

Yeah, that's not what θεότητος means. It just means "divinity." You have to presuppose that God exhausts the category of divinity to insist it means "the state of being God," but you can't even begin to show that.

10.”who although being essentially one with God and in the Form of God {possessing the fullness of the attributes which make GOD GOD} did not think this equality with God was a thing to be grasped or retained.” Philippians 2:6 Amplified version

"Being essentially one with God" does not appear in the Greek at all, and the word that is translated "form" simply refers generically to physical form.

11.”Nor let us tempt Christ, as some of them also tempted, and were destroyed by serpents.” 1 Corinthians 10:9 King James

And?

12.”No one has seen God {referring to the Father} BUT GOD the One and Only, who is at the Fathers side has made him known.” John 1:18 New International {Jehovah GOD was seen many times by the people, so in them cases it couldn’t be the Father, {had to be Jesus who was seen and called Jehovah.

Or it can just be the anti-anthropomorphic inconsistency that everyone acknowledges it is. Also, your translation up there has nothing to do with the Greek. Where are you getting this garbage?

“Moses and Aaron, Nahab and Abihu, and seventy of the Elders went up and saw God of Israel under his feet was something like pavement made of sapphire, clear as the sky it self, but God did not raise his hand against these leaders of Israelites, they saw God, and they ate and drank,” Exodus 24:9-11

“at this point the men turned from there way to Sodom but as for JEHOVAH he was standing still before Abraham….then JEHOVAH went his way when he had finished speaking to Abraham.” Genesis 18:22-33 New World Translation Genesis 18:2 says three men appeared to Abraham, two are identified as angels {Genesis 19:1} ONE IS IDENTIFIED AS JEHOVAH GOD Genesis 18:1,3,13,14,17,20,22,26,27,31,32 and 33

For more on anthropomorphism and its mitigation in the editing of the Hebrew Bible, please see my Oxford master's thesis, "Anti-anthropomorphism and the Vorlage of LXX Exodus."

the biblical use of the word "firstborn" is most interesting. It can mean the first born child in a family (Luke 2:7), but it can also mean "pre-eminence." In Psalm 89:20, 27 it says, "I have found David My servant; with My holy oil I have anointed him...I also shall make him My first-born" (NASB). As you can see, David, who was the last one born in his family was called the firstborn by God. This is a title of preeminence.

No, this is an adoption formula that is parallel to the procreation metaphor in Ps 2:7. בכור means "firstborn." Read the Septuagint translation. For more, see the discussion in Peppard, The Son of God in the Roman World, 105-06.

Gen. 41:51-52, "And Joseph called the name of the first-born Manasseh: For, said he, God hath made me forget all my toil, and all my fatherï's house. And the name of the second called he Ephraim: For God hath made me fruitful in the land of my affliction" (NASB)

Jer. 31:9, "...for I am a father to Israel, and Ephraim is My firstborn (NASB)."

I don't see what you're getting at here. Jer 31:9 is using a familial metaphor.

[_Mittens]

So maybe you could go to the reformed Egyptian and tell me why the Book of Mormon teaches the same thing about Jesus being God

Mosiah 3:5 For behold, the time cometh, and is not far distant, that with power, the Lord Omnipotent who reigneth, who was, and is from all eternity to all eternity, shall come down from heaven among the children of men, and shall dwell in a tabernacle of clay, and shall go forth amongst men, working mighty miracles, such as healing the sick, raising the dead, causing the lame to walk, the blind to receive their sight, and the deaf to hear, and curing all manner of diseases.


3 Nephi 19:
18 And behold, they began to pray; and they did pray unto Jesus, calling him their Lord and their God.

Mosiah 5:15 Therefore, I would that ye should be steadfast and immovable, always abounding in good works, that Christ, the Lord God Omnipotent, may seal you his, that you may be brought to heaven, that ye may have everlasting salvation and eternal life, through the wisdom, and power, and justice, and mercy of him who created all things, in heaven and in earth, who is God above all. Amen.

An abridgment taken from the Book of Ether also, which is a record of the people of Jared, who were scattered at the time the Lord confounded the language of the people, when they were building a tower to get to heaven—Which is to show unto the remnant of the house of Israel what great things the Lord hath done for their fathers; and that they may know the covenants of the Lord, that they are not cast off forever—And also to the convincing of the Jew and Gentile that Jesus is the Christ, the Eternal God, manifesting himself unto all nations—And now, if there are faults they are the mistakes of men; wherefore, condemn not the things of God, that ye may be found spotless at the judgment-seat of Christ.

Translated by Joseph Smith, Jun.

2 Nephi 26:12 And as I spake concerning the convincing of the Jews, that Jesus is the very Christ, it must needs be that the Gentiles be convinced also that Jesus is the Christ, the Eternal God;

[_maklelan]

So maybe you could go to the reformed Egyptian and tell me why the Book of Mormon teaches the same thing about Jesus being God

Because Smith was influenced in the early stages by certain Protestant theologies.

Oh, and feel free to respond to the rest of my post when you can. I'll wait for you to do so before we move on. Would hate to move too quick and give everyone the impression that you're just cherry picking the issues to which you're responding.

[_Mittens]

So maybe you could go to the reformed Egyptian and tell me why the Book of Mormon teaches the same thing about Jesus being God

Because Smith was influenced in the early stages by certain Protestant theologies.

Oh, and feel free to respond to the rest of my post when you can. I'll wait for you to do so before we move on. Would hate to move too quick and give everyone the impression that you're just cherry picking the issues to which you're responding.

So that's why the Book of Mormon agrees with early stages by certain Protestant theologies

[_maklelan]

So that's why the Book of Mormon agrees with early stages by certain Protestant theologies

Yeah. Can you engage the fact that the earliest parts of the Pentateuch date to the eighth century BCE and the latest parts date to after the exile? No, I don't think you can. Can you engage the fact that in the gospels Christ undeniably thought the world was going to come to an end within only a few years after his ministry? I don't think you can. Can you engage the fact that the Bible is demonstrably self-contradictory and mistaken in many places? I don't think you can. It seems to me that you spend a whole lot of time trying to find ways to trip up Mormons using historical and textual criticism, but you would plug your ears and run like a squirrel if anyone used the same methodologies to show your own religious tradition is based on even more lies and manipulations. Go ahead and prove me wrong, though.

[_Mittens]

So that's why the Book of Mormon agrees with early stages by certain Protestant theologies

Yeah. Can you engage the fact that the earliest parts of the Pentateuch date to the eighth century BCE and the latest parts date to after the exile? No, I don't think you can. Can you engage the fact that in the gospels Christ undeniably thought the world was going to come to an end within only a few years after his ministry? I don't think you can. Can you engage the fact that the Bible is demonstrably self-contradictory and mistaken in many places? I don't think you can. It seems to me that you spend a whole lot of time trying to find ways to trip up Mormons using historical and textual criticism, but you would plug your ears and run like a squirrel if anyone used the same methodologies to show your own religious tradition is based on even more lies and manipulations. Go ahead and prove me wrong, though.

I'm afraid your doing the predictable thing Satan did when he wanted Eve to question God's word and then said you can be a god. Both lies Mormons have been taught to accept as TRUTH. They have replaced God's Word the "Bible" with there Joseph Smith teachings found in the triple combination.

[_maklelan]

I'm afraid your doing the predictable thing Satan did when he wanted Eve to question God's word and then said you can be a god. Both lies Mormons have been taught to accept as TRUTH. They have replaced God's Word the "Bible" with there Joseph Smith teachings found in the triple combination.

Thanks for proving me right.

[_Mittens]

I'm afraid your doing the predictable thing Satan did when he wanted Eve to question God's word and then said you can be a god. Both lies Mormons have been taught to accept as TRUTH. They have replaced God's Word the "Bible" with there Joseph Smith teachings found in the triple combination.

Thanks for proving me right.

You're probable in the Guinness's book for being wrong so often

[_maklelan]

You're probable in the Guinness's book for being wrong so often

Brilliant.

[_Mittens]

http://www.mormoninfographics.com/

Mormons down to the T