Why did the Covid vaccines fail?

[Binger]

Holy hell, Binger is so stupid he believes the Lancet has no credibility because Bill Gates helps fund it. The Lancet has been the preeminent medical journal for roughly two centuries. But because of Bill Gates donating, the Right Wing's boogeyman, Binger just waves it away as some kind of Liberal propaganda!

Findings

Although reported COVID-19 deaths between Jan 1, 2020, and Dec 31, 2021, totalled 5.94 million worldwide, we estimate that 18.2 million (95% uncertainty interval 17·1–19·6) people died worldwide because of the COVID-19 pandemic (as measured by excess mortality) over that period. The global all-age rate of excess mortality due to the COVID-19 pandemic was 120.3 deaths (113.1–129.3) per 100 000 of the population, and excess mortality rate exceeded 300 deaths per 100 000 of the population in 21 countries. The number of excess deaths due to COVID-19 was largest in the regions of south Asia, north Africa and the Middle East, and eastern Europe. At the country level, the highest numbers of cumulative excess deaths due to COVID-19 were estimated in India (4·07 million [3·71–4·36]), the USA (1·13 million [1·08–1·18]), Russia (1·07 million [1·06–1·08]), Mexico (798 000 [741 000–867 000]), Brazil (792 000 [730 000–847 000]), Indonesia (736 000 [594 000–955 000]), and Pakistan (664 000 [498 000–847 000]). Among these countries, the excess mortality rate was highest in Russia (374·6 deaths [369·7–378·4] per 100 000) and Mexico (325·1 [301·6–353·3] per 100 000), and was similar in Brazil (186·9 [172·2–199·8] per 100 000) and the USA (179·3 [170·7–187·5] per 100 000).

So I was wrong, since I said the real death toll could be double the official number and the Lancet article says it is likely more than triple.

Binger is making much ado about the fact that the article he deems worthless is accurately stating the obvious fact that there can be no 100% certainty as to the exact number of people who died directly from COVID infection and how many died for other reasons. We already knew this as it was common sense that people were dying of COVID early on before we had provided testing. Without testing there is no way to know who has it. Duh! But testing was scarce because Trump didn't want people tested. He was just trying to get you to vote for him again.

But you don't go from 5.9 million official deaths to over 18 million because of external factors alone. The most obvious explanation for the excess deaths is that we couldn't keep track of all the people who were dying from COVID. This is especially true in other countries like Brazil where testing wasn't really available to anyone unless they were really sick and being hospitalized.

Oh for chrissakes.

So still ranting about covid deaths but can’t distinguish them from pandemic deaths? Great! Thanks Gates!!!!!

[honorentheos]

oh look! Another covid vaccine fail.

into the garbage it goes.

https://Twitter.com/ClayTravis/status/1 ... _kifMIyFPA

We're still waiting for you to explain how it failed the first time. You should really pace yourself with these self-owns.

Clay Travis???

You're kidding right? Sports journalist turned MAGA Moron is someone you follow on Twitter!

I'm shocked.

Go ahead and explain for us how an overproduction of doses before they expire is somehow a "vaccine failure"?

And why a panel at Davos that Culty hates from May is being quoted in August on Twitter like it is news...

[Binger]

oh look! Another covid vaccine fail.

into the garbage it goes.

https://Twitter.com/ClayTravis/status/1 ... _kifMIyFPA

We're still waiting for you to explain how it failed the first time. You should really pace yourself with these self-owns.

Clay Travis???

You're kidding right? Sports journalist turned MAGA Moron is someone you follow on Twitter!

I'm shocked.

Go ahead and explain for us how an overproduction of doses before they expire is somehow a "vaccine failure"?

No. I do not follow Clay Travis. Do you?
If 30 million things are made and thrown away because no country can be convinced to take them, that is a failure.

[honorentheos]

We're still waiting for you to explain how it failed the first time. You should really pace yourself with these self-owns.

Clay Travis???

You're kidding right? Sports journalist turned MAGA Moron is someone you follow on Twitter!

I'm shocked.

Go ahead and explain for us how an overproduction of doses before they expire is somehow a "vaccine failure"?

No. I do not follow Clay Travis. Do you?
If 30 million things are made and thrown away because no country can be convinced to take them, that is a failure.

The metrics on supply and demand flipped around March/April 2022 when those willing to get the vaccines had gotten them and those who weren't, weren't. The statement in May at Davos was in the context of vaccine refusal as an issue. The vaccine is against COVID-19, not idiocy, so it's hard to say the vaccine is a failure due to a different dysfunction. Conspiracy brain is, unfortunately, resistant to most forms of treatment.

[Binger]

No. I do not follow Clay Travis. Do you?
If 30 million things are made and thrown away because no country can be convinced to take them, that is a failure.

The metrics on supply and demand flipped around March/April 2022 when those willing to get the vaccines had gotten them and those who weren't, weren't. The statement in May at Davos was in the context of vaccine refusal as an issue. The vaccine is against COVID-19, not idiocy, so it's hard to say the vaccine is a failure due to a different dysfunction. Conspiracy brain is, unfortunately, resistant to most forms of treatment.

In April 2022 the economics flipped? What?

Maybe that was when most transmissions were among the vaccinated.

Do you have a theory that believing in conspiracies is a brain illness? What leads you to spread such a theory, hono? Is this theory shared amongst a group?

[honorentheos]

The metrics on supply and demand flipped around March/April 2022 when those willing to get the vaccines had gotten them and those who weren't, weren't. The statement in May at Davos was in the context of vaccine refusal as an issue. The vaccine is against COVID-19, not idiocy, so it's hard to say the vaccine is a failure due to a different dysfunction. Conspiracy brain is, unfortunately, resistant to most forms of treatment.

In April 2022 the economics flipped? What?

Maybe that was when most transmissions were among the vaccinated.

Do you have a theory that believing in conspiracies is a brain illness? What leads you to spread such a theory, hono? Is this theory shared amongst a group?

Sorry. I thought I had made a comment to a person who was functionally literate. Turns out, not so much. I'd try to explain the point to you but I honestly doubt it matters. You and your word game posting behavior. Someone should figure out a model for succinctly describing it.

[Doctor CamNC4Me]

You and your word game posting behavior. Someone should figure out a model for succinctly describing it.

A verbal tesseract?



- Doc

edit: WAIT. “TikTok Vomit”

[¥akaSteelhead]

Disposal of product with a hard expiration date based on over generous model projections - does not equal "failed vaccine".

As 70 somedd percent of the populace is now vaccinated - the vaccinated are a supermajority. Bulk numbers - well they will now be in the majority of bulk populace metrics, you have to look at the per capita numbers to see the picture.

Per capita the unvaccinated are dying 8:1 over the vaccinated.

[canpakes]

Per capita the unvaccinated are dying 8:1 over the vaccinated.

Here’s a thought. If that difference is - as Binger suggests - due to missed attribution to things like suicide and auto accidents, then vaccination would seem to confer the additional benefit of making literal millions of folks happier, better drivers.

Win-win. Vaccine success.

[Res Ipsa]

When you make up criteria for success on the fly, you end up with nonsense like citing doses discarded as equaling failure. The world could have minimized the discarded number of doses by deciding not to make enough doses to go around. If the shortage is big enough, very few doses would be discarded. We could even have reduced the number of discarded doses to zero by not making any vaccines at all. Under Binger's newest criteria for "failure," making no vaccines would be a complete success!

Here's an article from WebMD which discusses the discarded doses:https://www.webmd.com/vaccines/covid-19 ... -us-report

The article makes several significant points. First, the percentage of doses discarded is in line with other mass vaccination programs. The reason is simple: the purpose is to get doses into as many arms as possible as quickly as possible. At the beginning of the vaccine program, no one knew which vaccines would work and which wouldn't, so a number of efforts to create a vaccine went forward. As no one knew at the beginning which would succeed and which would fail, targeting X % of the population would make zero sense. One failure of a vaccine to reach the approval stage would mean a shortage of vaccines -- exactly the opposite of getting doses into as many arms as quickly as possible.

The article also reminds the reader of some of the distribution issues with the RNA vaccines: as Yaka stated, they have hard expiration dates. They also have to be refrigerated, meaning that doses that, for whatever reason, could not be properly refrigerated had to be discarded. Finally, the vaccines came in multi-dose vials that had to be administered fairly quickly. As stated in the article, if they have to open a new vial for the last appointment of the day, they have to discard all the other doses. Also, early on in the U.S., vaccines were restricted to certain groups. Even though the demand far outstripped the supply at that time, doses would have to be discarded if there weren't the right number of eligible people who came in on any given day. You may recall stories of people being invited off the street at the end of the day, eligible or not, to avoid wasting partially used vials.

Given the storage and use requirements of the RNA vaccines, together with the nature of mass vaccination campaigns, it's not surprising at all that large numbers of doses had to be discarded. To claim this represents "failure" of the vaccines is nonsense.

With hindsight, there are a number of things that could have been done better with the vaccine rollout. Hindsight is 20-20, especially when what is being criticized was done on an emergency basis. Demanding perfection in emergency response is also nonsense.

To the extent there was a "failure," it was the MAGA crowd getting into bed with the anti-vax crowd. That's not a failure of the vaccines. That's political and opinion leaders politicizing a public health issue for $$$ and votes.